993 Cal. smog test problems, continued
#1
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
993 Cal. smog test problems, continued
A few weeks ago my '96 993 failed to pass the Cal smog test due to lack of information in the OBDII memory. I was told to go drive a few hundred miles and return for retesting (there are several posts about this issue).
Upon completeing the "few hundred" miles of driving, the car still did not have the OBD memory complete. Chris at Bauer Porsche repair here in Oakland confirmed the problem with his various computer tests (He is very helpful and knows his stuff), and suggested that I take the car to the dealer. The dealer was unable to confirm what was wrong and suggested that I leave the car for futher testing. I chose not to do that.
I decided to call the Cal DMV. After a long wait on hold I was told to call Cal consumer affairs. Again, after a long period on hold, I was told to call a smog referee. The women at the smog referee office knew what was going on as soon and I told her what year and make was involved.
She told me that there is a software error inthe Cal smog program (!!!!!) and that there is nothing wrong with my car. I was also told to make an appointment with the smog referee and that they will "bypass" this part of the test and that they will pass my car (the emission part of the test went fine). She also told me that they are working on a fix for the smog station software.
My appointment is April 7...I hope that she was correct......
Upon completeing the "few hundred" miles of driving, the car still did not have the OBD memory complete. Chris at Bauer Porsche repair here in Oakland confirmed the problem with his various computer tests (He is very helpful and knows his stuff), and suggested that I take the car to the dealer. The dealer was unable to confirm what was wrong and suggested that I leave the car for futher testing. I chose not to do that.
I decided to call the Cal DMV. After a long wait on hold I was told to call Cal consumer affairs. Again, after a long period on hold, I was told to call a smog referee. The women at the smog referee office knew what was going on as soon and I told her what year and make was involved.
She told me that there is a software error inthe Cal smog program (!!!!!) and that there is nothing wrong with my car. I was also told to make an appointment with the smog referee and that they will "bypass" this part of the test and that they will pass my car (the emission part of the test went fine). She also told me that they are working on a fix for the smog station software.
My appointment is April 7...I hope that she was correct......
#2
Nordschleife Master
There are several threads on this forum that confirm that she is indeed correct, at least partially. You will pass just fine. But the problem may not be with the DMV SW, but rather with the difficulty in the 993 computer to get the "readiness" codes set. The referee stations know about this, and you should have no further problems.
#3
Jeff:
Sorry in advance as this is a long reply ! I just completed the smog test on my '96 TT yesterday and I thought that some ideas and a summary might help you. Here is what I went through and was told throughout my "ordeal".
1.) The state (DMV, Air Resource Board, etc.) wants to collect a statistic on how many vehicles fail when just driven in for a smog test. No pretest, no adjustment, just drive in and test. This is why we have the "test only" requirement and specific "test only" stations many of us are facing and having to deal with. The problem here is that the ODB2 can fail you on an obscure technicality and no one seems to know what to do but go to the referee. The specific per vehicle are too varied to be generalized into the cottage smog testing industry. The early ODB2 cars were not intended to be tested this way!
2.) Unfortunately, when this idea was put into practice, some of the codes that are read as part of the OBD2 portion of the test would fail vehicles due to just "minor" code technicalilty such as having disconnecting a battery sometime since last cleared. The "readiness" codes on the MY96/97 Porsches are a good example of these technicalities caised from a battery disconnect. No "check engine light" as you drive in, yet you fail. With my car, the battery had been disconnected as one of the Litronics ignitors needed replacement. The "books" calls for the battery to be disconnected. Oops, readiness codes cleared !Simply having disconnected a battery recently will cause these codes to be flagged as "not passed" by the CA smog program. The thought here is that your vehicle fails for suposedly being not "ready" for a smog test because someone might have recently worked on / tampered with the car...UGH ! Basically, when the theory was taken into the real world, many of us got caught in this crazy dilemma of citizens beign used to collect sample data for the air resource board's agenda...or so I think! Remember, the idea is to see how many cars fail without a mechanic pre-testing and making adjustments before the "real" reported smog test.
3.) If someone knows the readiness code setting proceedure, it can be done in about 2 hours. YOu need methods of knowing the ODB2 load values and the correct timing sequence for setting the codes.
4.) All of this becomes more of a value of your time vs. money. Paying a good engine management tech to set the codes, or taking your time going to the referee. Either will work, boils down to your preference.
Basically. I tried to set these flags on my own having someone tell me a sure fire "method". No luck. Next I went to a dealer who had my car for two days. In the end they wnated to sell me a new ECU. Finally, I got hooked up with a tech who knew the proceedure and did the work properly. With that work complete, I passed at the amazement of the "test only" station tech. He already had the numbers of the referee station and the computer churned dialing into the state system.
If I had to do it again, I might just go the referee route. However, I now feel that I know the ODB2 ECU issues more than I likely wanted to !
$0.02 on this subject.
Feel free to PM me if you want any more of the specific details of the "readiness" code sets. I would post it but it would take way too much bandwidth for most. Likely a good DIY...gotta think some more about this!
Regards
Sorry in advance as this is a long reply ! I just completed the smog test on my '96 TT yesterday and I thought that some ideas and a summary might help you. Here is what I went through and was told throughout my "ordeal".
1.) The state (DMV, Air Resource Board, etc.) wants to collect a statistic on how many vehicles fail when just driven in for a smog test. No pretest, no adjustment, just drive in and test. This is why we have the "test only" requirement and specific "test only" stations many of us are facing and having to deal with. The problem here is that the ODB2 can fail you on an obscure technicality and no one seems to know what to do but go to the referee. The specific per vehicle are too varied to be generalized into the cottage smog testing industry. The early ODB2 cars were not intended to be tested this way!
