The reality of "MSRP" Lists
11-02-2021 | 07:55 PM
#31
Rennlist Member
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 3,832
Likes: 2,254
$140K over for a "used" (340 mi) 992 GT3
$33K over for a 991.2 GT3 with 11K miles
Used Porsche 911 GT3 Boerne TX (themarkmotors.com)
Dang...
$33K over for a 991.2 GT3 with 11K miles
Used Porsche 911 GT3 Boerne TX (themarkmotors.com)
Dang...
11-02-2021 | 08:18 PM
#32
Burning Brakes
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,247
Likes: 281
From: In the garage
First mistake is working with a sales advisor. If you don’t have a good relationship with the GM/owner it’s much harder. You are then hoping the salesperson goes to bat for you to get your allocation at MSRP.
11-02-2021 | 09:04 PM
#34
Rennlist Member
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 654
Likes: 390
From: Chicago, IL
OP- consider the responses to your (this) thread and the last thread where you told everyone that guys who pay over MSRP are "suckers" and that ADM's are coming down, etc. Instead of defending yourself against everyone else (including me) who are saying your posts are contradictory and somewhat condescending, perhaps you should evaluate why your threads are generating such a response. Unless that is your intention.
When you move into a neighborhood and the rate of motor vehicle accidents triple, it's probably not that your neighbors suddenly forgot how to drive...
When you move into a neighborhood and the rate of motor vehicle accidents triple, it's probably not that your neighbors suddenly forgot how to drive...
Last edited by Fang911; 11-02-2021 at 09:10 PM.
11-02-2021 | 09:30 PM
#35
Instructor
Joined: Sep 2020
Posts: 110
Likes: 35
Need to value opportunity cost of one's own time in transacting in anything
Know of newbies who've gotten early GT3 specs (already delivered) @$50Kish ADM from CA dealers
Any guy who can afford a GT3 is prob >20% richer than he was on 12/31/20
Any smarter, self-made kid today who can easily afford a new GT3 likely knows whales who can introduce them to their dealer and their pricing/allocation scheme....and some of these kids quickly become whales within a few yrs, esp in dynamic places like SF/LA/Miami/Austin/Dallas: nearly all the whales in places like these were pikers <<20y ago
Notion of wasting one's time calling random dealers in Podunk and becoming a creditor (via deposits) is such a mockable Luddite concept....
Know of newbies who've gotten early GT3 specs (already delivered) @$50Kish ADM from CA dealers
Any guy who can afford a GT3 is prob >20% richer than he was on 12/31/20
Any smarter, self-made kid today who can easily afford a new GT3 likely knows whales who can introduce them to their dealer and their pricing/allocation scheme....and some of these kids quickly become whales within a few yrs, esp in dynamic places like SF/LA/Miami/Austin/Dallas: nearly all the whales in places like these were pikers <<20y ago
Notion of wasting one's time calling random dealers in Podunk and becoming a creditor (via deposits) is such a mockable Luddite concept....
11-02-2021 | 09:37 PM
#36
Racer
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 457
Likes: 239
From: Florida
This may be a recent development with the 992 GT3 allocations, but there seems to be some confusion about the way allocations are currently distributed by PAG to PCNA. (I cannot speak with confidence about previous generation GT3 allocations and believe the release process may have been different in prior years.) However, I am highly confident that last March, all GT3 allocations for the year 2021 were released by PAG to dealers in the US. I am also highly confident that US dealerships have not received any additional allocations in 2021 since last March and that they will not receive any additional allocations until early next year (excepting a very few "reward" allocations released by PAG during the year). I understand that the next round of allocations to be released by PAG in January or February will be the only set of allocations to be released to dealers in 2022. (I don't know if the reason for this is supply-chain oriented, intentional supply side limitation, production limitation, or some other rationale.) However, if dealers are still offering any allocations in 2021 (for 2022 builds), I believe that there are only a limited number of explanations (allowing for some small number of MSRP allocations distributed by dealers for any number of semi-unique reasons):
1.) That dealer was not able to obtain the ADM they wanted from last March until now
2.) That dealer withheld an allocation in hopes of receiving a higher ADM at a later time
3.) That dealer had a prospective buyer back-out of the transaction for some reason
4.) That dealer is not being totally forthcoming with their prospective buyers
Given that it was widely known by dealers last March that there would not be additional allocations in 2021 and that many prospective buyers would willingly pay an ADM (far more willing ADM buyers than available allocations), I would be very surprised that there would be a large number of "dealers with integrity" that would turn down additional profits to sell GT3s at MSRP. Given that the same situation is understood to exist in 2022, I would be equally surprised by any large number of "MSRP" allocations or even "low ADM" allocations next year. I don't begrudge dealers that have this perspective as I would run my business the same way and would not allow my business to make less profits than it otherwise could. I believe that this is true of all but philanthropic establishments in a capitalistic nation like the US. (God Bless The USA!)
