Helmets in cars equipped with airbags...you will be surprised to learn that..
02-17-2005, 12:15 AM
#1
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Helmets in cars equipped with airbags...you will be surprised to learn that..
SCCA recently issued a statement..."It has been brought to the attention of SCCA Technical services that the use of full face or closed face helmets while driving vehicles with active air bag restraining systems may result in injuries in the event of a crash that deploys the airbag. Because of the location of the steering wheel relative to a driver's position, the air bag axis is on a level with the driver's chin."
"In a crash with an airbag deployment, contact with the chin area of a full face helmetcan be so powerful that the risk of fractures to the jaw cannot be ruled out." (Herbert Gramling, FIA Institute, FT3/AF, 18.5.1999.) This applies to vehicles that may be used in Solo, RallyCross, High Performance Car Clinics, etc.
Therefore, it is highly recommended that full-face helmets not be used in vehivles with functional airbag systems. Potentially more restrictive language is currently being considered for 2005 which could appear in an early 2005 issue of "Fastrack." If you have any questions please contact the SCCA at 800 770 2055.
The above information is from Grassroots Motorsports, Page 88, Volume 22, Number 2, April 2005.
If this is the straight scoop (Why would they lie?), is an open faced helmet with a HANS device...about a $1,500 investment...the best way to set up the SRS equipped car?
"In a crash with an airbag deployment, contact with the chin area of a full face helmetcan be so powerful that the risk of fractures to the jaw cannot be ruled out." (Herbert Gramling, FIA Institute, FT3/AF, 18.5.1999.) This applies to vehicles that may be used in Solo, RallyCross, High Performance Car Clinics, etc.
Therefore, it is highly recommended that full-face helmets not be used in vehivles with functional airbag systems. Potentially more restrictive language is currently being considered for 2005 which could appear in an early 2005 issue of "Fastrack." If you have any questions please contact the SCCA at 800 770 2055.
The above information is from Grassroots Motorsports, Page 88, Volume 22, Number 2, April 2005.
If this is the straight scoop (Why would they lie?), is an open faced helmet with a HANS device...about a $1,500 investment...the best way to set up the SRS equipped car?
Last edited by Martin S.; 02-17-2005 at 11:06 AM.
02-17-2005, 01:04 AM
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02-17-2005, 01:07 AM
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I just bought a Momo Mod .07 wheel and disconnected the airbag. If I tap something on the track, at the very least, I don't want to have to pay for getting the airbag stuffed back into the wheel.
02-17-2005, 05:19 AM
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Originally Posted by nile13
I think it's time to pull the bag and install Momo wheel (I've been planning it on my autocross car for a while anyway).
Right size and thickness. V Nice.
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02-17-2005, 09:27 AM
#8
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Originally Posted by Martin S.
If this is the straight scoop (Why would they lie?), it seems that the way to go is an open faced helmet with a HANS device...about a $1,500 investment...
Other comments...
Open face does not equal closed without face shield.
If you wonder how far you will move in a crash, try loosineing your 5/6 point belts. About a foot or so should be close to a 20-30g crash. 2 feet or so should approximate a 100g crash.
02-17-2005, 10:59 AM
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Note: I am just the devil's advocate here. I drive with a full face helmet and don't intend to throw it away. Possibly the best system for occasional track use, is to is to disconnect the SRS and use a full face helmet with a HANS device. Disaconnecting the SRS is not something that is easy to do as I understand it. I know you can buy a module that turns off the passenger side SRS, but don't know an easy way to turn off the driver SRS.
Mark writes, "I have not seen anyone suggest using a HANS with an open faced helmet.....well neither have I.
However we must remember that the DE driver, and or Time Trial participant, generally is not the customer for the HANS device...you only see it on drivers with dedicated track cars.
What about the DE driver, and or Time Trial participant driving a late model air bag equipped car, that is my concern, because in the final analysis, its all about me!
I know that the belts stretch in a crash...the scenario of being driven forward by negative G's and at the same time having the SRS bag going of in my face...
Mark writes, "I have not seen anyone suggest using a HANS with an open faced helmet.....well neither have I.
However we must remember that the DE driver, and or Time Trial participant, generally is not the customer for the HANS device...you only see it on drivers with dedicated track cars.
