wow!

 

Must be a slow news day that you’re dredging up an old post of mine? 🥱

Yes, I saw the study you are quoting:

”For those with a household income above $250,000, 61% choose to drive non-luxury brands like Toyotas, Fords, and Hondas”

It also mentions that a rich person may have a significant income but may not have accumulated assets that a wealthy person might have, leading to a less sustainable financial situation.

Case in point - my son and wife are both in their early 30’s, are CS nerds at a Seattle software company. They have a combined income of over $325K, and recently bought their first (starter) house in Seattle….so by the survey’s definition, they would more than qualify as rich, but not wealthy. My point being….in today’s market, a combined household income of $200-$250K is not unusual for young couples that have a skill. Oh, and yes, up until recently, they drove a 7 year old Hyundai Elantra (they only have one car)….but recently traded that in for a Polestar 2 EV, a car that cost them, with trade-in and tax incentives, about $40k.

In my neighborhood/development, where we have quite a few wealthy and/or rich people…..all the houses have a 3-5 car garages, so just because one sees a Honda or Toyota in the driveway doesn’t tell you the whole story. Most households in my development have at least one expensive/exotic/collector car, a Range Rover/Porsche SUV, and a used BMW/Honda/Toyota/etc for the kids. Nobody that i know that is “wealthy”, and financially secure, has fewer than 3 cars.

 

I don't look at dates of post. I saw it, felt like commenting, did it!
But that is the new norm or definition of the Upper Middle Class? Maybe, maybe not! Social media influences us all. I have friends in their 60s make more than 300k a year and keep adding more debt. Their idea, I will just die with debt, does it matter. Who knows. Anyhow, rich or not, wealthy or not, if you have a passion for something, do it in a smart way!

 

I just quoted the income level, for “rich”, in the survey your cited. Point being - without definitions or reference points, surveys are meaningless.

I use to own my own high tech company here in the DC area, so I knew what I had to offer new grads…and it started at $100K….that was 3-5 years ago. Most of these newly minted “rich”, were fresh out of college, driving beater Honda’s/etc..

Wealthy people, unless they inherited their wealth, got to be wealthy by investing, and not spending, most of their disposable income. In my case, that money went back into building the company. Not driving flashy cars. It paid off when i sold the company and retired. Now I can afford anything I want….but I’d rather “gift it” to my children as they build their lives.

As I said in my earlier post - Those that have had wealth in the family, tend to be less garish. Old money is conservative. New money of today, you see more toys. To each their own. My take is - spending money at the level that it comes in, is asking for financial trouble at some point in one;’s life. From time to time, I read stories about a homeless person that use to be “rich”, lived in a huge house up in the hills, etc. Then something happened in his life that left him with nothing…and now he’s on the street. Chit happens. Some of us prepare, some don’t.

 

Yes, no real issue with the wait either. A good problem to have and if comes sooner great. Will be interesting to see how things progress with the eventual return of PCCB, PTS, changes with the .2 etc.

 

I completely agree.

 

As a funny side note….I have 4 cars. There is only my wife and I, now, as our two boys have moved away (Chicago and Seattle) to start their own lives. A few weeks ago I decided to get rid of one of my 4 cars…the car I decided to get rid of was my 2016 M4, in PERFECT condition and only 27k miles on the ODO. I first offered to give it to either of my boys, as a freebie. Both are married and have one car, each….so thought one of them might like a free 2nd car?? Boy, was I wrong. Both turned me down. When I asked each of them why, they gave me the following reasons: (1) More up keep costs, gas costs, maintenance, (2) More insurance costs, etc.

At first i was a bit saddened/surprised that neither wanted my M4, but then I realized I must have done a good job raising my two boys, as both had sound financial reasons why they didn’t wish to incur anymore expense….from a free gift.

 

Or maybe they read forums and didn't want to deal with a failed crank hub Seriously, good for them and for how they were raised.

 

They could have taken the M4 to Carmax and got a check for $30K or more.

 

I stipulated the gift would be for their use, and not simply to sell. In the end, I could sell myself and gift them the money if I want to….but thought they could benefit from having the utility of a 2nd car? Not to mention, both like nice cars, so this would be a car that they might not otherwise be willing to incur the expense. Also, thought that owning a nice car that I enjoyed, and took care of, might be something we would share in common. Anyway, it’s no big deal…just not expected.

As we all age, and distances separate us, we no longer send personalized gifts to them for Christmas, anniversaries or birthdays…we just write checks….for good, or bad. Christmas use to be hours spent on trying to find just the right gifts for our boys…now it’s spent on deciding how big a check to send them.

 

I think it's great that you raised kids who are not super materialistic. But it's also a bit sad that kids are not car enthusiasts anymore. My older son was fortunate enough to get his license right as I bought my 2021 992 S. He learned how to drive stick shift in a brand new 992 and my 2015 F80 M3. He was very enthusiastic about it and also seemed to love driving both cars. We would cruise for hours as he learned how to drive and I introduced him to all kinds of cool genres of music etc. Then he just lost interest. It's rare for young people to really be into cars anymore. Maybe it's b/c in our generation, we didn't have smartphones and we had to actually go to each others houses to hang out.

BTW, I had my 2015 M3 w/ 48K miles appraised at Carmax and they offered $32K even though it had mods on it like an exhaust, intake, lowered, etc. If I put it back to stock, they would've given me $36K. Great retention of value for an almost 9 yr old car I bought brand new for $70K.

 

To tell you the truth, I have a hard time selling to a stranger. I do get attached to the cars I own. Was really hoping to keep it in the family, so to speak. I’m gonna hold on to it a bit and see if my son in Chicago changes his mind…he helped me pick it out in 2016, so there’s a connection.