I am not trying to "burst anyone's bubble" here, just trying to be pragmatic about my understanding of the situation. Several others have posted similar perspectives during the past 7-8 months, but it seems to merit periodic repetition for those that have not read the prior related posts. Hopefully, there will be many more allocations next year than there are buyers in the "ADM pool" and "MSRP allocations" will be plentiful for all who want them! Unfortunately, that's not the way I am placing my bets.
1.) That dealer was not able to obtain the ADM they wanted from last March until now
2.) That dealer withheld an allocation in hopes of receiving a higher ADM at a later time
3.) That dealer had a prospective buyer back-out of the transaction for some reason
4.) That dealer is not being totally forthcoming with their prospective buyers
Given that it was widely known by dealers last March that there would not be additional allocations in 2021 and that many prospective buyers would willingly pay an ADM (far more willing ADM buyers than available allocations), I would be very surprised that there would be a large number of "dealers with integrity" that would turn down additional profits to sell GT3s at MSRP. Given that the same situation is understood to exist in 2022, I would be equally surprised by any large number of "MSRP" allocations or even "low ADM" allocations next year. I don't begrudge dealers that have this perspective as I would run my business the same way and would not allow my business to make less profits than it otherwise could. I believe that this is true of all but philanthropic establishments in a capitalistic nation like the US. (God Bless The USA!)
I am not trying to "burst anyone's bubble" here, just trying to be pragmatic about my understanding of the situation. Several others have posted similar perspectives during the past 7-8 months, but it seems to merit periodic repetition for those that have not read the prior related posts. Hopefully, there will be many more allocations next year than there are buyers in the "ADM pool" and "MSRP allocations" will be plentiful for all who want them! Unfortunately, that's not the way I am placing my bets.
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11-02-2021 | 10:44 PM
#40
Thread Starter
Rennlist Member
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 4,032
Likes: 1,860
This may be a recent development with the 992 GT3 allocations, but there seems to be some confusion about the way allocations are currently distributed by PAG to PCNA. (I cannot speak with confidence about previous generation GT3 allocations and believe the release process may have been different in prior years.) However, I am highly confident that last March, all GT3 allocations for the year 2021 were released by PAG to dealers in the US. I am also highly confident that US dealerships have not received any additional allocations in 2021 since last March and that they will not receive any additional allocations until early next year (excepting a very few "reward" allocations released by PAG during the year). I understand that the next round of allocations to be released by PAG in January or February will be the only set of allocations to be released to dealers in 2022. (I don't know if the reason for this is supply-chain oriented, intentional supply side limitation, production limitation, or some other rationale.) However, if dealers are still offering any allocations in 2021 (for 2022 builds), I believe that there are only a limited number of explanations (allowing for some small number of MSRP allocations distributed by dealers for any number of semi-unique reasons):
1.) That dealer was not able to obtain the ADM they wanted from last March until now
2.) That dealer withheld an allocation in hopes of receiving a higher ADM at a later time
3.) That dealer had a prospective buyer back-out of the transaction for some reason
4.) That dealer is not being totally forthcoming with their prospective buyers
Given that it was widely known by dealers last March that there would not be additional allocations in 2021 and that many prospective buyers would willingly pay an ADM (far more willing ADM buyers than available allocations), I would be very surprised that there would be a large number of "dealers with integrity" that would turn down additional profits to sell GT3s at MSRP. Given that the same situation is understood to exist in 2022, I would be equally surprised by any large number of "MSRP" allocations or even "low ADM" allocations next year. I don't begrudge dealers that have this perspective as I would run my business the same way and would not allow my business to make less profits than it otherwise could. I believe that this is true of all but philanthropic establishments in a capitalistic nation like the US. (God Bless The USA!)
I am not trying to "burst anyone's bubble" here, just trying to be pragmatic about my understanding of the situation. Several others have posted similar perspectives during the past 7-8 months, but it seems to merit periodic repetition for those that have not read the prior related posts. Hopefully, there will be many more allocations next year than there are buyers in the "ADM pool" and "MSRP allocations" will be plentiful for all who want them! Unfortunately, that's not the way I am placing my bets.
1.) That dealer was not able to obtain the ADM they wanted from last March until now
2.) That dealer withheld an allocation in hopes of receiving a higher ADM at a later time
3.) That dealer had a prospective buyer back-out of the transaction for some reason
4.) That dealer is not being totally forthcoming with their prospective buyers
Given that it was widely known by dealers last March that there would not be additional allocations in 2021 and that many prospective buyers would willingly pay an ADM (far more willing ADM buyers than available allocations), I would be very surprised that there would be a large number of "dealers with integrity" that would turn down additional profits to sell GT3s at MSRP. Given that the same situation is understood to exist in 2022, I would be equally surprised by any large number of "MSRP" allocations or even "low ADM" allocations next year. I don't begrudge dealers that have this perspective as I would run my business the same way and would not allow my business to make less profits than it otherwise could. I believe that this is true of all but philanthropic establishments in a capitalistic nation like the US. (God Bless The USA!)
