hockeyguy

Picked up my new C2S Guards Red/black pdk cabriolet today. It's fantastic. Unbelievable, really, coming from a 997.2 (and a Cayman before that)! Pics coming...
Here's what's CRAZY about the 2 year lease. My total payments over 2 years (10K miles/year), adds up close to $45K. But any miles after that are charged at a "standard" rate of 30 cents/mile (just like a Honda Accord, for example). Think about it. It essentially costs me $22K dollars in year one for 10K miles, and another $22K to drive 10K more miles in year two. But if I go over the milage limit by a huge amount like an extra 10K miles, it only costs me $3,000 extra! If I put on 20K extra miles, it will cost me extra a total of $6,000. That's crazy! The first allotted 20K miles costs me $45K, while an extra 20K miles over the limit will only cost me $6K. They're giving away those miles on a $130K car for practically nothing.
I imagine Porsche would be unhappy getting the car back at 2 years with 40K miles on it and me writing him a check for only $6,000.!!!

(For that matter, why not put on 50K miles--if you can-- to the limit of the warranty.)

adamsclubs

Interesting observation. People don't put miles on cars like 911, that Porsche is certain of

hockeyguy

Yes, people most people use their 911 sparingly and as their toys. Makes sense if you're buying and keeping it for years. But if you've leased, and are paying that huge sum for only 20K or so miles total in 2 years, why not take advantage of the NEARLY FREE extra miles (at only 30 cents/mile penalty) if you can?
I drive between 25-30K miles per year total (have a Lexus GS F-Sport Daily driver as other car), but I've decided to put 20K miles per year on my 911.
When I turn in my car after my two year lease with 40K miles on it, I will happily write a check to Porsche for $6000 extra milage penalty What a deal!!!! 20K extra miles on a $130K supercar for only $6,000. Unbelievable really. (Yes, there's the extra tire costs, but that's always the case, even if you own. Also, turn it in maybe at 39K miles, before the 40K mile MAJOR service, which can cost big bucks)

hockeyguy

Here are photos.. cell phone ones at the dealer, so they're pretty lousy.
It was a floor model. Specs:

2013 Carrera S Cabriolet
Guards Red/Black Standard interior
PDK
Sports Chrono
Sport Exhaust
Premium Package Plus (14-way power seats, etc)
Bose Package
Wheels painted Platinum

(and NO Power Steering Plus!!! Almost all Cabs in dealer inventories have Power Steering Plus, which I hated on test drives)

gota911

Sweet! The the wheels look good with the red.

carsrmyvice

I hear you brother. I just leased a c2 for 18,000 miles per year 24 months. They only charged me 25 cents a mile for the extra 3k a year and the residual was fantastic on the 15k lease, 74%!. Can you say drive the wheels off a 991 for 1200 a month, nada down of course! Yahtzee

adamsclubs

20k miles is still low mileage car, and mostly highway miles I assume, because people don't use 911 for daily local errands. Porsche can easily move it with another $6k off.

Most 911s are driven 5 to 10k and driven hard on the track.

carsrmyvice

5-10K I agree. But most 911s making it to the track, doubtful. I think its akin to most range rovers never making it off pavement. I could be wrong.

Carrera GT

The lease you're describing sounds like the usual deal from PFS. I think our $130K 991S is about $1500/month for 60 months, at which point its residual value will be determined by the amount of fuel in the tank. (Just look at a five year old 997 that started at $130K in 2008 ...)

The lease products are based on actual data -- they give a pretty realistic outlook of residual value.

If you're interested in the mechanics of the lease product, I'd suggest reading the details. Assuming it's a Porsche Financial Services lease, their two year lease is the most expensive way to drive the car (since that product attempts to capture all of the worst of the depreciation curve.) You'll probably find there are terms and conditions that stipulate the vehicle condition (gone are the days of returning the old BMW with 50K miles, no service, no brake pads, bald tires and a goat pen in the back seat.) As a ball park, a new 911 with lose about $1000/month in value as a baseline, if the car is msrp'd above average or is a unique model, that's perhaps $2000/month (more like the 997 Cabrio in your example.) You're getting a "free" ride on low interest rates, making it better to buy a longer term, say five years or 60 months, in order to have the opportunity in 2015 (say) to decide that the replacement car and a lease which could be at a much higher interest rate and less attractive terms, is not worth the cost to update. Of course if the vehicle is somehow a business expense deduction, then no matter.

In any case, it sounds like you shoppe around and became well informed of what you want and what's available to drive off the lot. I think a red cab with red belts and black cabin, not too many froufrou options to jack up the sticker -- all goes towards a happy driving experience and reasonable resale value. You should have no trouble putting that car in the classifieds and getting a decent private sale price at about the cost to exit the lease.

Now your best plan would be to take the $45K and buy gold, silver, platinum and palladium today. I'd suggest buying mint coins, but you could buy futures and sell options against them to further reduce your cost basis. The worst thing you could do is leave that capital in US Dollars or in stocks with the market at all time highs.

GSIRM3

I guess we all look at things differently, but to me, spending 45K+ for two years on a car that I am just going to give back at the end of that period does not seem like a good deal. 45K to rent a car for two years?

sambb

I sort of dont get it either - if the 991 is such a great car, why wouldnt one own it for 4-8 years? I understand that maintenance can be an issue. But once you are 2 years in, havent you paid for the depreciation? Is there something better coming in 2 years that I dont know about? Nevertheless, it seems like it makes sense to a lot of people - at a local dealer, the salesman told me that ~80% are leased in their hands. True?

carsrmyvice

Leasing does not make sense for anyone willing to own a car for 4-8 years. It is a premium paid to lock in the depreciation. I could walk in and pay cash only to have some clown rear end me at the first light and my car is now worth 10-20k less because it is no longer cpo material for a dealer. Also some states allow you to dodge the tax on the residual. In ny that is a lot of money. And of course there is always something new coming out. If you are likely to want something new in 3 years then leasing is far and away the best way to do it. Nobody said driving new 911s was cheap! Of course when the options list grows so does the depreciation, just as if you owned it. No need to own an asset that is rapidly depreciating and subject to risk of further depreciation under terms which are not in your control.

adamsclubs

Good point, a lease makes sense if it is a good lease. At 74% residual, Porsche is eating a lot of the initial depreciation. For $1,200 a month, that is only $28.8k for two years, not $45k.

In April, Porsche has 27 mo lease for 911 cab. MSRP $112k, 27mo 5k miles, $1,089/mo with $3,500 drive off. That's about $35k for 27 months, tax included.

hockeyguy

True...that's my situation. It' my 3rd Porsche in 4 years. The last one, my 997.2, I got into an accident with, and now my trade-in value is lousy. In 2 yrs I'll probably want a 991 Turbo, so leasing I think is fine for me.

hockeyguy

I'll buy gold in a bit, when it drops to $1500 per ounce. In terms of stocks, 80% of my portfolio is in biotechs, my field of interest. I'll either be rich (maybe soon) or very sorry. I only need one of my speculative biotechs to hit it big.