Ray Calvo

I've posted my 993 vs. 996 impresssions before; might try digging them up if you want to.

Suwipin

Can I post a review about my 993 vs. my Atomic skis?

just kidding ...

Robin 993DX

Thanks for the contribution guys.

They are both added to the reviews section.

Thanks

B-Line

Hey Skip,

Thanks for the clarification. Now I understand why you opted not to keep the X5.
It is a little short on cargo room I agree. For my purposes though, it has always been sufficent.
But the only things I ever really pack into it besides production gear is 4 18" wheels with track tires and everything fits nice and cozy with a little manipulating and that's with the back seats up.
I can't really comment on your desire for a more aggressive acceleration from 70mph and up. The 4.4 amazes me everytime I hit the gas in that range. Most of the time I have to look down to realize I'm driving 110+. I am going to post a review some time this weekend. A 1997 C2S vs. the BMW X5 4.4.
I'd have to say that although they are completely different beasts, the X5 in many ways could give the 993 a run for it's money...
Guess I should post a review...
But you can read about that in my post later..
<img src="graemlins/xyxwave.gif" border="0" alt="[bigbye]" />
Hope to pass you soon!!!

Carboy

My 993 vs NSX vs Viper GTS vs M Roadster vs ZX6-R

Viper GTS
Incredible, literally explosive, instantaneous, rip your head off, (you get the picture) torque. When you drive around town you know you're the king of the road. You've got the performance every other car aspires to have and is measured by. However you also are surrounded by plastic, have a super long nose, and a feeling that you're driving something big. Handling is very twitchy although the limits are relatively high. Over 100mph on anything but a straight line is a sweaty palm experience. I had an exhaust so the sound was scary. It was like nascar somehow wandered out of pit area and on to the road. Everywhere you go is an event because the car is already a legend.

NSX
The Viper is a sledgehammer where the NSX is the scalple above all else. You feel like you are in a F1 car by the view of the road, lowness, high pitched sound at high RPM, steering, and how you can make the wheel sit between your legs. I've got Fikse FM/10 wheels and will be lowering it also. It takes bumps confidently and without a rattle or shake. No other car I've driven makes you feel like you are driving a go cart quite like this one. Perhaps the non power steering helps that feeling (pre-95). The steering is one of best I've seen. Over BMW and Porsche. This car seems to be the ultimate exotic, daily, track, even utility as I've hauled golf clubs in it. What it lacks is heritage. You still have to explain to people what it is although you get tons of looks and thumbs up.

993
My 993 is my first 911. I've had 944S2, 968, and 944 Turbo. I can see the addiction. It has a timelessnes and class that few cars can match. I sometimes wish for more power but when the curves come I forget about that. Every time I think the NSX is better, I drive the 993 and then it's in the lead. Both cars earn my love each time I drive them. The 993 has some SSR GT3 wheels, Techart spoilers and while it turns some heads it's nothing like the Viper or NSX. You feel smart behind the wheel of a 993 because you know it has nothing to prove. It's the best 911 ever made in my opinion. The NSX has a better ride but it hasn't been lowered like the 993.

M Roadster
I had a lot of fun with this car. It was a mini Viper in my book. I could sling the tail out at will and I would hold a drift for a block or so with the throttle and some steering. My Wife likes the M and 993 best. She felt the M was more toy like and it was. Top down and the deep exhaust was pure bliss. What I hated was the flex from being a convertible. Even after a strut bar it still did it. This the primary reason I got rid of it. I will be looking for the next one.

ZX6-R
This thing should be outlawed. 600cc sport bikes are not for the ignorant fearless. The bike will pull any car without sweating. In a sense it's safer than a car in that you can get to 160mph in a much shorter distance and therefore you aren't at high speeds as long. I'm not sure how long I'll have the bike as I'm more of a car guy and I don't want to spread myself thin with toys.