I am not trying to "burst anyone's bubble" here, just trying to be pragmatic about my understanding of the situation. Several others have posted similar perspectives during the past 7-8 months, but it seems to merit periodic repetition for those that have not read the prior related posts. Hopefully, there will be many more allocations next year than there are buyers in the "ADM pool" and "MSRP allocations" will be plentiful for all who want them! Unfortunately, that's not the way I am placing my bets.
11-02-2021 | 11:41 PM
#41
Race Director
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 13,162
Likes: 3,888
This may be a recent development with the 992 GT3 allocations, but there seems to be some confusion about the way allocations are currently distributed by PAG to PCNA. (I cannot speak with confidence about previous generation GT3 allocations and believe the release process may have been different in prior years.) However, I am highly confident that last March, all GT3 allocations for the year 2021 were released by PAG to dealers in the US. I am also highly confident that US dealerships have not received any additional allocations in 2021 since last March and that they will not receive any additional allocations until early next year (excepting a very few "reward" allocations released by PAG during the year). I understand that the next round of allocations to be released by PAG in January or February will be the only set of allocations to be released to dealers in 2022.
The following users liked this post:
chance6 (11-03-2021)
11-03-2021 | 02:11 AM
#43
Race Car
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 3,835
Likes: 1,543
From: Somewhere out East
How does what I stated above give you the indication that I am? Its a public forum. I am sharing my experience. I think there are many people who get on these MSRP lists thinking its a fair system that assigns each allocation a dealer gets to the top pf the list. I am stating my recent experience says this isnt the case always. Its not a scientific system and its not a fair system. A dealer recently got into an argument with me when I asked where I would be on their list. They basically said they dont disclose a) how many are on the list, b) what would be the going rate of the car when my turn comes c) on average how many allocations they get per year. So they want you to commit but they keep you in the dark. They say its MSRP but they also say it might not be MSRP when your turn comes. Every dealer is unique and I dont think you can trust that they will do what you think they will do with using their allocations.
Also why is there hostile behavior when these types of threads show up? Any piece post/information someone posts that dont jive well with the majority, you are crucified, attacked, and insulted. Same thing with the thread about the brake ducts being ripped or the guy complaining about his GT3 not being a good DD. Its like this is a cult and you are not welcome if you dont sing the party line
Also why is there hostile behavior when these types of threads show up? Any piece post/information someone posts that dont jive well with the majority, you are crucified, attacked, and insulted. Same thing with the thread about the brake ducts being ripped or the guy complaining about his GT3 not being a good DD. Its like this is a cult and you are not welcome if you dont sing the party line
11-03-2021 | 02:16 AM
#44
Race Car
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 3,835
Likes: 1,543
From: Somewhere out East
Guys... Are we done with this yet? Literally cheap cars have ADMs today. Get over it. These threads are so useless. Some of us need to get outside and pay attention to what's going on in the world around them.
"If nobody agreed to adm the dealerships couldn't do this" << 99% of these guys either have spent many hundreds of thousands of dollars, or they're going to miss out this time. Yes, YES maybe a whole 12 dudes in the entire North America will get an MSRP gt3 without a history at the dealership. Wow. I'm so impressed that I forgot that I've been driving mine since August 30th while people still complain about literal supply and demand.
If you spent a million in the last ten years, maybe you'll get MSRP, CONGRATS! lmfao... /Rant
"If nobody agreed to adm the dealerships couldn't do this" << 99% of these guys either have spent many hundreds of thousands of dollars, or they're going to miss out this time. Yes, YES maybe a whole 12 dudes in the entire North America will get an MSRP gt3 without a history at the dealership. Wow. I'm so impressed that I forgot that I've been driving mine since August 30th while people still complain about literal supply and demand.
If you spent a million in the last ten years, maybe you'll get MSRP, CONGRATS! lmfao... /Rant
11-03-2021 | 02:17 AM
#45
Race Car
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 3,835
Likes: 1,543
From: Somewhere out East
Do you? Because you keep making posts like you are the subject matter expert. The issue is tonality in your posts. This post, and your other ADM post, both contain the tone that you have gained some piece of knowledge, that only you gained, and then gift to everyone else.
And when questioned or challenged, respond in a condescending way about damaging relationships with dealers, doing your own homework, etc...
I have no skin in this game. And you clearly have no desire to identify the root cause of why your posts draw the responses they do. Just know, it's not the fault of others nor their misinterpretation. It is amusing and entertaining though. And maybe that's what you're going after.
Do you? Because you keep making posts like you are the subject matter expert. The issue is tonality in your posts. This post, and your other ADM post, both contain the tone that you have gained some piece of knowledge, that only you gained, and then gift to everyone else.
And when questioned or challenged, respond in a condescending way about damaging relationships with dealers, doing your own homework, etc...
I have no skin in this game. And you clearly have no desire to identify the root cause of why your posts draw the responses they do. Just know, it's not the fault of others nor their misinterpretation. It is amusing and entertaining though. And maybe that's what you're going after.