Oil Level Sender
08-20-2018, 09:15 PM
#1
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Oil Level Sender
Hello guys! Need advice por favor. I have a couple of issues, the car i mean... my wife and kids say i personally have way more. Any who, I have this quite typical one with the oil temp needle erecting intermittently... but a couple of taps on the glass it goes back down to normal. However, the oil level one always sits on the bottom. I check the dip stick with motor running and at operating temp and level is good. The questions:
- the intermittent oil temp needle erecting is caused by some poor contact on the board, am i correct on this one? Any DIY solution or Hollywood Speedo is a bit simpler route.
- The oil level gauge, from what I've read it is not the gauge but most likely the oil level sender... is this correct? If yes, what is the likeliness of the level sensor going bad and the temp still works? Aren't they both managed by the same unit with the floater thingy?
Thank you in advance!
- the intermittent oil temp needle erecting is caused by some poor contact on the board, am i correct on this one? Any DIY solution or Hollywood Speedo is a bit simpler route.
- The oil level gauge, from what I've read it is not the gauge but most likely the oil level sender... is this correct? If yes, what is the likeliness of the level sensor going bad and the temp still works? Aren't they both managed by the same unit with the floater thingy?
Thank you in advance!
08-20-2018, 09:57 PM
#2
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I've never heard of an immediate erection described as a problem before, but...
No, I don't think the level gauge being low is a sender problem. "They all do that". Mine as many others, appear to operate for a short wile after an oil change, then sitting flaccid and unmotivated, while the dipstick is fully moist and glistening with fresh oily fluid covering its hard tip.
If you get this far, the oil temp needle just need the board re-solder. Zee VDO people just can't solder. That is my professional conclusion as a former EE and no amount of xenophobia accusations would ever change my mind on that one.
No, I don't think the level gauge being low is a sender problem. "They all do that". Mine as many others, appear to operate for a short wile after an oil change, then sitting flaccid and unmotivated, while the dipstick is fully moist and glistening with fresh oily fluid covering its hard tip.
If you get this far, the oil temp needle just need the board re-solder. Zee VDO people just can't solder. That is my professional conclusion as a former EE and no amount of xenophobia accusations would ever change my mind on that one.
08-21-2018, 02:53 AM
#5
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No. I'm a former engineer, with English not being my first (or second, or third) language. Now, what exactly made you uncomfortable?
08-21-2018, 02:56 AM
#6
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And now how about the oil level gauge? 
Do you think adjusting the floater position will help? I don't mind checking the dip stick once in a while, but i can't stop starring at the stupid gauge every time i take it for spin.
08-21-2018, 03:09 AM
#7
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yep that happens periodically!! is there a way to fix this? And now how about the oil level gauge?
Do you think adjusting the floater position will help? I don't mind checking the dip stick once in a while, but i can't stop starring at the stupid gauge every time i take it for spin.
And now how about the oil level gauge? Do you think adjusting the floater position will help? I don't mind checking the dip stick once in a while, but i can't stop starring at the stupid gauge every time i take it for spin.
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08-21-2018, 03:27 AM
#8
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well done!!! I will attempt to fix my flaccid and unmotivated needle by massaging such float, continue to cry, and then go to sleep. Thanks Nile13! 
08-21-2018, 09:29 AM
#9
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- the intermittent oil temp needle erecting is caused by some poor contact on the board, am i correct on this one? Any DIY solution or Hollywood Speedo is a bit simpler route.
Yes, the problem is in the display gauge. Pull it from the dash and check that its connections are well seated of so I would open up the guage and investigate internal connections.
- The oil level gauge, from what I've read it is not the gauge but most likely the oil level sender... is this correct? If yes, what is the likeliness of the level sensor going bad and the temp still works? Aren't they both managed by the same unit with the floater thingy?
The oil level sender is rather robust. Mine sits at the bottom at idle until the oil warms up a bit. This is normal. With the engine fully HOT and running and a dipstick showing oil somewhere in its fill range I would use a volt/ohm meter to see if the gauge is getting a signal first with a cold engine and then with a fully hot one. This would indicate if the gauge display is getting signals from the oil level sender. If it all checks out, one can pull the oil level sender and see if it is stuck or simply has a float that needs to be adjusted.
Yes, the problem is in the display gauge. Pull it from the dash and check that its connections are well seated of so I would open up the guage and investigate internal connections.
