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If the dealer is not opposed to an indy PPI, by all means, do it; especially when the asking price is at top chart territory. It's going to be >$60k out the door in any case so what's a few hundred more...
European Auto Techniks did mine. He talked me out of a compression/leakdown (against his own wallet), saying the car didn't need one. Looking back, he was spot on. Overall I was quite satisfied w/ the outcome.
If the dealer opposed an indy PPI, I'd walk. Period.
If you are experienced, which sounds like OP, then the drivability and obvious rust hot spots can be checked by him
With a PPI, however the car will be put on a lift - tech can inspect for obvious things like torn boots and potentially expensive repairs like steering rack leaks. They can do a compression/leak down which can be some nice peace of mind. They can check belts and wires, inspect plugs, brake pad and rotor wear, pull codes, check a paint meter and then provide a double check for all the body and drivability things that the OP would have already done.
It's hard (if not impossible) to do a lot of the above without a formal PPI.
I really don't see why you wouldn't do one, other than the cost. Even though it's a nice color and low miles - this is a Cab on the higher end of the price range and we're approaching Fall. It's a buyer's market IMO.
Great advice all. Thanks. Yes I detest those wheels and the goofy radio. It does come with the original stereo but not the wheels. The tires are five years old but have good tread - car only has I think 28K miles. Has a few paint scuffs and scratches. The engine cover shocks are dead. I'm not at all familiar with that end of Houston (Dairy Ashford/ IH 10) as to air cooled shops.
there’s a shop around the corner called Driversource. I’m not sure if they do PPIs but I take my 997 there for service and they’ve always done a great job
I've bought two 911s with "no PPI" other than my own inspection.
only surprise was a LSD rebuild needed on the GT3 = $1100.00
I had a PPI completed and they missed that the LSD was out and a bunch of other issues. I requested a refund .... that didn't happen. I believe the seller was as upset with the quality of the PPI as I was.
I purchased my 993 from across the country sight unseen without a PPI. I did speak to the indy Porsche mechanic that had just done an extensive amount of maintenance to the car and he assured me the car was in perfect mechanical order with just 17,xxx on the odometer... and did not need a PPI. My local indy spoke with that mechanic at length. When the car carrier arrived at my home in CT the car was in perfect mechanical order. It was not as perfect as the salesman promised cosmetically, as there were a few minor flaws that were not disclosed that should have been discussed. Fact is, as my brother pointed out, had we flown out to Cali to look at the car and seen the couple of scratches on the bumper and scuff on the driver's door mirror, I would have still purchased the car.... because it ran and drove beautifully.
My much trusted indy here in CT assured me that the minor cosmetic issues were insignificant compared to the car's excellent mechanical condition. That having been said, I learned never to trust a salesmen from across the country, because he was not honest about the condition of the paint and I was upset when I first saw the car.
Fast forward a year and a half. I'm thrilled with my car. All the little paint issues have been sorted out and it has several mods that I feel have made the car much more enjoyable. I got very lucky with my car, and all the things I worried about are now a distant memory. I have learned these cars are fairly robust, and I am not worried about 'breaking' or 'hurting' the car in some way by pushing it as it was meant to be driven. I've had enough work done that I no longer am worried I am going to find something undisclosed or wrong.
If I had to do it again, I would have MY mechanic go out to look at the car for me... even if it meant us taking a weekend trip to see it.
I really really wonder about a PPI, only because it is all based ENTIRELY on human behavior: the mechanic's thoroughness, expertise, their schedule, AND THEIR MOOD THAT DAY!
Yep, their attitude and mood when they're doing the job. Are they rushed? Do they think you're an idiot and know therefore that you won't know the difference between a good job and a bad one?
I could go on and on, and so could all of you.
But, here's the thing... Doctors and dentists are held to the highest possible standards, and yet, who has NOT had a physician or dental appointment where they felt the doc did not quite pay enough attention or listen well or who blew off one of your problems, or who was rushed because they were over an hour behind schedule? Guess what... this happens to mechanics too, and they do NOT have a hypocratic oath that oversees their practice and can be the basis for a lawsuit.
As an example, attached is the full PPI report that came with the 993 that I purchased. Note, there was no mention of the brakes/front rotors that had a considerable lip on the edge. There was no comment describing code check. There was no comment about worn interior parts and other discrepancies. There was no mention of a driving test - the car pulls to one side or another; nothing about shifting and possible synchro going out in 2nd, etc. The bottom line being that there was NO WAY to know what was tested, and what was not tested -- what they looked at or failed to look at.
And this was from one of the well-respected Porsche shops in the DC area.
...and this costed over $600. These guys are genuine smiley-faced scammers, who have gotten by because they have ignorant owners who blindly believe them because of their polished line of BS -- schmoozing owners as well as making them feel stupid.
Bad bad bad.
These are the same mechanics whose favorite line to customers is "Do you know the cheapest part of a Porsche? ... the owner! Ha ha ha" -- intended to belittle you (While the comment should be "Do you know the MOST EXPENSIVE part of a Porsche? ... THE MECHANIC!"
So, IF YOU DO GET A PPI, I suggest that you want to see their full PPI checklist beforehand, and tell them that you want their comments on every item in the list.
In this way, they are vouching for having checked everything on the list -- it is your minimum legal check on their veracity -- for $600!!!!
If they do not work from a checklist, then THEY ARE BS'ing you -- DO NOT LISTEN TO THEIR CRIES OF BEING VIRTUOUS! They're human, and they WILL forget/omit something, whether unintentionally or out of expediency (after all, they have "real work" awaiting them in the work bays).
