vuugti

Interesting comments guys. I "understand" the Honda thing, my 02' Civic SI is my commuter car ! Hah! It really is a fun little car, that's where it ends. I thought about having my girlfriend learn to drive on a track with it. Very stock except for suspension and wheels.

FWIW, I tried to get some intelligent answers from a site dedicated to the EP Civic....uhhhhh, talk about immature. All they flame you with is more power....ah, ah, ah. They are consumed with making their little Civics Viperkillers.

I have resorted to doing nothing more than searching the site for useful info...very little!

As for the racing thing, don't take it personnel, just don't give them the satisfaction, they mostly despise us anyway.


Cheers,
Andy

96C4S

Ur right steve its not a big problem the young guys some times yap but they have a deep respect for our cars. With maturity comes the need for finer things and a 993 is just that. But to say muscle cars are junk or rice rockets are'nt worthy is not right either a true car guy can appreciate all forms of automobiles beauty is in the eye of the owner.

garychios

So my 993 convertible should be able to beat a SS? Not for nothing, I have seen my car on the dyno and the SS. Do you seriously think the SS will not beat a 993 CAB as the poster stated? The SS has 100 additional WHP than a 993 NA.

Lets come to the real world.. The one we live in that does not rotate around "e-numbers" or "e-figures".

I dynoed 245 WHP so my car seems healthy. I have a few mods and the car is quick. The last SS on the dyno put waay over 355 with a filter and exhuast. Not for nothing, the HP to weight ratio is all sales mumbo jumbo. You guys forget all about torque, which the SS rules on with its additional litres. On the street, its all BS. The SS beats an M3 hands down, and the M3 beats a 993. So with all this said, a NA 993 is not going to beat a SS. Sorry to blow up the spot. I do and know real numbers. Not internet BS with guys who never even been to the track, none the less race on the street (Acting dumb) and braging about fantasy racing.

Again, this is about NA 933's. Not turbos and not race cars. Street driven cab. Remeber the post.

Also, for all of you who think jap cars are ricey, I have one for you if you think you can hang. Ill give you a 1/4 mile start for a mile race.

graham_mitchell

What the....?

The SS has 40hp more at the crank, so probably 30-35hp more at the wheels.

There's no point in comparing non-stock cars.

garychios

The SS is underrated for what ever reason from the factory. GM has been doing that a lot lately. Also, the SS was stock except for airfilter from KN. The exhaust was not put on yet on the first dyno pull. The car was in for some mods. Also the SS makes 100 additional foot lbs of torque than a 993.

Jagbuff

[QUOTE=toddk911]Excellent info Graham. I use that same approach when my "muscle car" buddies try to start slamming my car.

They get real quiet when I show them that most Porshe models, especialy with a few light mods, make 100 per liter. IN my case over 100 per liter. Then I ask them to shut their pie holes till their 5/5.7 Liter is making 500+ hp AND a daily driver.

They usally quiet down after that

QUOTE]


...sure and after you leave they probably say that there is no substitute for cubic inches...and that their $25k Detroit Iron can still wax your $50K supped up Beetle

Come'on, you are either a sob or a fool, these guy are approaching the 100hp/liter - look at the upcoming Z06, still $10Ks cheaper than the basic 997, if your buddies slap on a supercharger and they can easily get to that 100hp/l. Also, I'd like to know what you mean by a few light mods... BTW, .. with a few light mods on my Ferrari I was able to get 200hp/liter - can you please shut you pie hole till your car can match that!

garychios

The new Z06 is hot. Lots of power and performance. Like I said though, no one looks at litre per HP, because the turbo imports have us covered on that. When we talk lite mods we are talking air filter etc. Last time I checked a Ferrari lite mods was thousands of dollars. Basically not lite on the wallet. LOL. I am starting to realize a few Porsche owners are very ignorant around here. if you want to put $$$ into the equation, the Viper is the best bang for the buck with an added supercharger. Go visit the Viper forums. Most have 700-1000 BHP beasts. Bottom line is, a NA cab did not beat a SS Camaro on the highway. Period. We should all come down for a reality check.

I would like to remind everyone, I have a 993, and love it. I am not biased though. I have been in tons of fast cars, and the 993 NA is not considered fast by anyone in the racing scene. It has a unique feel to it which people love.

