Dewinator

OP,

I'm with you on wishing I could defeat the kickdown, and still not bring sure about the PDK... although after many many years learning how to get what we want out of a manual, it would be odd not to take a significant amount of time to feel the same way about PDK.

On the rest of it though, when I went from the 986S to the 991S it was because I wanted to go from a sports car to more of a grown-up car that's more comfortable for daily driving, and that's exactly what it is. When I test-drove the 991, that's what it felt like so I bought it. Of course I miss the sports car tossability sometimes, but the 991 is more of a sports/GT crossover, so you wouldn't expect it to feel the same as a sports car.

Did the 991 you test-drove and liked feel different from the one you bought? Or did you never try it? I just don't get the whole "this car isn't what I wanted" thing. Why didn't you buy what you wanted then?

997s07

Exactly. The chassis is highly refined. The race versions have different welding patterns and some geometrical differences, however, nothing that would make our cars any more race ready.

Forgeline in America makes custom wheels. Just send them your offset numbers and they'll fabricate very light and very strong wheels. 19 inch, centre locked. Of course, BBS is another option, albeit without much customisable options.

One can feel the suspension load and release with the changes I've described. My car didn't come with PASM, I'm certain it is standard for your car. This is a feeling robbing and useless option that was forced upon many 991 cars.

aggie57

Nobody has mentioned the steering. The 991 has a good electric system but the earlier cars, well, the steering was phenomenal. As someone else suggested maybe you'd be happier with a manual 997 GTS.

hawc

Hahahah. Ouch.

Julian Thompson

@larry - we think the throttle pedals are different because the PDK one has the physical switch at the bottom mechanically and the tcu is responding to the kick down position of the main potentiometer rather than the binary "1" output of a microswitch. That begs the question of whether the output (and even format) of the two pedals is identical right up to the "kick down" portion of the travel. If that were the case then you are still correct - the pedal swap would work. Effectively if the output of the PDK pedal just goes further than the manual one and the tcu picks up on that then your idea will work and there is no need for a tcu swap... Here is a question - is the gt3 throttle pedal part number the same as the manual carrera?

@997s07 - so the PASM interacts with the dampers does it? Can it alter the damping rates on the fly as the car loads up into the corners based on data inputs from the rest of it? If so that's probably why it feels more difficult to gauge the grip reserves I guess. The suspension you're using does away with that and runs single rate coil overs with no gadgets?

@Dewinator - that BR-Z looks just like what I'm looking for yes, thanks very much! Do you think they will offer me some driving tuition with that too? Where is my nearest dealer?

PS - no I didn't drive the car before I bought it. The last 911 I drove was my 964RS. I just woke up one morning and decided I wanted another one, called the dealer to order a GT3RS. Got laughed at. Didn't understand why. Said "ok - I'll take a GT3 then, please - got laughed at again. Put the phone down and read some reviews that basically explained that in order to buy one of these super sporty 911's I had to deal at way over list for a used car. I didn't much fancy that because on checking the cars that had list prices of £140000 were £240000. So instead I read some stuff, realised that Porsche were stopping the n/a 911 and that the GTS was really a really fantastic half way house between a GT3 and a Carrrera S. The more I read the better it sounded and so I picked up the phone and bought it. I then spent some time (not sure if you saw my other thread) making it look a bit like the car I really wanted (kind of 911r but again you can't get one - well I can't - you might be able to but I've not kissed sufficient butt at this time) and there we go. It was a bit of a gamble but a lot of fun to wait in anticipation of what it was going to be like!

Here is a pic from the dealers Facebook - that's me on the right with the lads - great bunch :-)

Julian Thompson

PPS - before you tell me it's my own silly fault and I should have driven the car extensively first - yep. I know that now. But honestly I thought that after all the amazing things I'd read and the 20+ year gap from the 964 that the thing would have been just unbelievable. And also in my experience it does take a little while to fully understand what a car is like so a few scrappy dealer drives probably wouldn't have helped me really - car felt great for the first few hundred miles until I begun to dig into its character. Hope that makes sense! Kind of also makes me a bit sad that these proper 911s are in the main just discussed in terms of "where are premiums going tomorrow" rather than by guys who actually want to actually use them and enjoy them. It says a lot when even you now refer to the 911 as not even a sports car! Yet Porsche have those lovely cars there that we can't buy!

