Is the CL500 faster than my 96 993?
07-21-2006, 12:15 PM
#32
Rennlist Member
Straightline speed is overated. My S4 is faster straightline than the n/a 993 but guess which one is gathering dust at the moment.
HP wars: Resist the temptation! If anything, shed some weight off the car it'll improve straightline speed AND cornering.
That said the devil is in the back of my brain whispering: "TT, TT . . .".
And I answer back: "Get thee behind me, O foul One!"
HP wars: Resist the temptation! If anything, shed some weight off the car it'll improve straightline speed AND cornering.
That said the devil is in the back of my brain whispering: "TT, TT . . .".
And I answer back: "Get thee behind me, O foul One!"
07-21-2006, 12:32 PM
#33
Rennlist Member
Some driving observations of my 993 versus my wifes MB E500 4 matic:
Acceleration: The 993 which is slightly modded (grunt wise) is slightly quicker than the E500 but not by a appreciable amount.
Cornering: Not even close. The MB has some upgraded Brabus parts (suspension and brakes) and is a total pig compared to the 993. With the suspension upgrades on the MB for what it is it handles quite well and has "reasonable" road feel, I'd say on par with a BMW 3 series with sports package. It still falls waaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyy behind even on mild twisties and goes through turns 8-10mph slower than the 993.
Braking: While the MB/Brabus brakes are quite effective it doesnt even come close to the 993's brakes in terms of stopping distance and especially feel. The MB just feels like a boat anchor was dropped out of the window. The 993's feel like a boat anchor was dropped but you get feedback and know whats going on.
Noise: In the MB you hear NOTHINGin the 993 as I have it you get a terrific growl. Even my kids prefer the 993, the only time they want to go in the MB is for long trips because it has a TV for them in the back.
AWD: The Porsche system I think is far more effective than the 4Matic system, imho. I can get away much quicker in the snow than the MB, perhaps thats down to favorable weight distribution as it relates to initial traction.
Comfort: This is the prickly one.... in the 993 I never get tired at the wheel simply because I always feel so connected and the car tells me whats going on. In the MB I find myself "nodding off" on longer drives. Even on longish trips (300 miles or so) I feel the same getting out of the 993 as I do the MB. Although I cant say the same for any passengers.
Granted many of these viewpoints are highly subjective and I'm preaching to the choir here and will get few if any objections. However I will give you two reasonable points of reference. I have a brother in law who has a Dinan modded 2005 M3 convertible w/SMG which I drive fairly often against him at an industrial park "loop" that we time ourselves on. We both have a feature on our head units that times the loops as well as gives feedback on g-forces (lateral, accel/decel, etc.) and my 993 routinely laps this 1.25+/_ loop 2 seconds faster while achieving .15 higher g's on cornering and braking and nominally higher g's accelerating. Sometimes I drive his, he drives mine and I get basically the same times out of his M# as he does and he's slightly slower in my 993 than I am. I put that down to being more familiar to the 993 characteristics and the BMW being fairly benign on the limit. Lastly, I routinely encounter the same knucklehead in a heavily modded Mustang GTon my way into work who always is aching to "race" me. However, everytime he follows me into a reducing radius cloverleaf which I enter at 64mph and exit at about 58mph he quickly fades in my rear view mirror and cant catch back up.
So what the "moral" of all the stories here? Fast is a relative term. Fast in most/all conditions is the most important thing. Look at this years F1 cars they are as fast as last years with 250 less hp simply becasue they are better balanced and can take turns far faster (yes, I know some of that extra speed through turns is partly due to stickier tires).
Acceleration: The 993 which is slightly modded (grunt wise) is slightly quicker than the E500 but not by a appreciable amount.
Cornering: Not even close. The MB has some upgraded Brabus parts (suspension and brakes) and is a total pig compared to the 993. With the suspension upgrades on the MB for what it is it handles quite well and has "reasonable" road feel, I'd say on par with a BMW 3 series with sports package. It still falls waaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyy behind even on mild twisties and goes through turns 8-10mph slower than the 993.
Braking: While the MB/Brabus brakes are quite effective it doesnt even come close to the 993's brakes in terms of stopping distance and especially feel. The MB just feels like a boat anchor was dropped out of the window. The 993's feel like a boat anchor was dropped but you get feedback and know whats going on.
Noise: In the MB you hear NOTHINGin the 993 as I have it you get a terrific growl. Even my kids prefer the 993, the only time they want to go in the MB is for long trips because it has a TV for them in the back.
AWD: The Porsche system I think is far more effective than the 4Matic system, imho. I can get away much quicker in the snow than the MB, perhaps thats down to favorable weight distribution as it relates to initial traction.
Comfort: This is the prickly one.... in the 993 I never get tired at the wheel simply because I always feel so connected and the car tells me whats going on. In the MB I find myself "nodding off" on longer drives. Even on longish trips (300 miles or so) I feel the same getting out of the 993 as I do the MB. Although I cant say the same for any passengers.
Granted many of these viewpoints are highly subjective and I'm preaching to the choir here and will get few if any objections. However I will give you two reasonable points of reference. I have a brother in law who has a Dinan modded 2005 M3 convertible w/SMG which I drive fairly often against him at an industrial park "loop" that we time ourselves on. We both have a feature on our head units that times the loops as well as gives feedback on g-forces (lateral, accel/decel, etc.) and my 993 routinely laps this 1.25+/_ loop 2 seconds faster while achieving .15 higher g's on cornering and braking and nominally higher g's accelerating. Sometimes I drive his, he drives mine and I get basically the same times out of his M# as he does and he's slightly slower in my 993 than I am. I put that down to being more familiar to the 993 characteristics and the BMW being fairly benign on the limit. Lastly, I routinely encounter the same knucklehead in a heavily modded Mustang GTon my way into work who always is aching to "race" me. However, everytime he follows me into a reducing radius cloverleaf which I enter at 64mph and exit at about 58mph he quickly fades in my rear view mirror and cant catch back up.
So what the "moral" of all the stories here? Fast is a relative term. Fast in most/all conditions is the most important thing. Look at this years F1 cars they are as fast as last years with 250 less hp simply becasue they are better balanced and can take turns far faster (yes, I know some of that extra speed through turns is partly due to stickier tires).
