The whole supercar/exotics debate... I think perhaps some clarification is needed there. In my estimation, two things define a supercar... performance (hence the “super”), and rarity/exclusivity (hence the oft-used alternative descriptive term “exotic”).

There are simply too many TTS produced for the car to qualify as a supercar/exotic. It’s just not rare or exclusive enough.

But get it on a track, and it will greedily eat the lunches of the vast, vast majority of current supercars. And it will drive to that track and pick up In-N-Out on the way, while those supercars are trailered in like delicate butterflies. The performance aspect of the TTS is absolutely qualifiying.

If Porsche reduced production of the TTS to like 50-100 cars a year... Boom, it’s a supercar.

Come to think of it, there are a fair number of bonafide supercars that the regular old 992 S will spank on the track...

 

“Supercar” is defined by the following criteria...

1. Limited and/or handbuilt production
2. Liberal use of exotic materials for the time
3. Utility extremely compromised in the name of extreme performance
4. Not derived from a car that failed the above three criteria

No 911 passes the above criteria. The Carrera GT and 918 do pass.

The above criteria holds for historic cars as well. For example, the Miura passes as well as the Ferrari F40 passes.

You can’t use raw performance numbers as criteria, because classic supercars are considerably slower than modern cars.

 

The GT2RS is the only 911 that is arguably in the category. It's compromised, rare, uses bespoke, exotic materials and has real heritage. The only problem is that it's not a stand alone model, which I think is really a necessary component for an exotic.

 

I could get behind this logic.

 

Quote:
”Using the configurator I built a Carrera S and Turbo S.... interesting to note the similarities between the two models. Given the leap in price, what would make you go for a Turbo S over the Carrera S?

I’m somewhat on the fence...here in South Africa, for the price of a Turbo S, I could pick up a well specced Carrera S and a Cayenne Coupe....”

I live in Southern California, and I’ve put 3,500 miles on my Carrera S over the past 6 months, with a good mix of city, freeway, and canyon driving, and not once have I said, “I wish this car would go faster”. In fact, the majority of the time I have to hold back, out of concern for getting a ticket.

Matt Farrah, who reviewed both the Carrera S and the Turbo S for “The Smoking Tire” said that he really couldn’t perceive much of a difference between the 2 cars at speeds less than 100 Mph. He went on to say that the only real difference between the two is that the Turbo S will get you sent to jail faster.

 

Hey, like I said, I’m not making the case that the TTS is a supercar, nor even the GT2 RS.

Merely pointing out that when it comes to pure performance, the TTS will get around a track faster than most current supercars. And the GT2 RS (on a good day) will get around one faster than any other production car period.

 

What sort of rare and bespoke materials does the 991 GT2RS use?

It doesn't have a race-derived, motorsport engine (its basically a pumped up 991 TTS engine), nor a true dry sump, and its chassis is basically the same as any old 991 911. Yes, it has some carbon bits, more body panels for downforce, magnesium wheels (as an option), and rose-jointed bearings, but those are all add-ons and not really all that exotic.

 

I never said that the Turbo S is a super car - I said, verbatim, that it has super car performance, in a sleeper car package..... heck, it even has hyper car performance.

 

What is exotic now? Full carbon-fiber tub? Naturally-aspirated engine that revs to over 9K RPM? Small production volume used to be associated with exotic, but in modern world it only means that the product is just not as good because R&D cost is spread across smaller number of units, so many corners are cut.

 

Turbo S is a super car to me even if it's not the general consensus.

 

I don't think you can compare new cars with used cars, because in 2 years or so a typical 230K+ MSRP TTS will depreciate to 180K (maybe even with CPO).

 

Agree. To be fair, the new Huracan EVO is at roughly the same price, but it would get spanked by the TTS in nearly every category except "how much does your car resemble a rolling hard on".

 

So, what is a supercar then, if not defined by performance, quality materials, ability on the street and track, and exclusive pricing?
If a true supercar is defined by lack of comfort, extraordinary maintenance costs, and cars that only your less than favorite friends can own then I'm happy to stick with my TTS which is "super" to me and king of the road in most instances.

 

I'd say magnesium body panels qualifies as an exotic material, but to be clear -- my point was that the GT2RS is arguably NOT exotic because it's essentially a heavily modified 911, despite the fact that it's rare, compromised and uses exotic (my term) materials.

 

Thinking about this a little more... Maybe the terms “supercar” and “exotic” should be considered disparate.

I mean, doesn’t it seem kind of silly to exclude the GT2 RS, literally the fastest production car in the world (where a track is concerned) from “supercar” contention, merely because it didn’t need to be hand-formed entirely from NASA-spec carbon-ceramic waffling and produced in batches of three a year to achieve that standing?