- The oil level gauge, from what I've read it is not the gauge but most likely the oil level sender... is this correct? If yes, what is the likeliness of the level sensor going bad and the temp still works? Aren't they both managed by the same unit with the floater thingy?
The oil level sender is rather robust. Mine sits at the bottom at idle until the oil warms up a bit. This is normal. With the engine fully HOT and running and a dipstick showing oil somewhere in its fill range I would use a volt/ohm meter to see if the gauge is getting a signal first with a cold engine and then with a fully hot one. This would indicate if the gauge display is getting signals from the oil level sender. If it all checks out, one can pull the oil level sender and see if it is stuck or simply has a float that needs to be adjusted.
08-21-2018, 10:05 AM
#10
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Junkart posts about a problem with his needle's erection...
Everyone jumps in trying to help out his erection...
What a great community!
(** not sure if serious post **)
Everyone jumps in trying to help out his erection...
What a great community!
(** not sure if serious post **
)
08-21-2018, 06:44 PM
#11
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Thread Starter
Mine sits at the bottom at idle until the oil warms up a bit. This is normal. With the engine fully HOT and running and a dipstick showing oil somewhere in its fill range I would use a volt/ohm meter to see if the gauge is getting a signal first with a cold engine and then with a fully hot one. This would indicate if the gauge display is getting signals from the oil level sender. If it all checks out, one can pull the oil level sender and see if it is stuck or simply has a float that needs to be adjusted.
08-21-2018, 09:07 PM
#12
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That's not quite accurate. My Japanese cars, including a severely shaken race car, never experience erection issues, though I freely admit that their needles are much shorter and thinner than those in a 993.
08-21-2018, 09:31 PM
#14
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WARNING--LENGTHY REPLY
" i can't stop starring at the stupid gauge every time i take it for spin." Therein lies part of the problem as well as the solution. The oil level gauge is not intended to be read while driving, only when stopped and idling for a bit, such as at a stop light. Otherwise it is inaccurate, and will usually be at or near the bottom.
The Porsche 993 has three oil gauges: oil level, oil temperature, and oil pressure. This is an indication of the importance of oil to these engines—proper temperature, clean oil is the lifeblood of an air-cooled engine. The oil level gauge is at the far left, along with the fuel level gauge. It reads correctly ONLY when the engine is at operating temperature, stopped on a level surface, and idling for about 30 seconds. According to the owner’s manual, the oil reservoir contains sufficient oil when the indicator on the oil level gauge is horizontal. However, the gauge reading is not always consistent with the dipstick reading. The oil level sensor float arm can be modified so that these readings, gauge and dipstick, are the same.
During driving, the oil level gauge is inaccurate due to the changes in engine speed and oil temperature. Movements of the needle while driving are normal, and it may rest in the red band at the bottom of the gauge. It is entirely normal for this gauge needle to be in the red zone when the engine speed is above 2,000 RPM. This gauge is not designed to be read during driving. It is a good habit to read the gauge after a drive, when you park the car, after letting it idle for about 30 seconds. In my experience, the ideal oil level is about halfway between the two marks on the dipstick. If the level is above that, some engines tend to “burn” oil, that is, they spit it up into the intake or otherwise get rid of it. If additional oil is added continually to keep the level at the full mark, the result will be a false pattern of excessive oil consumption. The total oil capacity of the 993 is about 11.5 liters, but the difference between the upper and lower marks on the dipstick is only 1.5 liters. This is also the measurement range of the oil level gauge. If the oil level measures low, try adding only a small amount, a pint or less of oil, then check it again. Adding an entire quart may overfill the tank. To be useful, this gauge should correlate to the dipstick measurement of the oil level. When you take a measurement with the dipstick, note the reading on the gauge. If the gauge and dipstick measurements are too far out of agreement, this can be corrected by bending the float arm of the oil level gauge sensor, located in the oil tank in the right rear fender.
