Well, if you have another daily driver, I think you are way ahead of the game.
Put car on jackstands, remove engine. Remove intake/exhaust, cam towers and heads. Send the heads off to EBS in Reno, NV for new guides and perhaps even a three way grind. New gasket kit and the cost of valve guides are not that bad.

I had the same problem with my first SC.... snapped headstud. Next thing I knew I was teaching myself how to rebuild a 911 engine.

It's not that hard!

 

Yup, that is still in the works. I have a magic spreadsheet doing trying to capture all the costs of a rebuild. If I assume the cost of the parts and maching are the same in either case it comes down to the labor component. Here is some logic:

Usually a top end appears to be about 40 - 45 hours of mechanics time. The rates here in Vancouver range from $95CDN/hour ($78US/hr) to $75CDN/hr($61/hr). So the labour cost appears to range from $2500 to $3500US.

BTW the parts cost range from $1900 bare bone to $3800 including a RS clutch (yes, the slope!). Also there is about $1200 in machining (heads plut misc.) So we are already at $3000 without trying. BTW I am assuming a ring set and all new exhaust valves.

If I do it myself I will need some specialized tools, a parts washer and mabye an education. So it goes like this:

1 - Engine stand, specialized wrenches, chain holders, barrel nuts, etc. $500
2 - Parts washer, calibration of my torque wrenches, ring holders, misc $300
3 - Bruce Anderson's course in engine rebuilding $1100

Okay, so I am in $1900 in the hole just to start. While you can argue that the top end can be done without Bruce's course I am not that confident. Maybe I should be. So the difference is between $600 - $1600 to get it done with a warranty. ANd I need to find 80+ hours of my time to do it.

The upside of doing it myself it I will then have al lthe tools and if I have to do it again it will be cheaper...but the point is not to do it again!

For me the most scarey part of doing a topend is the cam timing. Since the 993's use friction fit and hydralic lifters I still do not have a good grasp on how its done, even after reading the shop manuals. I have Wayne Demsey's 911 Engine Rebuilding Book (very good read!) but it only covers engines to 1989.

I have priced out the parts and have a good grasp of the costs there. I need to how shop around for mechanics to see if I can find someone who would be willing to either give a better deal or just help on the actual rebuild. Removing. and installing the engine is a snap so I can handle that. Most mecanics will not do partial work because of the implied warranty.

Anywhere that is where I am now. If the focus is to sell the car it makes more sense to get it done...the warranty is a selling point. I think most p-car purchasers would shy away from a DYI rebuild. I would unless I really know the guy.

Cheers,

Mike

 

Are you chasing the valve guides due to not "smogging", passing emmissions?

Andy

 

Mike,

I feel for you. I got my RUF and in 18 months, had to do a ton of work on it. In my case, I am keeping the RUF under any circumstances so I just closed my eye and wipped out the plastic. I did keep track of EVERTHING that is done and it is painful to look at. I can't offer you any recommendations as you are in a bad fix. Also agree that the tools budget is pretty crazy. Even DEVEK had to borrow the cam tool to set my cam.

As for the leaking targa roof. That sucks double as you are in the Pacific NW. Boy, that's just tough.

Whatever you do, good luck with your outcome.

CP

 

I hear ya Mike,

I think if the roof wasn't an issue and if you lived in southern california (where I think there would be alot of helping hands) I think it would be worth tackling. You've certainly looked at all the costs involved in this, so I guess the next question (which is what your agonizing over) would be the cost to rebuild vs the hit to sell. They tool cost would be the deal killer for me. You'll never get those dollars back.

I'm sure with all the frustrations you've had, its hard to keep the passion going. They only way I rationalized my rebuild is to keep the car for a long time.

I wish I saw a happy ending in this for you......................?

Jeff N

 

Mike, check out the tech article I wrote on Pelican Parts while rebuilding my 911 motor. Read the section on cam timing. Although this is for a 3.0L motor, it may help you under stand what you're attempting to do in there.

The slippery slope is going to be the toughest challenge. You will have to fight the urge to do the "while I'm in there" bits.

B.A.'s course is not necessary at all. And you can get away without a fancy Porsche engine stand. I picked one up at a local Checkers and modified the tubes to accept the 911 engine studs.
You can cut corners where common sense allows.
I completely rebuilt my 911 motor with only a Bentley manual, factory manual, spec book and the advise from hundreds of online enthusiasts.

Here's the tech article:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarti...e_rebuild1.htm

 

Leland,

Man, that's pretty inspiring stuff! Before you tackled this major DIY project, did you consider yourself to be pretty mechanical? The reason I ask is because I'm not the most mechanical guy around (just ask wifey). The only thing I did to my Carrera was change the alternator & regulator.

But, I admit that once I learn something I can do it fairly well. I guess I need to start attending some tech sessions here in the South Bay.

Rich

 

No more mechanical than the next guy. The difference is I enjoy doing engine work. The motor I rebuilt in that article was my first engine overhaul. The guys on the pelican board were cracking up when it came time for me to do the final ignition timing. Some of them got a kick out of the fact I had done a complete rebuild (learned as I went) and didn't know how to use a strobe to time the ignition.
I am a visual learner... all the books in the world didn't help much until I had the parts in my hands and could see and feel how it all worked.

 

70,000 miles? I guess that's why low mileage cars command a premium.

 

i have heard of the sai ports being clogged in as little as 22k miles. i was told this by a mechanic at a local porsche repair shop when i was figuring out what to do about my sai ports.

 

Funnily enough my SAI ports are just fine (I checked them last week) and clear. Its the worn valve guides that are getting me. Suppose at 76,000 miles its longer than some on the list.

Boy would I be upset at having the ports cleaned at 22,000 miles!

Cheers,

Mike

 

"Boy would I be upset at having the ports cleaned at 22,000 miles!"
it is about 20k miles since my top end rebuild (due to sai) and if those sai ports get clogged in the next 2k miles i might just go postal ;-)

 

I am chasing them because of a rough idle and continues CEL triggers because of misfires. The car will not pass emissions this way. As well, I can't really enjoy the car since I am afraid to rev it up if the valve guides are really worn...I don't want to drop a valve!

Cheers,

Mike

 

you are really caught between a rock and hard place on this one...to sell it you need to fix it, and to keep it you need to fix it, but fixing it costs a rediculous amount of $. given that you are not happy with the top anyway -- and the engine is in the shape it is, if i knew of a dealership (or anyone else) that would take it off my hands for a reasonable amount of $ i would unload the car...and then go get a my95 coupe...no worries about the targa leaks or the 96+ sai hastle.

 

The cost of ownership is an intangible thing for a sports car. People usually have more into the car than they think when you consider gas, insurance, and interest on the loan.

If you truly can't afford the cost, then you have to let it go. On the other hand, if everything is just a mental landslide, then you should go do something fun to get your mind off of it. An attitude adjustment can put things back into perspective.

Good luck with whatever you decide and follow your heart!