2.) Unfortunately, when this idea was put into practice, some of the codes that are read as part of the OBD2 portion of the test would fail vehicles due to just "minor" code technicalilty such as having disconnecting a battery sometime since last cleared. The "readiness" codes on the MY96/97 Porsches are a good example of these technicalities caised from a battery disconnect. No "check engine light" as you drive in, yet you fail. With my car, the battery had been disconnected as one of the Litronics ignitors needed replacement. The "books" calls for the battery to be disconnected. Oops, readiness codes cleared !Simply having disconnected a battery recently will cause these codes to be flagged as "not passed" by the CA smog program. The thought here is that your vehicle fails for suposedly being not "ready" for a smog test because someone might have recently worked on / tampered with the car...UGH ! Basically, when the theory was taken into the real world, many of us got caught in this crazy dilemma of citizens beign used to collect sample data for the air resource board's agenda...or so I think! Remember, the idea is to see how many cars fail without a mechanic pre-testing and making adjustments before the "real" reported smog test.
3.) If someone knows the readiness code setting proceedure, it can be done in about 2 hours. YOu need methods of knowing the ODB2 load values and the correct timing sequence for setting the codes.
4.) All of this becomes more of a value of your time vs. money. Paying a good engine management tech to set the codes, or taking your time going to the referee. Either will work, boils down to your preference.
Basically. I tried to set these flags on my own having someone tell me a sure fire "method". No luck. Next I went to a dealer who had my car for two days. In the end they wnated to sell me a new ECU. Finally, I got hooked up with a tech who knew the proceedure and did the work properly. With that work complete, I passed at the amazement of the "test only" station tech. He already had the numbers of the referee station and the computer churned dialing into the state system.
If I had to do it again, I might just go the referee route. However, I now feel that I know the ODB2 ECU issues more than I likely wanted to !
$0.02 on this subject.
Feel free to PM me if you want any more of the specific details of the "readiness" code sets. I would post it but it would take way too much bandwidth for most. Likely a good DIY...gotta think some more about this!
Regards
#5
Just dont let them dyno your car. Even the guys at the referee station wanted to dyno the car. I had to show them the owner's manual that this was a 4WD car.
The Emissions book that they use is completely bogus as it does not show a dyno exception for 96-98 turbos.
The Emissions book that they use is completely bogus as it does not show a dyno exception for 96-98 turbos.
#6
Rennlist Member
Not so lucky in San Diego!
I just got back from the (@Miramar College) BAR referee. He ran a smog check and told me that my car (computer) wasn't ready. And to go drive it some more. I think that most agree that, that won't work. Including the local stealership, that quoted me $375.00. to put the car in readyness state. BTW, it passed with 0 flags in '09. That was only a little over 1K miles ago. But I had to put a new battery in it about a month ago........... You know the rest of the story.
#7
Rennlist Member
This a repeating problem for OBD2 cars. Couldn't this problem be avoided by ensuring continuity of current. I have a 12V battery pack, the one with the light, compressor and jump leads, all in one box. When I replaced the battery on my Audi A3 last week, I clamped the jumper leads to the pos and neg terminals before removing the leads from the bad battery. Installed new battery, reconnected the A3's cables and removed booster battery. No resetting of the ECU, radio or other problems. Job done.
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#8
Rennlist Member
Basically. I tried to set these flags on my own having someone tell me a sure fire "method". No luck. Next I went to a dealer who had my car for two days. In the end they wnated to sell me a new ECU. Finally, I got hooked up with a tech who knew the proceedure and did the work properly. With that work complete, I passed at the amazement of the "test only" station tech. He already had the numbers of the referee station and the computer churned dialing into the state system.
Regards
Regards
Is the method used by your mechanic have to do with hooking up to the ecu and making changes?
#9
Rennlist Member
I just got mine to show all of the readiness codes/flags last night. I had to do the BMW driving sequence four times. I know that I messed up the first one and maybe the second one too. But even after completing the fourth one, which I felt was perferct, after the 5 minute idle the codes were still inc. As the were when I checked them 5 hours later. However after driving home and parking, about 3 hours later, when I moved the Targa back into the garage, BINGO! All present and accounted for. INMHO, the key is, choosing your route, being smooth, treating the times as minimums and the speeds as absoulute maximums. Even then it's still not easy. My wife and I have done a few TSD rallyes and it's kind of like that. But on my last try, it was just me and a kitchen/egg timer! I drove to work, let it sit for ~5 hours and then did the drive. Off to the smog station today!
#11
Nordschleife Master
Does Autozone still read codes for free? if so, I would think they can tell you if your codes are set.
Where are you in sunny So Cal? I have a 9180 that will read the codes and tell you if they are set or not.
I am in the South Bay (Torrance) area.
Where are you in sunny So Cal? I have a 9180 that will read the codes and tell you if they are set or not.
I am in the South Bay (Torrance) area.
#12
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Glad to hear your success Craig. I have done the drive cycle thing several times. Sunday mornings at 5 AM is the best time to do it. I start out on the shoulder of the freeway. If you get stopped by the CHP just tell them you are have engine trouble.... not too far off.
#13
Rennlist Member
Thank you. Yep, officer Friendly pulled up beside me while I was doing the 5 minute idle at the end of the test. I told him that "I was running a little hot". Which was true, because the codes had not set yet. ;p