Car and Driver's judgement day????
12-02-2003, 10:10 PM
#17
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Mike,
I can see both sides of it. I like how they put them in the same price class. But now they should pick cars that have the same performance numbers and see who wins that! I know I would be cheering for the Porsche! Interesting topic. - Jay Gratton
I can see both sides of it. I like how they put them in the same price class. But now they should pick cars that have the same performance numbers and see who wins that! I know I would be cheering for the Porsche! Interesting topic. - Jay Gratton
12-02-2003, 11:04 PM
#19
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I have subscribed to all of the major car mags for 20 years and I would say that Car & Driver is the least likely to "stack the deck" for or against any particular car. Many times over the years their comparison tests don't necessarily evaluate precisely similar cars...I think however, that there is still lots to be learned from their efforts and don't get too worked up over the exact point totals that they come up with.
12-03-2003, 02:28 PM
#22
Burning Brakes
Doesn't surprise me at all. Car & Driver is American magazine and they tend to vote local Brands #1. German tests vote Porsche-Ferrari-Ford.
I recall SUV test (D&D again) where Cadillac SUV won group test over Cayenne and other stuff.
Its so predictable .. You know.
I recall SUV test (D&D again) where Cadillac SUV won group test over Cayenne and other stuff.
Its so predictable .. You know.
12-03-2003, 02:38 PM
#23
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One of the recent issues of Evo, however, ranks GT over the Stradale. Another issue ranked the Stradale over the GT3, however, acknowledging that the GT3 is a formidable car, just severely outdone in several areas, not surprising given the price differential.
Comparos like C&D's or Evo's don't really bug me. I do think that those two mags do a decent job on a best-efforts-basis to rate the cars. At the end of the day, if you were to spend anywhere from $100 - $200K, you would probably drive the snot out of the three cars and decide for yourself. Worrying which car is ranked 1st, 2nd and 3rd, is like worrying whether Harvard Business School or Wharton is ranked 1st by WSJ, Business Week, or Financial Times. Any one would be just as desirable, just depends on what kind of person you are.
It's cars like the Accord, Maxima, G35, etc. that are more susceptible to reports from either enthusiast mags like C&D or (horrors!) Consumer Report since the buyers are less likely to purchase based on pure feel and passion, but more on things like features, reliability, resale, etc.
If I were to make my 993 purchase decision on car reviews, I probably would've either bought a used Z06, new Lancer Evo, or used E46 M3, which all can be had roughly for the same amount of money.
Comparos like C&D's or Evo's don't really bug me. I do think that those two mags do a decent job on a best-efforts-basis to rate the cars. At the end of the day, if you were to spend anywhere from $100 - $200K, you would probably drive the snot out of the three cars and decide for yourself. Worrying which car is ranked 1st, 2nd and 3rd, is like worrying whether Harvard Business School or Wharton is ranked 1st by WSJ, Business Week, or Financial Times. Any one would be just as desirable, just depends on what kind of person you are.
It's cars like the Accord, Maxima, G35, etc. that are more susceptible to reports from either enthusiast mags like C&D or (horrors!) Consumer Report since the buyers are less likely to purchase based on pure feel and passion, but more on things like features, reliability, resale, etc.
If I were to make my 993 purchase decision on car reviews, I probably would've either bought a used Z06, new Lancer Evo, or used E46 M3, which all can be had roughly for the same amount of money.
12-03-2003, 02:41 PM
#24
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Originally posted by Jack Ennuste
Car & Driver is American magazine and they tend to vote local Brands #1. German tests vote Porsche-Ferrari-Ford. Its so predictable .. You know.
Car & Driver is American magazine and they tend to vote local Brands #1. German tests vote Porsche-Ferrari-Ford. Its so predictable .. You know.
Is that why the Honda Accord and BMW M3 have swept so many Car & Driver tests for so many years?
12-03-2003, 02:46 PM
#25
Burning Brakes
Mark
C'mon, dont You see the tendency there. This isnt 100% indeed, but obvious. Its in europe also, read Italian, German and UK magazines. In last ones Jaguar is strong, nowhere else.
But answering to Your question -- M3 has no competition in US. May-be only new Crossfire now???
C'mon, dont You see the tendency there. This isnt 100% indeed, but obvious. Its in europe also, read Italian, German and UK magazines. In last ones Jaguar is strong, nowhere else.
But answering to Your question -- M3 has no competition in US. May-be only new Crossfire now???
12-03-2003, 04:36 PM
#28
Nordschleife Master
Porsche is known to be more expensive then comp. So they test a GT3? doesn't make sense? The Gt2 should have been tested no doubt about it. They claimed the Gt3 is an "over achiver" but I am quite sure the Gt2 would have burned the Gt40 in almost every test. I guess like someone else said the American Mag isgoing to choose the american car. I also like to note Cadillac SUV won group test over Cayenne and other stuff. I fail to see how the Infinity and the Caddy are SUV's they do not have any utility usage with there 3500lbs towing capacity. Hell my 944 is rated to tow 3,000lbs and its a freaking sports car.. Lately every C&D I read has pissed me off more and more.
12-03-2003, 07:19 PM
#29
Three Wheelin'
IMO, C&D says what they believe -- no bias. To suggest that they favor American cars makes me think that Jack has rarely if ever read their articles over the years.
Had the GT2 been in the test, it may well have lost to the Ford -- and that would more upsetting to Porsche since the GT2 is MORE expensive than the Ford.
I think credit should go where it's due. With the GT, Ford deserves that credit. I really wish I had $150,000 -- to my own surprise, I think I'd buy a Ford.
Had the GT2 been in the test, it may well have lost to the Ford -- and that would more upsetting to Porsche since the GT2 is MORE expensive than the Ford.
I think credit should go where it's due. With the GT, Ford deserves that credit. I really wish I had $150,000 -- to my own surprise, I think I'd buy a Ford.
12-03-2003, 07:48 PM
#30
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Jack's got a point.
All car mags have a bias, there are PEOPLE working there. I remember US magazines heralding the Lincoln LS as the next BMW 3-series killer. Yeah, right!!
When's the last time that you remember seeing one of those on the street....right there are few of them and they are as noticable as SUV and minivans.
I rest my case :-)
All car mags have a bias, there are PEOPLE working there. I remember US magazines heralding the Lincoln LS as the next BMW 3-series killer. Yeah, right!!
When's the last time that you remember seeing one of those on the street....right there are few of them and they are as noticable as SUV and minivans.
I rest my case :-)