Tell me I'm wrong.
Last edited by stasha; Sep 23, 2020 at 02:35 PM.
Reason: added pic
A really good source to start your own inspection, but not as a substitute for a PPI by an indy shop that knows 993's, is this little book. It's filled with walk-around inspections, checklists, known issues etc...
Had I used it on my first 993, with was a mail-order bride, I might not have been so disappointed on the condition of the paint (ugly PPF on 1/2 the trunk and mirrors), the interior, and some of the mechanical bits. Check it out!
I really really wonder about a PPI, only because it is all based ENTIRELY on human behavior: the mechanic's thoroughness, expertise, their schedule, AND THEIR MOOD THAT DAY!
Yep, their attitude and mood when they're doing the job. Are they rushed? Do they think you're an idiot and know therefore that you won't know the difference between a good job and a bad one?
I could go on and on, and so could all of you.
But, here's the thing... Doctors and dentists are held to the highest possible standards, and yet, who has NOT had a physician or dental appointment where they felt the doc did not quite pay enough attention or listen well or who blew off one of your problems, or who was rushed because they were over an hour behind schedule? Guess what... this happens to mechanics too, and they do NOT have a hypocratic oath that oversees their practice and can be the basis for a lawsuit.
As an example, attached is the full PPI report that came with the 993 that I purchased. Note, there was no mention of the brakes/front rotors that had a considerable lip on the edge. There was no comment describing code check. There was no comment about worn interior parts and other discrepancies. There was no mention of a driving test - the car pulls to one side or another; nothing about shifting and possible synchro going out in 2nd, etc. The bottom line being that there was NO WAY to know what was tested, and what was not tested -- what they looked at or failed to look at.
And this was from one of the well-respected Porsche shops in the DC area.
...and this costed over $600. These guys are genuine smiley-faced scammers, who have gotten by because they have ignorant owners who blindly believe them because of their polished line of BS -- schmoozing owners as well as making them feel stupid.
Bad bad bad.
These are the same mechanics whose favorit line to customers is "Do you know the cheapest part of a Porsche? ... the owner! Ha ha ha" -- intended to belittle you (While the comment should be "Do you know the MOST EXPENSIVE part of a Porsche? ... THE MECHANIC!"
So, IF YOU DO GET A PPI, I suggest that you want to see their full PPI checklist beforehand, and tell them that you want their comments on every item in the list.
In this way, they are vouching for having checked everything on the list -- it is your minimum legal check on their veracity -- for $600!!!!
If they do not work from a checklist, then THEY ARE BS'ing you -- DO NOT LISTEN TO THIER CRIES OF BEING VIRTUOUS! They're human, and they WILL forget/omit something, whether unintentionally or out of expediency (after all, they have "real work" awaiting them in the work bays).
Tell me I'm wrong.
Is that really all the info that was provided on the PPI?
A really good source to start your own inspection, but not as a substitute for a PPI by an indy shop that knows 993's, is this little book. It's filled with walk-around inspections, checklists, known issues etc...
Had I used it on my first 993, with was a mail-order bride, I might not have been so disappointed on the condition of the paint (ugly PPF on 1/2 the trunk and mirrors), the interior, and some of the mechanical bits. Check it out!
So -- quick update: After getting what I feel like was a great evaluation by a local shop the dealership refused to budge even one penny on their price. Car is fine overall - will need shocks, those wheels are hideous, but I could live with them for a while, has a small oil "seepage" on the right cylinder bank, stone guards shot, all hood shocks toast - a few thousand dollars to make right. Still solid but not "top dollar". So after paying for the PPI THEN finding out we're not negotiating at all I was miffed and won't buy from them ever. Voting with my feet. Search continues.
So -- quick update: After getting what I feel like was a great evaluation by a local shop the dealership refused to budge even one penny on their price. Car is fine overall - will need shocks, those wheels are hideous, but I could live with them for a while, has a small oil "seepage" on the right cylinder bank, stone guards shot, all hood shocks toast - a few thousand dollars to make right. Still solid but not "top dollar". So after paying for the PPI THEN finding out we're not negotiating at all I was miffed and won't buy from them ever. Voting with my feet. Search continues.
They figured since you already paid for the PPI, you'll be more pressured to follow through on the sale and not waste the money you've already committed.
FWIW, next time I would first settle terms on a sales price contingent on a clean PPI and then pay to get it done.
I agree with writing these guys off. Typical dealer.
Resurrecting this thread - I came across this thread and wanted to share my experience with this dealership in relation to this 993.
It seems like the salesman who I am dealing with uses high pressure tactics. He said the car would be sold before it would go down to the price I initially socialized with them... and guess what, the price has been reduced beyond that. He even discouraged me initially to do a PPI. They also could not confirm whether they applied a paint meter to the car.
It is really crappy that a dealership would not even replace the hood struts when they want top dollar. They bought this car at an auto auction FFS. Hood struts are what - maybe $100?
Resurrecting this thread - I came across this thread and wanted to share my experience with this dealership in relation to this 993.
It seems like the salesman who I am dealing with uses high pressure tactics. He said the car would be sold before it would go down to the price I initially socialized with them... and guess what, the price has been reduced beyond that. He even discouraged me initially to do a PPI. They also could not confirm whether they applied a paint meter to the car.
It is really crappy that a dealership would not even replace the hood struts when they want top dollar. They bought this car at an auto auction FFS. Hood struts are what - maybe $100?
Hood Struts are $55 and anything a dealership can pass on to the customer they will. It just eats into their profit margin.