Julian Thompson

And for posterity here it was: (that was back in the day lol!!!)

focal

I know this would break the bank but Singer 911

For a car with lessor cost and similar bespoke feel a frontline LE50 plus

Since you are in the UK, Frontline is local and you can go meet the builders and test drive.

http://www.frontlinedevelopments.com/vehicle/mg-le50/

This is one car I would consider letting my GT4 go for. The next time I am in the UK I will go visit and drive it.

DNorby

I have a 991S and people have commented about how it is a GT car, touring, too big, not a real 911, not a sports car and they like their old 911 that is nowhere near as quick and fast. Part I think is human nature and emotions which one of which is jealousy and they have to rationalize. I don't care about impressing people at all, I do like my car.

The fact is that this model is the most powerful and they had to make it larger so it could stay on the dam road. My car does 0-60 in about 4 seconds and has a top speed of 190. If it was a much smaller car it would be dangerous to drive

If you are going to spend a lot a money on a car it might be a good idea to take it on a test drive first.

maxpowers

I still don't understand why you didn't get a manual since these auto boxes obviously are going to take control and feel away from you, even in "manual" mode.

I also see what you're saying about it being too big. I almost prefer my 07 Cayman S as far as size and feel to the 991, but the Cayman needs more power.The manual 991 is a good balance of every day driveability with sports car feel and did exceptionally well on the track, but I wish I could see the engine and that it wasn't so big

CSK 911 C4S

Sell it already.

DocMo

To OP. Your GTS is unique, you put a lot of effort, $, and brain to make it like you want. II think it's a shame if you give up so quickly. By the way, I've had my GTS pdk, AWE exhaust, PDCC with Pirellis for 6 months and I enjoy driving it more than my 997 4S. It's a true beast in sport+ on mountain roads and yes the limits of this car are very very high even on the wet.

My advice :
1. Test drive GT3, GT3 RS, GT4
2. If you really like any of these cars' chassis, steering feel and tire feedback I am sure you can get 95% similar results if you add the right parts, tires and geometry set up to your GTS.

BlackBeauty

Life is too short not to have exactly what you want. In my 30+ years of car craziness, I'm haunted by the words of Ferry Porsche, "There's no such thing as the perfect car, but as engineers and designers, we have to do everything in our power to approach this ideal."

I had the absolute thrill this weekend of jumping in my friend's '89 Carrera Cab with manual G50 and he took my .2 PDK C4S.

After 30 minutes of thrilling back Country roads each of us were effusive about the other's car.

There's a reason there are so many current variants and why the next version pushes the performance envelope a little more.

Each iteration of this series has, pros, cons -loves/hates. We can read 1000 articles on these cars and they're all the same. The only way you really learn what you want, is to drive them extensively. People though I was crazy for getting rid of my .1 C2S, but for me (my second 911) I was able to really embrace and use that experience as a basis of what I really wanted and didn't want.

Get some more seat time - maximize what you really like, exploit it. Be the amazing pilot you can be with this amazing machine and if you still feel the same, then get another one with exactly what you want.

Drive safely - this is a great discussion, thank you for sharing!!

oalvarez

and exactly why i ask people to ask themselves what it is that they want/need/expect, as opposed to going solely on what other people have to say. at the end of the day, they can't feel what you do.....so you have what you have.

i like what one of the other individuals had to offer; give it a bit more time (not a ton, it might be in your interest to keep miles on the low side for resale purposes, but the exhaust mod might work against you as well) and see if you grow to like it. as for the cost of short-term ownership, oh well, lesson learned, some fun and experience gained, and move on to the next car. life truly is too short, get what you want, if you can.

best,

997s07

Yup. No on the fly adjustments. Pure analogue. I feel the chassis and know 80% of the time what the car is doing. The other 20% of the time I'm driving too slow.