Viken (whom I trust on all Porsche-related matters) posted the following response in one of the other threads:

Viken, would you care to elaborate? I hadn't read these reports. I'd heard one reference to the S0-3's being "rubbish" on one of the other mailing lists.

I just bought a set of S0-3's. So far, so good, but I haven't had a chance to break them in.

Just curious....

-- Melissa

 

Hi Melissa,

See if you can try the tires on a track. I've been on SO2 Pole Positions previously, and was not impressed. I'm currently on Pirelli P-Zero's, and will try them on the track next week. Hopefully they'll work well!

 

I am trying to find a post that is on another list I am a member of regarding S-02's v S-03s

Basically, there is someone on list who works for Avon tyres, he posted results that their lab boys carried out on leading brands (eg S02's & S03s) v their ZZ1 tyres.

The results were that the S-03 gave up some of it's ultimate grip over the S-02 in return for a reduced wear rate.

If I find the post, I will put it up here..

Regards
Eric

 

Melissa,

When I refer to a "street" tire's performance, I usually am mostly concerned about its ability to grip in dry conditions and provide maximum performance on a sports car that is not heavily modified. I am not concerned about ride quality and noise.

I don't have direct experience with the S-03PP but I ran two sets of Pirelli's P-Zero Giallo Asimmetrico’s (treadwear rating 140) on my Carrera 4S for over 4 years before I thought I should try the infamous S-02 (treadwear rating 140) which everyone raved about so much. The P-Zero was a maximum performance "street" tire in every way. It was even great in the rain. When I switched to the S-02's, I lost a good chunk of steering response feel and ultimate grip at the limit. While the P-Zero felt precise and predictable, the S-02 feels wishy-washy and less predictable. The ride quality and noise levels were about the same.

When Bridgestone introduced the S-02PP (treadwear rating 180), it was marketed as a higher wearing and longer lasting performance version of the S-02. Soon, many found out that it was a good tire for a performance sedan but did little to satisfy the sports car driver. The S-02PP was quickly discontinued in favor of the new S-03PP, which has a treadwear rating of 220. Judging from that alone, one would think that this tire is designed for even more comfort and less performance. However, tire technology may have come a long way and manufacturers might very well be finding ways to make a tire grip well and last longer. This combined with the newer cars’ high-tech chassis and suspension components might very well provide higher levels of performance.

From the latest reports, it appears that newer maximum performance tires are not as good as their predecessors in ultimate grip. The new Michelin Pilot Sport is not as good as the old MXX3. The new P-Zero Rosso is not as good as my beloved P-Zero Giallo. The new S-03PP is reportedly a lesser performer than its predecessors. This is very unfortunate because some of us drive their cars a bit more aggressively than others. Soon, we will have to resort to more expensive R-compound tires.

 

Viken,

Thanks for your very detailed and informative response. See, I knew I was right to respect you!

I replaced my ContiSports with the SO-3's, so I'm a happy camper so far. I didn't like the ContiSports -- to me they felt imprecise and sluggish. Keep in mind that it was my subjective opinion -- I don't have any quantitative numbers to back me up.

I will be using these tires on the street and at a few autocrosses. Since I don't have a rollbar in my cab, I really don't feel like it's smart for me to do DE's. I did a Tracquest event, since they don't require rollbars, and had a blast, but I promised myself that if I did another track event, I'd put a rollbar in.

Oops, I'm rambling. Anyway, for my purposes, I'm guessing that the SO-3 will be fine, albeit pricey. Oh well, the $$'s already spent.

Thanks again, Viken, for elaborating.

-- Melissa

PS How come the replacement tires just aren't as good as their predecessors. Let's see, we lost the BFG R1, the Michelin MXX3, the P-Zero Giallo, and now the Bridgestone SO-2. What's up with that?!

 

Blame it on various government mandates requiring certain fuel mileage and noise limits to say the least. However, I would put the most blame on individuals who complain about a performance tire's relatively short life. They want fast, economic and comfortable cars and Porsche is providing.

 

Viken,

Are the Pirelli's P-Zero Giallo Asimmetrico’s still available? What do you use on a day to day basis now?

 

Yes, they are.

Presently, I am still riding on the soon to be replaced S-02's.

 

thanks Viken. One little question - do you use the:

- Directional Front-Asymmetrical Rear
or the
- Asymmetric Front and Rear

configuration? In the UK the roads are often wet and twisty, so I would assume the Directional Front / Aymm rear config would suit best. Any feedback would be appreciated.

Rob

 

Rob,

I have the P-Zero Asymmetric Front and Rear combo (Asimmetrico) and would use it on the UK twisties too though my experience in your wet twisty roads is not that extensive and not in a Porsche. I dont like what I read about the Directional Front-Asymmetrical Rear combo. Also the Directional PZEro system seems more appropriate for a rear wheel drive car in the wet - maybe the one I was driving in the UK, though even then, I did not miss it at all.

BUT, the Asimmetrico on both front and rear, for me, works fine especially with the AWD in the TT. In fact, given the AWD system, I would not want to consider any further compromise on the sporty character of the car.

Now what is Giallo (means yellow right? as distinct from Rosso?) I just have Pirelli PZero Asimmetrico. If that is something totally different from "Giallo" then please disregard my info.

 

You should use the Asimmetrico all around. For whatever reason, manufacturers find the mixed set with the Direzionale more suitable for mid-engine cars such as the Boxster.

 

The plain P-Zero as we know it, was internally referred to as the Giallo (yellow) version. I am using the term now in order to differentiate it from the newer Rosso (red) series.

 

Since I'll be looking for new tires for my Boxster (street tires that are good for the track) soon, care to elaborate on this further? I've been running on S02s, but I'm thinking either Kuhmos or the Yokohamas, Steve Alarcon told me they were coming out with a new tire that looked good. Heard anything about it?

Thanks sharing your extensive knowledge,
Pat

 

Pat,

Are you looking for a street tire or a DOT legal R-compound tire? If it is the former, you can't beat the P-Zero. As to R-compound tires, the 17" Kumho V700 Victoracer is the best bang for the money. For an 18" R-compound tire, the only one available at this time is the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup which is great but expensive.

 

Viken, I have the Giallos on my 993 now. The front set has 18k miles and still shows 3/4 tread, the rear has 5k miles (second set on the rear). My only complaint about the P-Zeros is lots of road noise. Do you have the same problem? Maybe it's just the nature of this beast.

Thanks,

John