Summary
NSX and 993 are two of the best cars I've ever owned out of about 25 so far. There is nowhere to go from here but to 355 or Modena. If you've never driven an NSX go do it now. You'll have a new respect for Honda engineering.

Doug Malone

I attended Bobby Archer's racing clinic the other day. If any of you don't know, Bobby is a former Speedvision champ and he races Vipers. He and his teammate, Debra Loth, both are currently campaigning T1 Vipers. Needless to say there were seven Vipers at the school, two of them were trailered to the track with one being a TNT555, plus Debra brought her T1 Viper. My C4S was the only non-Viper; there was a Boxter scheduled for the class, but he didn't show up.

This was the first time I attended an instructional event and it was surely a humbling experience. Bobby also drove my car in addition to riding with me, and its amazing how fast he is, but makes it seem like he's out for a Sunday drive.

I also appreciated the comradery shown by the Viper guys, as I was thinking they would snub me and my P-car. They really praised the C4S and were surprised how fast it is. One of the Viper owners also brought a guest who is an expereinced shifter kart driver. He told me don't tell the others I said this, but I would much rather have your Porsche than a Viper.

In the afternoon, one of the Viper guys asked if we could swap cars, so here is my 5 lap compare of a Viper GTS vs C4S using a 10 pt scale:

Acceleration: This comes as no surprise, 3350 lbs, V10 with 410 RWHP, this is truely a rocket sled; but the thing that impressed me the most was the low end torque/power and how quickly you can accelerate out a very slow corner even in 3rd gear. I previously owned a 400 RWHP Mallett C5, and I was still surprised how much faster the Viper felt due to the low end power. Now if my C4S had another 100HP, shed another 150 lbs and had some RS gears this might have been a more interesting compare. Verdict: Viper 10, C4S 6

Handling: Well, I only did 5 laps in the Viper, but was surprised at how well the car handled, very flat with little roll and it went where I pointed it. However, it is still a big car to throw around and in comparison the C4S feels like a go-kart. Verdict: C4S 10, Viper 8

Brakes: The brakes on the Viper really did not give me much confidence to come into a corner fast, you really had to stand on the brakes and it was obvious that you were trying to stop a heavier car. When Bobby drove my car he said, boy, its obvious this car has brakes. Verdict: C4S 10, Viper 6

Styling: This one is very subjective, and beauty is in the eye of the beholder. The Viper is also pretty curvacious, and I suspect on the street it would turn alot of heads. These are both beautiful cars, so to be fair, the Verdict: C4S 9, Viper 9 (we'll reserve a 10 for the Ferrari's)

Interior: Actually, I didn't focus too much attention on the Vipers interior, but it is very cramped, I didn't like the feel of the pedals, and there is a lot of plastic. I would not want to take a long road trip in a Viper. Verdict: C4S 10, Viper 5


Overall: I am very happy with the way the C4S performed, however, it seems that the Porsche would be a lot better with a nice 3.8L upgrade, with an RS transmission/clutch/flywheel. The Viper owner walked away amazed at how good the Porsche is, especially the handling and brakes. Debra, also gave me a ride in her T1 Viper and it felt like an amusement park ride, WOW!!! After that I can't imagine what an F1 or Indy car would be like to drive.

Further, as others have said repeatedly on this board, the best investment anyone can make in their car is in the "nut" (Calvoism) behind the wheel. Bobby Archer's school was excellent and a great way to spend the day. I'm ready for more.


Doug



<a href="http://www.dmracing.cjb.net" target="_blank">D & M Racing</a>

Greg Fishman

The next generation Viper is going to have triple 500's 500bhp, 500lb/ft torque and 500 cubic inch displacement.

Come to one of the Viper Days events. Bobby and his whole crew are usually there to race and do track side support. I agree with you I have found most of the Viper guys to be very friendly.

<a href="http://www.viperdays.com" target="_blank">www.viperdays.com</a>

Several of us here will be at Mid Ohio and VIR. I will also go to a couple other events, Putnam Park and Nashville.

