RADManZulu

I have a C4S 7MT and I don't have this.

ubitz

I checked and the noise in my car has nothing to do with the exhaust. It happens when you press the clutch between 1000 and 2000 RPMs in first gear. It does it all the time.

Porsche said it is normal simply because there are other cars doing it. I tried few other 7MT non 4S and they don't do it. Even a 4 was perfectly quiet.

I will try to escalate this to get someone at Porsche in Germany to look into this.

Anybody had experience in contacting directly Porsche in Germany?

It's really annoying, I'm considering to sell the car. It sounds broken .. not what I expected from a car of this caliber.

n2cars

Many many years ago I had a car make that sound. It was a bad throw out bearing. Do modern clutches still have throw out bearings?

LexVan

Yes.

John@Fabspeed

Possible flywheel rattle? Do these cars use a dual mass flywheel?

LexVan

Yes. dual mass FW. Not a LWFW.

ubitz

Boris, have you had a chance to check again on your car?

John@Fabspeed

That could very well be the sound IMO. My E46 M3 also has a dual mass flywheel and I get the same noise every time in the same condition as the OP stated.

One that that helped me diagnose that it was the flywheel was how I shut the car off.

Car in neutral, foot off of the clutch completely, shut engine off and hear a massive rattle, like marbles in a tin can.

Car in neutral, clutch fully depressed, shut off engine and the sound is completely gone. Maybe that could work for you to tell if it is your flywheel making the sound as well?

ubitz

I have some videos with a reasonable sound reporting on the noise when I shift from 1st to 2nd gear around 2000 RPMs:


When you watch them consider that I am not touching the stick shift ever!

Do you like the rattle? I don't!

I escalate this to Porsche America ... I will post here their answer.

What do you think about the noise?

9914s

My car has the same noise not as loud and it's also a 4s. Try not touching the gas pedal when changing gears and see if you still hear the rattle.

Edit my noise is nowhere as loud as yours. There's definitely something wrong with it.

ubitz

I agree with you, the noise is way too laud and it cannot be normal. Porsche keeps insisting it is. Maybe having few people with the same issue will help escalating this and getting in resolved.

I will post their letters, meanwhile I will keep trying by contacting a manager at Porsche Customer Service and also by calling directly in Germany.

Z356

RE: Your PM you sent me today.

ubitz:

I read/listen to your posts. I agree with you that it doesn't sound normal. But let me clarify first that I do not have a manual 991 nor I am at all knowledgeable about 'mechanical' matters.

You have the right to ask for a meeting with the technical representative of PCNA for your dealer's zone. I am sure you have filed a case with the 800 number with (you think) someone at 'Porsche'. Unfortunately, that is just a hired outside customer service by PCNA and the workers there (which are based in Michigan not Georgia) are NOT actual PCNA employees! They referred to themselves as 'Porsche Contact Center' and email using the following address: <customer.commitment@porsche.us>. I am not too impressed with that 'Porsche Contact Center' or their personnel from my own experience with them in recent past.

You need to raise your technical issue up to someone at PCNA in Atlanta. They usually call from real telephone numbers that are not an 800 # like those of 'Customer Commitment'. They have 720 area codes! Keep pushing until you get that meeting with the regional technical rep!

The second thing to do is to take your car to another dealer that might have more expertise. We have one only here in Monterey. But if you are in the Bay Area, you have quite a number of choices! Ask around here at Rennlist the names of particular dealer service departments our forum members have had 'great', not just 'good', experience and perhaps get a specific name for a mechanic or service advisor.

If you still have doubts, take it to Alex Ross & James Hendry at Sharkwerks in Fremont, CA. It will cost you 30 or 60 minutes of shop time which you will have to pay for out of your pocket...but you'll get an independent opinion as to the 'problem'!

http://www.sharkwerks.com/aboutus.php

And what you learn you can use to your advantage in talking to your Porsche dealer(s) & PCNA.

Talking to PAG Germany at this stage of your issue is not a good investment of time. Do the other stuff first and establish what YOUR mechanical issue truly is before you take it up all the way to Germany. Ultimately, your issue will be solved here by PCNA. The chances of PAG getting involved in any meaningful way is VERY VERY remote.

That is my advice...for what it's worth.

Saludos,
Eduardo
Carmel

ubitz

Eduardo,

Thank you so much for your suggestions. Getting a second opinion will definitely help getting this clarified. I just called Sharkwerks to set an appointment next week and I will also try with some other PCNA dealer here in the Bay Area.

The car has been seen by a PCNA field manager who determined that the vibration/rattle/noise is normal based 1 (one) other car making it. After that I was able to escalate the issue to PCNA Atlanta, but so far I bounced back based on the same assessment made by the same field manager -- no further investigation. I am trying to talk with another manager in Atlanta next week hoping he will be willing to get someone else in engineering to re-asses. At the moment I prefer to omit more details, names, and quotes from PCNA in the hope they will rectify this.

I am just trying to get someone from PCNA engineering to look into this, someone who knows about the actual design and testing of the gearbox -- why are they making so difficult to get directly to somenone who knows exactly what is happening?

{U}

ubitz

Is there anybody else who is experiencing the same issue?

I just chatted with Porsche in Atlanta and they would really appreciate other 911 4S 7MT owner to report the issue.

If you contact me here with a private email, I can then give you the email of J. at Porsche USA to get instructions about the reporting.

brianja

I just came upon this thread from the new one that you started directing people here.

As I said there, my 2013 991 C4S was in the first batch of C4Ss built and was shipped over in November '12 with a delivery on the first day that PCNA would allow for C4s in very early '13.

I have almost 14k miles on the car and I've never noticed a noise like you are describing.

I just did my morning commute (which is mostly slow, street light to street light driving) keeping your description from this thread in mind. I kept my 1-2 shifts around 2k rpm and definitely did NOT have the same noise / rattle.