New 911R (Manual GT3) Official?
Race Car
Joined: Nov 2013
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From: Europe
Why make it light weight with no wing or aero?
Rennlist Member
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: Fairfax County, Virginia
Why make it light weight with no wing or aero?
Because that cool looking aero stuff creates drag - a LOT of drag, and kills speed. If you want to slow a fast car down on a long straight, stick a wing and flared fenders on it. Where the Aero stuff comes into play is with a track suspension (super firm), slicks or at least R-Compound tires, and then your corner speeds go way up. However on street tires and with a street suspension, the car will be faster without it and in a narrow body chassis.
To take this a step further, look at Ferrari. They build their aerodynamics into the underpan of the car and use splitters and diverters. They don't hang wings on their cars. Its faster that way.
Because that cool looking aero stuff creates drag - a LOT of drag, and kills speed. If you want to slow a fast car down on a long straight, stick a wing and flared fenders on it. Where the Aero stuff comes into play is with a track suspension (super firm), slicks or at least R-Compound tires, and then your corner speeds go way up. However on street tires and with a street suspension, the car will be faster without it and in a narrow body chassis.
To take this a step further, look at Ferrari. They build their aerodynamics into the underpan of the car and use splitters and diverters. They don't hang wings on their cars. Its faster that way.
Race Car
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,489
Likes: 136
From: Europe
Why make it light weight with no wing or aero? Because that cool looking aero stuff creates drag - a LOT of drag, and kills speed. If you want to slow a fast car down on a long straight, stick a wing and flared fenders on it. Where the Aero stuff comes into play is with a track suspension (super firm), slicks or at least R-Compound tires, and then your corner speeds go way up. However on street tires and with a street suspension, the car will be faster without it and in a narrow body chassis. To take this a step further, look at Ferrari. They build their aerodynamics into the underpan of the car and use splitters and diverters. They don't hang wings on their cars. Its faster that way.
Ok, thanks! That makes a lot of sense.
A lightweight MT with no aero for canyon runs. I still can't understand the targeted buyer. But, Porsche always deliver the goods.
We have to wait and see!
Thread Starter
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Joined: Feb 2007
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From: My garage, where else?
I think you could save a lot of money by ordering a 911 like the GTS and focusing on deleting as much weight as possible by skipping all the doo-dads and must-haves. If I recall correctly, the GTS makes 430hp and the GT3 around 450hp. The power to weight ratio gets pretty close when you strip a few hundred pounds out of the GTS. It won't have the cool factor of a 911R, but you could probably save huge money. An added bonus is that a GTS can be had with no aero right out of the box. Think about that. A GT3 costs more because of the added aero (among other things) and if this 911R is real they are then going to CHARGE money to remove it!
Of course you won't get the magnesium roof and rear wheel steering, but if what we're reading is true, this is intended to be a more livable version of a GT3, and I don't believe that those features will ever come into play for most owners. Porsche being who they are, the focus is on bilking their wealthier clientele who need to constantly have exclusivity. We can laugh all the way to the bank while they buy this 'rare' car.
My two cents.
Of course you won't get the magnesium roof and rear wheel steering, but if what we're reading is true, this is intended to be a more livable version of a GT3, and I don't believe that those features will ever come into play for most owners. Porsche being who they are, the focus is on bilking their wealthier clientele who need to constantly have exclusivity. We can laugh all the way to the bank while they buy this 'rare' car.
My two cents.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 26,158
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From: S.F Bay Area
Rennlist Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 26,158
Likes: 3,924
From: S.F Bay Area
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Joined: Feb 2004
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From: Los Angeles
Been waiting for them to build a car like this for a decade.
Hate spoilers. They look ridiculous rolling through streets of LA IMO, whether on a jacked up Civic or a GT3. If I lived in Germany where they would be useful, sure. But I have no need for all of that downforce here. Nor do I need to trim tenths shifting with PDK. I have no plans to enter any new Porsche in a competition event. Would rather save the weight and add involvement with a true manual.
GTS is a nice package, but the standard 9A1 is a bit pedestrian, and I want something more focused.
Indeed we'll have to wait and see. Hopefully this car will not be a victim of VW's cutbacks.
Race Car
Joined: Nov 2013
Posts: 4,489
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From: Europe
Yeh, I love wings and spoilers and carbon fiber. Downforce is more important than top speed for me. It's a good thing they make cars that suits all of our crazy needs.
I was asked if I was interested in a 911R but turned it down because lack of aero.
But, I have a few friends that would love this car if it was offered with a back seat.
I was asked if I was interested in a 911R but turned it down because lack of aero.
But, I have a few friends that would love this car if it was offered with a back seat.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 26,158
Likes: 3,924
From: S.F Bay Area
*raises hand*
Been waiting for them to build a car like this for a decade.
Hate spoilers. They look ridiculous rolling through streets of LA IMO, whether on a jacked up Civic or a GT3. If I lived in Germany where they would be useful, sure. But I have no need for all of that downforce here. Nor do I need to trim tenths shifting with PDK. I have no plans to enter any new Porsche in a competition event. Would rather save the weight and add involvement with a true manual.
GTS is a nice package, but the standard 9A1 is a bit pedestrian, and I want something more focused.
Indeed we'll have to wait and see. Hopefully this car will not be a victim of VW's cutbacks.
Been waiting for them to build a car like this for a decade.
Hate spoilers. They look ridiculous rolling through streets of LA IMO, whether on a jacked up Civic or a GT3. If I lived in Germany where they would be useful, sure. But I have no need for all of that downforce here. Nor do I need to trim tenths shifting with PDK. I have no plans to enter any new Porsche in a competition event. Would rather save the weight and add involvement with a true manual.
GTS is a nice package, but the standard 9A1 is a bit pedestrian, and I want something more focused.
Indeed we'll have to wait and see. Hopefully this car will not be a victim of VW's cutbacks.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,054
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From: Los Angeles, CA
Crossing my fingers for some sort of official announcement that the .2GT3 manual is coming.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 2014
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From: Carlsbad, California
Instructor
Joined: Aug 2015
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From: Westwood, MA
GTS is much closer to S than GT3.. GT cars are different breed, with Power to weight ratio being only a small part of the difference (991GT3 has 475hp not 450). Suspension, sway bars, brakes, and PDK-S all make for a more "special" and customizable driving experience, in addition to downforce provided by the much-maligned wing.
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Joined: Sep 2014
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From: ..............
GTS is much closer to S than GT3.. GT cars are different breed, with Power to weight ratio being only a small part of the difference (991GT3 has 475hp not 450). Suspension, sway bars, brakes, and PDK-S all make for a more "special" and customizable driving experience, in addition to downforce provided by the much-maligned wing.
could not agree more
997 or 991 gen - go drive an s, then a gts then a gt3 on a nice back road or track, somewhere where you can open up the car and take some curves
will be clear as night and day