24FPS

ww you do? keep tha' 993 n.a. or still go tt-awd?

curious with a lot of guys leaving the n.a. crowd for tt's... b/c they're seeming to become more & more affordable, etc...

would you consider keeping a nb rwd & upgrade your n.a. to a 4.0 / 400hp plus beast?

also Q: wouldn't the nb n.a 's be very agile & light thus faster on a track etc... w/ an upgrade like this ?

-starting to have fantasies of an 'rs clone' w/ a 4.0!!! imagine even the sound...

i for one would be interest in enhancing the perf. of my cab... had thought sof a 3.8... but the numbers are not worth the dead presidents.

thoughts?

tia

RallyJon

You bet. From what I've read, though, the 4L kits are not reliable. Have you heard/experienced otherwise?

ca993twin

400 HP out of even a 4 liter, NA, air-cooled engine is quite a trick. Not impossible, but many, many dead presidents. Remember, we have only SOHC and two-valves per cylinder. We don't have water cooling to help keep the temps under control. We don't have any variable valve timing. And to do this with any reliability and emmisions legality? Quite a trick. Quite an expensive trick.

A fully laden, AWD 993TT is 3309 pounds. Simply getting rid of the AWD, dumping the mufflers, and swapping the seats can get you close to 3000 pounds. I'm not sure a similarly lightened NB will be any faster on a track, and the TT has huge potential for more reliable HP. Especially compared with a Cab. IMHO.

chris walrod

The easiest engine work is in the gearbox -- regear that thing and you'll be surprised at the difference!!

Father of 3

I'm waiting for my syncro to go then I'm coming over to your house Chris!

chris walrod

bring her over, we'll kill two birds with one stone - I'll go out by myself and take care of that syncro, and then we'll get her done

RallyJon

You build gearboxes, Chris?

Geoffrey

My answer is "it depends" on how you obtain 4.0l and who is producing the kits. I would never do the 104mm bore kits for the cooling issue identified above. I would install the larger stroke crank available from 9M along with their specific rods which allow for clearance of the oil pump without modification AND are longer than stock rods which help with the poor rod to stroke ratio. Having used 9M parts, I would not hesitate to try the crankshaft and had it been available a year ago, it would be installed in my engine now. The cylinder head temps I'm seeing with 3.8l are well under what I see with a stock 993tt under boost, so I believe that while the air cooled engine is far from ideal, a 4.0l N/A engine will not produce higher temps than a stock or near stock 993tt engine.

ca993twin

Chris,

Have you ever considered machining a "taller" ring and pinion for the turbo gearbox? No one makes one, and it should be simpler and cheaper (if somehat less custom tailored) than changing out a bunch of gearsets. You should be able to get pretty close to the taller Ruf CTR gear ratios with the right ring/pinion combo. I seem to have lost that Ruf gearset chart that someone posted... and I forget the stock ring/pinion numbers... 8/32?

oh... oops... sorry for the hijack. Never mind. We'll take this up in person.

chris walrod

Yes, but mostly sequential racecar gearboxes. I have only done a few G50's and a G64. It is still something I enjoy doing despite the work they require getting them really clean both inside and out

Its just a bummer that P-car gearbox parts are so expensive

Martin S.

I wouldn't cob up a 993 with a 4.0 motor...think of the reliability problems, smog problems...re-sale problems...Gott en Himmel! GT3 cars are in the $80's...what an incredible deal.

24FPS

thanks for the insight geoffrey... good points.

& i'd agree to a point martin.... had my eye set on maybe doin' a 997 gt3 next year... but i think it's going to be a while before one would become avail w/o paying a premium... & frankly i think some gt's will become available after a few suits realize what they've bought (as what happened w/ the 996 gt3).

next best thing i was thinkin' would be to find a 993 coupe & strip it down to nothing & build away... maybe put 30k into a 20-30 somethin' car... i'm thinkin' it would be a great track toy that i would not feel as sick bumpin' around in.

heard a little talk about the 4.1 litre thing @ callas last weekend & was excited about the prospects of a 993 na that would seriously kick some butt. thinkin' if i found a 'beater' 993 (as if their could be such a thing) that needed a top-end rebuild ............... why not build big.

no one finds that tempting?

& of couse i would gear it over @ chris's!!! btw: re: my daily cab w/ tip... could one mod a 996 5 speed tip-s to fit the 993? that would be amazing! was thinkin' it could be possible w/ the tt's getting the newer gt3 trans & such... no? sure one would have to write some software though...

Jim W

I like the idea and keep considering that kind of modification as well.. I wish we had access to sommeone who could 'tune' the cars after a 9m type upgrade. My practical side has kept me from pulling the tigger so far. I've already spent over $15,000 in upgrades and my fanatical side says what's $15,000 more.

Martin S.

4.1 liters would be fun...and it would be right if Tony built it...but I am think of the racing aspect. The car would have 500cc over stock displacement...it would run with some very fast cars, and probably be non-competitive, unless one went with the cajones to the wall approach...strip the car...etc., coil overs, gears, big wings...based on the 993 base points of 44, add 13 for going through Prepared and 13 V points for a total of 70 points. This makes a 4.1 liter 993 a V1 car....unless you dropped in the big bucks as mentioned above...the car would not be a factor in V1, IMHO of course.

With Porsche Owners Club, there are more and more GT3 cars coming out, some to time trial (aka Solo Sprint) and some to race. Think of the GT3 as a really fast spec series car....if I could just get wifey in the right mood...I'll could take another run at getting a GT3. I just couldn't sell her a few months ago, and I had an incredible opportunity to buy a GT3 at wholesale

I have had to fall back and re-group. The salve for my wounds, I got a 20 ft enclosed trailer from John Gordon Sr. to haul the 993 around...I also store the 993 in the trailer to keep the mice away, BIG problem when you live in the country.

TheOtherEric

I'd love to hear more about such a 4.0 upgrade. Of course racing it is out of the question then... But you'd have a wicked DE car. I'd bet 4.0 would make a lot more sense than a 3.8 upgrade.