To access the sensor, jack up the right rear of the car, put it on jack stands, and remove the right rear wheel. In the right rear wheel well, remove the front half of the plastic fender liner by removing the two screws under the rocker panel cover, just forward of the rear wheel, two screws at the top of the fender liner, and two 10mm nuts. Once these screws and nuts are removed, the fender liner can be taken out of the fender. The oil tank is not pressurized, and the oil level is well below the sensor opening, so you don’t have to worry about oil running out when you remove the sensor. Clean the surface of the tank around the sensor mount to preclude contamination of the oil. Remove the 8mm nuts from the sensor perimeter, and withdraw the sensor. Rotate the sensor 90 degrees clockwise to allow the sensor float to fit through the hole in the tank. It is not necessary to disconnect the sensor wiring harness. Bending the float arm to adjust the gauge reading is done by trial and error. Bend the arm down to make the gauge needle go up, or bend the arm up to make the needle go down. I recommend making a template of heavy wire (coathanger) to mock up the bend you intend to make, and to check your work. After making an adjustment, reinstall the gasket, sensor, mounting nuts, warm the engine to operating temperature, and check the readings again with the car level. Now compare the gauge indication to the dipstick reading. If the measurements are still not within the desired correlation, repeat this procedure—remove the sensor and bend the arm a little more (or less), reinstall it, and check the readings again. The next oil gauge from the left is the oil temperature. This gauge has four white tic marks, the first indicating zero degrees F (ambient temperature, engine is cold), followed by 120F, 200F, 250F, and one red band, 300F. The first two tic marks are close together at the bottom of the gauge. They indicate the “warm-up” range, during which the engine should not be revved above 4500 RPM.
For most driving conditions, the temperature gauge needle will rise above the third white tic mark (200F), but then drop back below it as the oil cooler thermostat located in the right rear fender opens and allows oil to flow to the right front fender oil cooler. Spirited driving on a hot day, or extended driving in slow traffic can cause the temperature gauge needle to rise above horizontal, which is about 225F. There is no cause for concern even if the needle approaches the fourth white tic mark**––the 250F position. It is beneficial to get engine temperature over 212F occasionally to vaporize moisture that accumulates in the engine oil because of previous cold-weather starts and short-duration trips.
Third from the left is the oil pressure gauge. It reads in bars, which are atmospheres of pressure. One bar is equal to about 14.5 pounds per square inch, so 5 bars is about 75 psi pressure. This is about the normal reading during engine operation at highway speeds. Pressure should be at least 3.5 bars at 5000 RPM. When oil is hot, the red low oil pressure warning light may flicker briefly at idle without endangering the engine. If a sudden drop in oil pressure occurs, or if the red oil pressure warning light comes on, stop the engine immediately and investigate to find the cause.
That’s it, Porsche Oil Gauges 101, probably everything you need to know about these gauges and how to interpret their readings.
" i can't stop starring at the stupid gauge every time i take it for spin." Therein lies part of the problem as well as the solution. The oil level gauge is not intended to be read while driving, only when stopped and idling for a bit, such as at a stop light. Otherwise it is inaccurate, and will usually be at or near the bottom.
The Porsche 993 has three oil gauges: oil level, oil temperature, and oil pressure. This is an indication of the importance of oil to these engines—proper temperature, clean oil is the lifeblood of an air-cooled engine. The oil level gauge is at the far left, along with the fuel level gauge. It reads correctly ONLY when the engine is at operating temperature, stopped on a level surface, and idling for about 30 seconds. According to the owner’s manual, the oil reservoir contains sufficient oil when the indicator on the oil level gauge is horizontal. However, the gauge reading is not always consistent with the dipstick reading. The oil level sensor float arm can be modified so that these readings, gauge and dipstick, are the same.
During driving, the oil level gauge is inaccurate due to the changes in engine speed and oil temperature. Movements of the needle while driving are normal, and it may rest in the red band at the bottom of the gauge. It is entirely normal for this gauge needle to be in the red zone when the engine speed is above 2,000 RPM. This gauge is not designed to be read during driving. It is a good habit to read the gauge after a drive, when you park the car, after letting it idle for about 30 seconds. In my experience, the ideal oil level is about halfway between the two marks on the dipstick. If the level is above that, some engines tend to “burn” oil, that is, they spit it up into the intake or otherwise get rid of it. If additional oil is added continually to keep the level at the full mark, the result will be a false pattern of excessive oil consumption. The total oil capacity of the 993 is about 11.5 liters, but the difference between the upper and lower marks on the dipstick is only 1.5 liters. This is also the measurement range of the oil level gauge. If the oil level measures low, try adding only a small amount, a pint or less of oil, then check it again. Adding an entire quart may overfill the tank. To be useful, this gauge should correlate to the dipstick measurement of the oil level. When you take a measurement with the dipstick, note the reading on the gauge. If the gauge and dipstick measurements are too far out of agreement, this can be corrected by bending the float arm of the oil level gauge sensor, located in the oil tank in the right rear fender.