Also, I would love to see this 200 Hp per litre ferrari. LOL

vuugti

Gary you weasel....400+ posts man I have been away for some time. Good to see you chiming in.

For those who don't know Gary he is knowledgeable. Just in our breif hour mtg I know he's no BSer.

Good luck Gary stay in touch.

Andy

agdamis

Guys,

I can not believe we are still on this topic! There are very many nice and capable cars out there made in different parts of the world. All of us plunked (and continue to plunk) our hard earned money on Porsche because they spoke to us. They stirred an emotion. What car can say that after forty years of the same basic design it can still be one of the most competitive, capable and beautiful on the street. I bought mine because I love that the engine is in the back, it has a beautiful sound, it does not use water to cool itself and excites my senses in everyway. Because when I go around a corner at speed on road or track I am challenged and inspired. As far as the Camaro SS and the Jap thing are concerned these automobiles do not even deserve mention on our board they are fun teenager cars or daily commuters for some of us. Their sole purpose is to go straight fast which is not real driving (short of competitive drag racing). Both these cars lack character and finese which is what makes a car great. To illustrate my point let us look at the original Mini Cooper. Not the fastest, nor the most capable in any one department but damn it, it is still a magical car that will remain in history. If we want to look at our competition from the US, Japan, Italy and Germany itself we need to look at cars which I like to refer to as "serious cars" or "athletic" or "serious athletes". GM has one in the form of the formidable and very well priced new Z06 (first time I ever considered a Corvette). From Japan the NSX and Skyline. From Italy well there is too much to list and Germany BMW would lead strongly a slew of great cars as well. Sorry for the long winded note but when we discuss serious cars let us discuss serious cars. Richard the next time a teenage punk attacks you in a staright line laugh it off and hope that someday he or she sees the light and is able to appreciate what it is you are experiencing.

toddk911

"Come'on, you are either a sob or a fool, these guy are approaching the 100hp/liter - look at the upcoming Z06"

New ZO6 is 6L, and still FAR shy of 600 hp. You know, when I make points and/or discuss one's intellegence/knowledge, I certainly make sure I know what the hell I am talking about before hand, so I don't look like jsut another guy that parks his Ferrari in front of Starbucks and just leans on it.

And as far as dollar for dollar, I paid $7,500 for my car and maybe $1,500 in total mods. So 10K total and I am approching the 100 hp/tq per CYLINDER (330hp/360tq). So that ZO6 would need to bring 800hp to the table and do it for even 15K....NOT. Oh, it's 944 Turbo, not 993/996. As with the 993/996 then yes, price/cost would be a bigger issue.

"sure and after you leave they probably say that there is no substitute for cubic inches...and that their $25k Detroit Iron can still wax your $50K supped up Beetle "

They do until I say, "fine grab your keys and let's go prove it"

And in terms of new muscle, dollar for dollar, the new Mustang Cobra is the winner. not only in stock form, but b/c it is forced induction, we all know it is very cheap and easy to make much more then the factory. It is 390 rated, but about 360 at the wheels from those that have dyno a bone stock model. 2K and you are well over 500hp.

cabrio993

THANK YOU!!!! Well said...

96C4S

Gary said it best porsches are great for roundy round but you cant beat american muscle for raw power. I own the best of both worlds. I say bye bye to zo6 in my area on a regular basis but not in a 993.

Jagbuff

try this link www.ferrarigto.com - btw, I lied about the "light modifications"....

96C4S

87 grand national 10.70 at 132 with a/c still funtional

Jagbuff

.. read my post - I didn't claim the Z06 made 100hp/l I stated that it is getting there... 84hp/l is not too shabby for a US car, and a low boost superchager should get it the extra 20% increase to the 100hp/l mark... and I thought that we were discussing 993s... sure a 944 turbo can be tweaked, heck I venture you can get 150hp/l pretty cheap at least for that one dyno run...

As for my questioning your intelligence (and BTW the way I meant to call you a snob not a "sob"...that would be very rude!), I don't know you so it is hard to support my position. However, on your argument about specific output made little sense.. So what if your 3L engine makes 100hp/l, your buddies are still better off with their 8 liter Viper engine that does only 60hp/l....

Your comment about me posing in front of Starbucks with my Ferrari made me smile and I don't taking any offense - I am sure the "mullet wearing redneck" that drives a Camaro thinks exactly the same thing when he sees you pulling up in your shiny Porsche to get your Latte ....