Russian Mafia

Silver.

Rare9

I'll put my two cents. For what it's worth it's fun reading people's opinion about this matter.
I went from manual Boxster to DCT M2 and now Manual 992. With the Boxster, sometimes I wished I had the PDK but with the M2 I wished many more times to have the manual. If I'm getting such a complex powerful machine, I want to fully feel and play with it. So I had no doubt the next would be stick. This was also reinforced by the stick Miata I daily drove for the past year. So what if my wife has to learn to drive stick. Worth it.

kencalz

Test drove the MT 992S the other day. One of the few manuals I gelled with almost right away. Clutch was easy to modulate, gates were defined/little play in the shifter and throws were shortish. So easy to use and paired very well to the torquey engine. It helped that there was no salesperson telling me to slow down so really could drive the way I wanted (unlike when I test drove the 718 GT4 MT last week).

I feel like this is one of the few modern cars that the manual is not just an afterthought after the development of automatic/PDK like with some other manufacturers. I remember test driving an Ftype manual and it was horrible as a manual transmission (or what I was looking for in a manual). The new M2 Comp was also not that impressive in manual form with long, vague and rubbery shifter throws.

What makes it hard is that the PDK is arguably the best DCT out there. I chose manual (I ordered the manual before I test drove it based on other forum feedback) because I usually drive on short trips around town and knew it would be the more engaging choice/require more of involvement.

schuverde

Test drove a 2018 PDK C2 yesterday. First Porsche test drive on my quest for a 911 to tour the country in over the next few years. I only drove the PDK b/c the car was at Carmax and easy to test drive. I never thought I'd like it and have only been looking for manuals and have been on a waitlist for a manual 2021/2022. I have to say that the car offered enough excitement even with the PDK for me to be reconsidering my "manual only" position. I was too timid in the test drive to work the paddles. I really didn't know how so I avoided it. The sales guy said it was a mistake to not try it. Oh well. Now I'm really confused as which car to pursue. I couldn't stop myself from reaching fo the stick though. It was comical.

dhirm5

PDK is best experienced in sports plus mode. That's where it really shines, keeping the motor in the power band at all times. The other modes are fine if you're just getting groceries.

Reaching for the stick in a PDK 992 is much more "comical". There's nothing to grab as it's been neutered. All you have is a little "nubbin", as it's affectionately called.

schuverde

I did have it in Sports mode and perhaps that why I actually enjoyed the ride so much.

dhirm5

Sports _plus_ makes the regular sport mode feel like ... well, it's worlds apart. PDK is a fantastic gearbox; manual is just a lot more engaging. I'm also mildly worried I'll miss PDK in the 911, but the manuals are basically liquid, so if I decide I'd rather have a PDK, I'll flip it, again.

inthesticks

I do this with every automatic car I drive. Half the time my hand just sits on the shifter.

manifold danger

The conclusion I've come to is I need one of each. I tried to have a DCT-only solution and it ended up costing me a good amount of cash because I just couldn't stand not having something manual to drive and I traded it in before I should have. I went the other direction this last time and realized with my 991.2, that a manual is a far inferior choice if you plan to visit the track frequently (especially if you expect to be semi-competitive). Fun can and will be had in either gearbox, it just manifests in different ways.

For the 992, I'll have it in PDK, as it will see track use. I will also "augment" it with something manual. For the time being, I have my 20-year old's Civic Si that I can borrow . Eventually when my youngest is out of college I'll likely have an S2000 or another Boxster. It may or may not see track use, but the sole intent is to use it as a second "fun" car when I just have to get a manual fix.

So as for yet another suggestion, if this will be your "augmentation" to your daily-driven car, then a manual is the way to go. For all other purposes I think it's fair to suggest the PDK unless you just have to have a manual.

ipse dixit

This is the way to go.

I think a MT on a 992 911 is sort of a square peg, round hole. The car has so much torque and the gearing is so high, that you can basically leave the damn thing in 2nd and 3rd gear 90% of the time, which sort of defeats the purpose of a MT.

Get a 992 911 PDK, then complement it with something like the MX-5 where you really have to row your gears since the I-4 is so anemic. And the shifts are nice and crisp. The Civic Si would work as well, but I just find too "JDM boy racer-ish".

inthesticks

There's really no conundrum. If a sports car come's with the option of a manual transmission (and you know how to drive a manual transmission) then it's a no brainer. I keep reading people using rev limits, and gear lengths, and scientific reasoning why the manual isnt "optimal" in the 992. None of that makes any sense unless 1) you're tracking and racing, 2) You really are planning to DD the car and sit in traffic most of the time. 3) you dont know how to drive a manual.

dhirm5

Right - I think what is missed when bellyaching about the too tall 1 - 3 (or 4?) is that you don't have to wind each gear to redline in order to enjoy the drive. You can "short" shift - down around 5k or even less and still have fun doing it.

In my e39 m5, there's some serious drama in winding it out to 7200 (redline - boosted by 200rpm with a tune), but it's just as fun to shift at 4500. When I do wind to 7200, I almost always get punished by the stability control unless I turn it off, as it will *always* lose traction going to 2nd if I shift that high (and then it takes off like a bat out of hell in the next gear). It's so damn fun I'm tempted to go take a drive right now.

Anyway - I digress, I imagine the same would apply to the 991/992,

Skarz

It depends on the context, whether something is optimal. In terms of measured performance, a manual is not optimal. U simply cannot shift fast enough manually, and you will likely not shift at the optimal engine speed. A manual may be more engaging, but optimum it is not.

dhirm5

I don't think you'll find anyone argue this with you. We manual folk have long accepted that we're slower than PDK, and we're fine with it.

Also, by and large, optimum is redline. Your butt and heart will be telling you to shift long before it's necessary/appropriate, and most manual drivers do indeed shift well before redline, unless they're racing. If racing, I'd expect general driver skill to trump the PDK benefit (tho given a top tier driver, they'll be slightly faster in PDK).

hawkinsmc

Go to 23:00- 24:00
Even Andreas Preuninger admits he has a hard time deciding what he likes best.