To access the sensor, jack up the right rear of the car, put it on jack stands, and remove the right rear wheel. In the right rear wheel well, remove the front half of the plastic fender liner by removing the two screws under the rocker panel cover, just forward of the rear wheel, two screws at the top of the fender liner, and two 10mm nuts. Once these screws and nuts are removed, the fender liner can be taken out of the fender. The oil tank is not pressurized, and the oil level is well below the sensor opening, so you don’t have to worry about oil running out when you remove the sensor. Clean the surface of the tank around the sensor mount to preclude contamination of the oil. Remove the 8mm nuts from the sensor perimeter, and withdraw the sensor. Rotate the sensor 90 degrees clockwise to allow the sensor float to fit through the hole in the tank. It is not necessary to disconnect the sensor wiring harness. Bending the float arm to adjust the gauge reading is done by trial and error. Bend the arm down to make the gauge needle go up, or bend the arm up to make the needle go down. I recommend making a template of heavy wire (coathanger) to mock up the bend you intend to make, and to check your work. After making an adjustment, reinstall the gasket, sensor, mounting nuts, warm the engine to operating temperature, and check the readings again with the car level. Now compare the gauge indication to the dipstick reading. If the measurements are still not within the desired correlation, repeat this procedure—remove the sensor and bend the arm a little more (or less), reinstall it, and check the readings again. The next oil gauge from the left is the oil temperature. This gauge has four white tic marks, the first indicating zero degrees F (ambient temperature, engine is cold), followed by 120F, 200F, 250F, and one red band, 300F. The first two tic marks are close together at the bottom of the gauge. They indicate the “warm-up” range, during which the engine should not be revved above 4500 RPM.
For most driving conditions, the temperature gauge needle will rise above the third white tic mark (200F), but then drop back below it as the oil cooler thermostat located in the right rear fender opens and allows oil to flow to the right front fender oil cooler. Spirited driving on a hot day, or extended driving in slow traffic can cause the temperature gauge needle to rise above horizontal, which is about 225F. There is no cause for concern even if the needle approaches the fourth white tic mark**––the 250F position. It is beneficial to get engine temperature over 212F occasionally to vaporize moisture that accumulates in the engine oil because of previous cold-weather starts and short-duration trips.
Third from the left is the oil pressure gauge. It reads in bars, which are atmospheres of pressure. One bar is equal to about 14.5 pounds per square inch, so 5 bars is about 75 psi pressure. This is about the normal reading during engine operation at highway speeds. Pressure should be at least 3.5 bars at 5000 RPM. When oil is hot, the red low oil pressure warning light may flicker briefly at idle without endangering the engine. If a sudden drop in oil pressure occurs, or if the red oil pressure warning light comes on, stop the engine immediately and investigate to find the cause.
That’s it, Porsche Oil Gauges 101, probably everything you need to know about these gauges and how to interpret their readings.
08-21-2018, 10:14 PM
#15
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Thread Starter
Not lengthy at all Bobby! Great info! Thank you!!
The temp and pressure are all good! They are really similar to the conditions you described! But going back to your very first response, unfortunately the needle stays on the bottom all the time - running or at stop light. I've removed and checked the connector housing/pins/harness and they did look fine and well seated.
Do you know if i'm able to see any voltage at the gauge when the sender is sensing lowest oil level? Say the floater arm is sitting too high for some reason, does it still generate voltage signal? Or should i assume if i do not see any signal at all at the gauge then it could either be the sender or some wiring issue? Sorry for all the questions. The rear wheels are off at the moment for sway bar links swap and i'd like to take care of this too while i'm at it.
The temp and pressure are all good! They are really similar to the conditions you described! But going back to your very first response, unfortunately the needle stays on the bottom all the time - running or at stop light. I've removed and checked the connector housing/pins/harness and they did look fine and well seated.
Do you know if i'm able to see any voltage at the gauge when the sender is sensing lowest oil level? Say the floater arm is sitting too high for some reason, does it still generate voltage signal? Or should i assume if i do not see any signal at all at the gauge then it could either be the sender or some wiring issue? Sorry for all the questions. The rear wheels are off at the moment for sway bar links swap and i'd like to take care of this too while i'm at it.