Georges Rebeiz

After changing my AC compresssor to a used one, my AC shop mechanic gave me the choice of either using R12 or R134a refrigirant on the system.

Knowing that the car comes with R134 ,I explained to him that it would be prefarable to use 134 . His comments were that using R134 was twice as expensive as R 12 and it is common on all cars coming with original R134 to be shifted to R12. but then the shifting back to R134 would be impossible.

I am a bit of a novice on this matter...What are your opinion as I have taken his advice and filled it with R12... Have I made a mistake that will cost me in the future ?? Should I empty it again and refill with R134??

Thanks for your suggestions

Rezal

I hate to tell you this but IMHO, you shouldn't have done it. Production of R-12 has ceased in industrialized nations due to its ozone damaging nature.

If you had Google'd, you would've found this website:
http://www.babcox.com/editorial/cm/cm50352.htm

You own a Porsche, and the AC rarely needs to be recharged, so pray tell why you decided to save a few pennies for the cheaper R-12?

As far as being "common" to shift to R-12, having grown up in a developing country, I can tell you that the mechanics there tend to be penny-wise pound-foolish, or alter factory specs, since they're convinced that foreign car companies are out to exploit the local by speccing more expensive products when cheaper ones are available. There's a little truth there (some folks in the US are adamant in sticking to the same type of tire that their car from the factory came with) but there's also a lot of snake oil in that advice.

Lastly, shouldn't you have consulted this board BEFORE accepting his advice?

Rick Lee

There is a world of info on this on Pelican. Some real a/c experts have written extensively on this and even on how you can substitute propane (super cheap) and get even better cooling. You can still buy the old refrigerant on the Internet and I believe you can take an online test to get EPA certified for buying the stuff legally on your own.

Paul M

Useless bit of info: I worked on the pilot plant that ICI built in the UK to develop the Klea 134a refrigerant in the late 80's. At the time, they were in a race to get the thing patented and on line. It was the first ozone friendly refrigerant.

seege

I think refrigerant costs depend on where you're buying them-I recently redid the system on my old Astro work van here in California and I paid $50 a pound.... I think its heavily regulated here and thus more expensive.

Georges Rebeiz

Guys ,Guys....

So that there is no misunderstanding.. I did not shift to R12 for economical reasons.. I just listened to my mechanic(Who is very eco friendly..)


I have remorse now as I understand how r12 is depleting the ozone layer and I wish people in this part of the area would become more eco friendly and especially our governments.

Now ..My question is that ..What would happen if I need to go back to R134a?? Should I change anything? until I have another issue with the AC do you think it is dangerous to keep R12 in the system?

Randall G.

Wow, that's weird being asked to swap from R-134a to R-12 (and not the other way around). The R-134a equipped 993 AC works just as good (if not better) than the R-12 equipped early 964. At least it does in most of the world--is it possible Lebanon is so hot that it's an exception? In the US, you would be crazy to swap from R-134a to R-12, considering the cost of R-12.

When shifting from R-134a to R-12, you would need to change the oil (entire system evacuated) and the receiver-drier. The oils are not necessarily compatible, same for the receiver-drier. There are also fittings on the compressor that have to be changed out.

To convert back, you would need to do the same thing = change-out the receiver-drier, evacuate the system, add R-134a compatible oil, change the compressor fittings to R-134a types. This is a common operation on early 964s, and cost me a total of $260 (parts, labor, R-134a) two years ago.

Good luck!

Mike1982

What I have heard is that R-134 is actually cheaper where I went but I also heard that R-12 cools better. I stayed with R-134 when I got my system changed out, compressor and all!

Georges Rebeiz

Very strange that R12 is much more expensive than R314...Here in the third world countries R134 is twice the price of R12... So everybody uses R12..Even second hand cars coming from the EU are recharged with R12 instead of R134...It is a pity..Insn't it

pjc

Randall,
your right - but in this case I doubt the wrench did change the oil, seals etc.

Georges,

I think if you change back quickly no harm done.

PJC