ipse dixit

Carbon fiber cupholder!

Now all we need is a carbon fiber smoker's package.

Argon_

That's precisely what I said. Read again.

NoGaBiker

911 is rear engine because back in 1965 Porsche needed to sell cars and most buyers didn't want, need, or have the funds for multiple cars, so they needed at least kid-sized rear seats. VW Beetle, 356, 911 were all compromised with the rear engine because they needed to fit booger-nosed kids in the backseat. Whenever Ferdinand, Ferry, Ferdi Piech, etc. needed to win races, going back to the mid-fifties when they first had enough money to build purpose-built race cars, they put the motor in the middle. When they subsequently won races with 911s (a decade after the model's introduction*) they did so precisely because they now needed to sell 911s, and you know, win on Sunday, sell on Monday. They had 911s to sell so that's what they went racing with when they could, in the series where they could be competitive.

Yes, there've been a few amazing flukes like 73 and 03? Daytona where they won outright against prototypes; but they were always a good bit slower. They just outlasted the prototypes on those occasions.


* Exception of course goes to Monte Carlo Ralley winners Elford and Linge in 68, if I recall correctly. That was a particularly icy/snowy race, so the weight back then (when all cars were RWD) was a much bigger advantage than it was on tarmac

STG

I thought dwelling on BIG GULP and NUBBIE were getting out of hand. Now we're debating rear vs mid engine??

What next?? PDK vs manual?

NA vs Turbo?

Dyson vs Eureka?

stout

This.

STG

In next 5-10yrs when Porsche is trying to push electric down our throats, we will be wishing for turbo or any gas powered engine.

Argon_

U N D E R S T E E R

Argon_

Gas cars will persist a lot longer than you'd think. Both in the very high and low price brackets.

Lithium is expensive and the service lives of said batteries are short. This will keep the used market dry of cheap electric cars, pushing those with severely restricted budgets to combustion ones.

As for the high end. Many people drive for enjoyment, and much of that joy is sapped without an engine. I bet the 60th anniversary 911 will still have a flat six and a stick, even if you do have to pay extra for the third pedal.

STG

I agree, but your friends at PAG have more aggressive plans. Whether they pay off is another story.

stout

I'll buy that round of beer if you're right.

One thing that intrigues me with the photos above is that the vinyl dash has survived for another generation. I figured it might just disappear this time…

stout

Genau. For Camel Lights.

RRDnA

OK to put it another way, there is no great advantage to a rear engined lay out. Moreover, to drive a 911 very quickly (as in put down genuinely fast lap times) you have to be a very good driver to master the nuances. Its far, far easier to drive a well set up mid-engined car quickly.

STG

As far as the dash, what material would you have envisioned? Other than optional leather wrapped? The standard plastic/vinyl isn't good for keeping looking nice. Kind of a chalky black that is hard to evenly use product on to keep it looking fresh and a deeper black. Could be much better quality in my opinion.

What do you think the seats will be like? Any major changes? That's something we haven't discussed at all.

worf928

Thread derail successful

Back on topic: Cup Holder... meh. I don't need no steenkin' cup holder.

I don't mind a TFT display in place of gauges. (Although I can do without the inevitable software bugs that will result in 'couldn't reproduce' on the service record.) I do mind switch gear the function of which can't be discerned by touch.

Next thread derail:

Porsche got it right with the switch gear and user interface in the 928. Every single switch, ****, and slider can be reached and used without taking your eyes off the road. Every switch, ****, and slider is easily at hand with hands on wheel or stick. And last but not least, the instrument cluster height adjusts with the steering wheel height. It's basically perfect if - at this point, 40 years later - out-dated looking.

Porsche almost got it right with the 981/991/95B generation. The 992's interior usability appears to be going backwards.

The glass/haptic buttons on the new Panamera look pretty but don't function like you want buttons to function. And that is the problem: car interiors are designed, now, to look pretty with little regard for functionality.

And last, what my wife said about the **** is unprintable.

Argon_

That's entirely true.

Moreover, what I was saying is that the corner exit traction of a rear engined car is unmatched by any other platform, though it requires an exceedingly skilled driver to fully exploit.