Greg

Flying Finn

Hello Robin,

It’s been a ‘while’ but here’s one more comparison to your ‘collection’…



1995 993 (Guards red, black) vs. 1974 911 (Guards red, black):

First of all, little about these cars since they're not stock: My 911 is originally -72, but it has -73 2.7 engine and -75 tranny.

Those OEM steel body panels and brakes aren’t stock (or 72) either, that why I call it ‘1974’.

It has probably the stiffest suspension there is, it's low, and it has little over 200 hp (registration says 227 but I can't say if it's true).

It's really loud (I love the sound!) and harsh.

I've tested it w/ my friend and his -00 Boxster, I was faster in straight line and in corners too, so this ain't slow 911.

My 993 is stock, except the Fabspeed Supercup exhaust (couldn't take that quiet stock sound...) and drilled airbox. It has factory sport suspension and seats.


Steering/handling:

Both cars handle really well, 911 is stiffer, which I like but 993 with sports suspension is stiffer than I though it would be.
911 is lighter and you can feel it.
It’s more tossable than 993 which isn’t bad either.
I think 993 suffers from US ride height, it’s too high (lowering is a must, for looks too). 993 handles better and is faster but 911 is little more fun because it doesn't have power steering, brakes and clutch.
It has that kinda raw feeling, which I like.

Advantage - 911


Brakes:

993 stops better and under heavy braking, it is more balanced, while 911 is not so easy (which I like though because it is good also).
Pedal feeling in 911 is slightly better (because of no power assist) and you have to use much more force.
Even though I prefer brakes w/out ABS and I like them heavy, this has to go to 993.

Advantage - 993


Sound (not stereos!):

You just can’t do Porsche comparison without this kind of category…

Both are really loud (I told you they're not stock).
911 has higher scream, while 993's tone is (especially in lower rpm's) lower.
But High revs really makes 993 scream like Porsche is supposed to!

Advantage - Overall, 911 - high revs, 993


Power:

993 naturally wins this one.
I've tested (with one of those G-meters) 0-60 times: in 993 it was 5.07 seconds, 911 (with hand watch) about 6.4.
Both cars have quite nice torque, which make them easy to drive out of corners. However, for both cars rpm’s need to be above 4000 rpm, that’s about the point when they come alive!
For cruising, below 4000 rpm, there is enough torque, but when you really start driving, you need to go higher.
One thing about engines: 911 with 2.7 liter engine and its throttle response… It’s just about the best there is, 993 comes nowhere near on this category.
With that heavy flywheel etc., for example, when revving in neutral, it takes quite long for engine to get those revs up and down while 911 barks like a dog!

Advantage - Overall, 993 – throttle response - 911


Gearbox:

As many knows, 911's (915) gearbox isn't the best there is, but I find it ok, once you get hang to it.
993's gearbox is a lot precise, I really realized this once I got used to it and maybe after 8 months, drove my 911 again...
However, gear ratios are much better in 911, it pulls just so nicely with all of those five gears.
993 (US model) gear ratios (some of them) are little far from each other; gap between 1st and 2nd is too big.
Of course, when driving over 220 km/h with 911, rpm's are already around red line, with 993, you got plenty to go (and it goes!).

Advantage - 993


Styling:

They're both great, 911 having (to my eyes), that 'real' 911 look which I so much like, it has that sort of 'old class' if you know what I mean. But I just love 993 too.
I think 993 looks better, but always when I look my 911, I'm just amazed how great it still looks in 2002!

Advantage - If I have to choose, 993. But I guess this need to be called a tie.


So, there it is. All I can say in the end is that they’re both such great and fun cars to own and drive!

Robin 993DX

FF,

Thank you for your review, it is now added to the p-car.com reviews page.

Flying Finn

No problem Robin,

Thank you for that awesome site of yours!