What about the DE driver, and or Time Trial participant driving a late model air bag equipped car, that is my concern, because in the final analysis, its all about me!
I know that the belts stretch in a crash...the scenario of being driven forward by negative G's and at the same time having the SRS bag going of in my face...
02-17-2005, 11:17 AM
#10
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I have to admit I'm somewhat skeptical of this announcement. Sure there are both pluses and minus to airbags. I'm reluctant to disconnect a proven safety device or go with less facial protection based upon such a vague and terse statement. Note the phrase "fractures to the jaw cannot be ruled out." To be sure, very few types of injuries in a crash can be "ruled out." It doesn't sound like people actually getting fractured jaws.
02-17-2005, 12:47 PM
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Au Contraire Martin,
I am purely a DE'r in a street car and I am going to be getting a HANS setup this year. We've kind of hashed this a lot over on the racers section. I think we have to just realize that when we compromise, we have to make out best educated assessment and go with the appropriate percentages.
Obviously the safest setup is a dedicated track car with a full cage, no airbag, a properly installed racing seat and harness and a HANS and perhaps a condom.
I am electing to use a harness bar and a HANS and a full face helmet and my airbag. Of course there are certain situations where this combination might cause me death or dismemberment. BUT, I think for the majority of unscheduled events that might occur to me, I'll be better off.
It's a bugger, isn't it!
I am purely a DE'r in a street car and I am going to be getting a HANS setup this year. We've kind of hashed this a lot over on the racers section. I think we have to just realize that when we compromise, we have to make out best educated assessment and go with the appropriate percentages.
Obviously the safest setup is a dedicated track car with a full cage, no airbag, a properly installed racing seat and harness and a HANS and perhaps a condom.
I am electing to use a harness bar and a HANS and a full face helmet and my airbag. Of course there are certain situations where this combination might cause me death or dismemberment. BUT, I think for the majority of unscheduled events that might occur to me, I'll be better off.
It's a bugger, isn't it!
02-17-2005, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Martin S.
Note: I am just the devil's advocate here. I drive with a full face helmet and don't intend to throw it away. Possibly the best system for occasional track use, is to is to disconnect the SRS and use a full face helmet with a HANS device. Disaconnecting the SRS is not something that is easy to do as I understand it. I know you can buy a module that turns off the passenger side SRS, but don't know an easy way to turn off the driver SRS.
Mark writes, "I have not seen anyone suggest using a HANS with an open faced helmet.....well neither have I.
However we must remember that the DE driver, and or Time Trial participant, generally is not the customer for the HANS device...you only see it on drivers with dedicated track cars.
What about the DE driver, and or Time Trial participant driving a late model air bag equipped car, that is my concern, because in the final analysis, its all about me!
I know that the belts stretch in a crash...the scenario of being driven forward by negative G's and at the same time having the SRS bag going of in my face...
Mark writes, "I have not seen anyone suggest using a HANS with an open faced helmet.....well neither have I.
However we must remember that the DE driver, and or Time Trial participant, generally is not the customer for the HANS device...you only see it on drivers with dedicated track cars.
What about the DE driver, and or Time Trial participant driving a late model air bag equipped car, that is my concern, because in the final analysis, its all about me!
I know that the belts stretch in a crash...the scenario of being driven forward by negative G's and at the same time having the SRS bag going of in my face...
Try www.airbagonoff.com
02-17-2005, 07:00 PM
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Mike,
that's the same wheel I installed. It is a bit smaller than stock and has a much better feel. I bought the part from www.airbagonoff.com to clear the airbag light. Will try to add the piece next week. According to Gert, a 2.8 ohm 1/2 watt resistor will do the trick. I tried it, but unfortunately it didn't work for me. Hopefully this part will do the trick (about $30 for the piece).
that's the same wheel I installed. It is a bit smaller than stock and has a much better feel. I bought the part from www.airbagonoff.com to clear the airbag light. Will try to add the piece next week. According to Gert, a 2.8 ohm 1/2 watt resistor will do the trick. I tried it, but unfortunately it didn't work for me. Hopefully this part will do the trick (about $30 for the piece).