okindao

New pads, bedded them properly ( i thought) on the 180 mile drive to Mid Ohio from Cincinnati

Brakes even after hot make more noise than is bearable on every application of the brake , even after 12 laps just as noisy as on the first lap. The high pitch of the squeal is truly unreal. The breaking strength seems good in that they were consistent and strong but the noise is beyond unbearable.

One of the drivers said if the pads were not bedded properly this would happen and the resolution is to sand paper the pads down.....

Any help would be much appreciated, I already intended to switch back to street pads on threat of divorce from the wife once i got the car home....but other entrants said they could hear me at the end of the front straight each lap....short of giving earplugs to all any ideas ????

Thanks in advance

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

Hi Dennis:

As you now have learned, real race pads are not usually used on the street for such reasons,....

I would tell you that if you didn't install a fresh set of Factory anti-vibration dampers, almost everything will be noisy so its a prerequisite for race pads to help keep them quieter.

Last, rotor finish and wear play a large role in each brake's vibratory signature so if your rotors have some taper wear or grooving on the surface, that aggravates the propensity to squeal.

Bottom line: My advice is to leave the race pads at the track and use street pads for the rest of the time. If your rotors are worn somewhat, they will help generate noise. Use new factory anti-vibration dampers and that will quiet them as much as is possible.

Hope this helps,

Arrwin

Steve,

At what point would you replace the rotors? Are there any sure signs that replacement is imminent? (ie. consistent squealing, deep grooves).

okindao

Steve,
thanks for the quick reply, frankly do not know if dealer installed factory anti vibration dampers, will call them in the am, rotors were replaced end of last season so should be fairly new......

thanks again for the quick reply and help

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

Arrwin:

Rotors need to be judged on their own merit; i.e., inspection. I measure the thickness at the outer edge and examine the overall number and depth of the grooving to determine whether new ones should be installed. Its an "experience" sort of thing,...



Dennis:

Please let me know what you find.

Arrwin

As always, thanks Steve!

George A

Dennis, sorry to hear about the noise. I know the high pitch squeal you are talking about, but it usually goes away after about two hot laps. What was the weather like?

One thing you might try is doing a couple of hard braking attempts (down to ABS) to see if you can knock some of the dust off.

George

TheOtherEric

Dennis,
I assume you followed CF's bedding procedure; i.e. several 90mph - 50mph braking reps in succession. I don't remember exactly but I think it's on their web site. I ran the same pad last year (stock calipers) and this year (big reds) and the squeal on the street is simply unavoidable. Mine squeal on the track if I'm not braking hard or if they're still cold. Are you sure you're braking hard and gettign the brakes hot? (sorry, I don't know your skill level)

If you do much city driving, then you'll want to swap pads before/after every track event. It simply comes with the territory. I like to tell the story of how a pedestrian on the sidewalk last summer ducked and started running for cover as I applied the brakes approaching a stoplight slowly. Yes, they really do scream.

Oh, and assuming you do swap pads regularly, you should a) throw out the damper pads, and b) snip off and tie together the leads of the brake pad wear sensors. Those 2 things makes swapping pads a lot easier (40-minute task).

okindao

Steve,
you indicated that adding the anti vibration damper pads will help aleviate the squeal, not being the most competent dyi will that add a big degree of diffculty when swapping out the track pads for street ones when back home ???? also approximately how much are they ????

still waiting to hear from dealer but I do not think they used them

TheOtherEric- i do think i am getting them( intermediate driver) hot but realsitically my lap times are about 1:57 with only 8 breaking points all the way around but the noise level was just as loud on lap 13 as the first, i do think they are getting hot and the temperature was about mid 70's

Thanks to all of you for your suggestions and ideas

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

Dennis:

Those damper pads make a very big difference, especially with race-type pads but they are a real PITA when one wants to swap pads. In short, its not practical.

Thats why I tell people to use race pads on the track and street pads for the rest of the time,......

Some dealers/shops do not install new ones at pad time and thats their BAD. Its one of the biggest reasons why one hears brake noise complaints.

okindao

Steve,
I confirmed that the dealer did not install the vibration damper pads( probably my bad as i did not instruct them to ), so i am going to swap the race pads myself for the street pads and then prior to the next de in eom July have the dealer put back in the track pads WITH the vibration damper pads to hopefully limit the high pitch squeals !!!!

Once they instal the vibration damper pads are those attached to the track pads ??? if so shouldn't it be no big deal to swap the pads myself back and forth if both sets of pads have the dampers ????? Trying to save a few bucks by doing it myself but i am not that mechanically inclined !!!!!!

thanks for the help and info on this

Steve Weiner-Rennsport Systems

Hi Dennis:

The anti-vibration damper pads have self-adhesive backs and get firmly stuck to the backs of the brake pads. When the pads wear down a bit, one can pry each set of pads out with these pads intact if you are patient.

The caliper pistons will need to be carefully pushed all the way back to reinstall the pads.

riviera 93

I have had simular noises from hawks, pagids etc. as mentioned the rotor surface plays a very large roll, I recently replaced my front rotors (for vibrations) and most of the squeeling (street driving) has diminished. On a whim I dropped the old rotors of at a reliable Machine shop (for giggles) and they machined them smooth again! Minor cracks still remain but they too are diminished.
Oh I don't have any noise dampers or spiders installed, but cleanliness is important too!

Jeff96-993

Hi Dennis, sorry I missed this thread until now. It was great to see you at Mid-Ohio last month. My next event will be Putnam in July so I'm sure to see you there.

If you'd like I can help with your problem... first, I have a set of damper pucks laying around here somewhere. You're more than welcome to them. I don't use 'em, and just swap street for track and back for every event. The swap is not difficult, but the pucks and the wear sensors have to go if you want to eliminate a significant amount of frustration during the change-over.

If you'd like to go through the exercise I'd volunteer my garage and time to walk you through it... just let me know and we'll find a time. If we shoot the breeze a lot it will take a couple of hours at most to complete the swap.

okindao

Hi Jeff, good to see you last month

thanks for the offer, my concern is that without the damper pads the noise is unbearable, i was planing on switching back to the street pads which i have the dampers for, after i switch back to the racing pads for Putnam and if i do not use the damper pads will experience the same squels which are beyond describing.

what part of town are you in ???? please e mail me at dennisokin@fuse.net with phone info and i will call,
thanks again for the assitance offer

Dennis