blackcheetah

So my M800-GTS are back to tial for maintenance (shaftplay and refresh) so im back on base turbo for the winter and they realy suprise me today

To compare this is my old gts turbo with apr gts stage3 i did 10.8@130mph


Now today with my base turbo btw back on stock headers manifold...

Now heres the 1/4mile with lots of tire spinning with good grip i could do 10.5 i think
Aniway 11.1@129mph on stock base turbo is amazing...

F355bob

Are you still on APR stage 3 tune and what else is not stock?

blackcheetah

Im on base turbo and protomotive cobb protune with meth ,Im also on soull test pipe ,Tial i/c and intake ,stock muffler and stock exhaust manifold...

thesaintusa

Is the Protune for the base turbos? or the GTS turbos?

i.e. are you running a protune for GTS turbos, but using base turbos?

Impressive #s.

Any thoughts on why you have shaft play? how many km did you have on the m800 set? You care clearly making big #s, but I would expect that you would be within the operating parameters of the turbos and surprised that you would need a rebuild so soon.

@4 Point 0 how many km have you logged on your set and any concerns for turbo issues?

I have puts 15000+ on different sets of aftermarket turbos (on various cars) with ZERO issues, and I would hope with improving turbo tech / bearings etc that durability would be more than a season.

blackcheetah

@thesaintusa my protomotive protune work for base,gts and m800 all the same tune i have 3400hpa max on this software so can play with the boost controller myself ( boost controller compatible with vaccum)i have meth also to play with my tune
so heres my number on that software
My best on base 6.6 sec 100-200 and 11.1@129mph
My best on gts 5.8sec 100-200 10.8@136.5mph
My best on m800 4.5sec 100-200 and 10.2@141mph

So i have bin pushing hard the M800 in the 34psi range but i think that is what damage the m800 cuz they spin way to much
I asked Todd from protomotive that i will run much lower boost on m800 in the future my target is around 25-28psi max now ,i asked to add more timing and play with the lambda ..
But for this winter i will enjoy my base turbo cuz i like them they make good low end torque ,spool fast and make plenty of power


This is the gts protuned ,traction was bad

This is my m800 protuned i had good traction on this one


This is my shop who tested MY GTS APR stage 3


APR GTS STAGE3 on the dyno making around 500whp

Nathan_

Great numbers for base turbos, my best 100-200 is 6.89 on base turbos on winter tyres, have added a new diff since then but still not sure I could go as fast as your car - nice result!

What fuel are you on? All mine on regular Shell V Power 99 Octane unleaded (am in the UK so same as 93 USA I think).

blackcheetah

Cool you did great mate im on winter tire also 94oct and some meth , what tune you have?

Nathan_

Tune is 9e (nine excellence in the UK https://www.nineexcellence.com )
No meth, just regular petrol

Tial intercoolers
Tial inlets
Kline headers
Kline 200 cell cats
Kline Exhaust
BMC filter
Tractive dampers (reduced time by 0.4 seconds!)

Carrera T PDK for reference

Have added a wavetrac diff now so need to go do some times again - if you are after a diff for the base PDK which comes with an open diff there don’t seem to be many options, not been on track with the car but for road use it makes a big difference to traction so I think it will show a bit of an improvement, not 6.6 though!

New turbos next for me but unsure which way to go, will add tial elbows at the same time, I think ideally I would like the car to make max power near the rev limiter. What is your experience with power delivery of the options you have tried? Would be good with 600+bhp at the crank, not chasing crazy numbers, more interested in moving max power up the rev range.

blackcheetah

Hey great setup you have i like it
You have great suspension upgrade too i was looking to buy tractive too..what is your spring rate?and camber?
For the turbo Gts deliver great power up top and give à steady 26-27psi max up top you will make 600hp on gts and you are on the safe side...
If you want 700 and up GTS-M800 are awesome turbo's but you will destroy your clutch and your on the edge of your engine ...they can flow 34psi++but i have blew an engine at that power
For the base turbo try to shift around 6800rpm as you stay in the powerband (21-22psi) but if you shift at 7500 boost drop at 16psi i have found that 6800 shift do better time

Nathan_

Thanks for the info on turbos.

Started on the standard Tractive progressive springs, they weren’t for me, just felt too soft. I have the touring line kit that retains the OEM top mounts - not interested in too much harshness, have access to race cars for that stuff, Carrera T is my daily driver.

Currently on 50/120 linear with helpers, can’t remember on those, maybe 20s?, going to drop down to 40/100 to make the car faster over bumpy roads, especially in cold and wet conditions. Want the car to
flow over the ground - Tractive told me 50/120 was too stiff to be fast over British B roads and they were right…

4 Point 0

I have put roughly 6,000 miles on the M800’s. Zero issues.
I’m still running 27 PSI. Until I get more cooling, I won’t turn them up any higher. Once all the additional cooling is sorted, I’ll most likely turn them up to 30PSI.


@Nathan Those B roads must be something else.
33/108 is stock GTS and that is pitifully soft.
45/120 is stock GT3 and they compensate with stiffer shocks and software.

I’d be playing with the software. 50/120 is what Tom recommends to guys who don’t track and want stock type feel. Our roads definitely are lacking, and I am ok with my MR track Spec 120/170 on the street. Its a dream on the track. Its firm on the street, but I have had cars that were lower spring rate and shook your fillings out. I think my setup is so dialled in, it just works.

It seems to me that there are sweet spots along the way where the springs, valves and software all work as a perfect team. Whereas other combinations, whilst softer, aren’t working together and feel off. Perhaps this is partially due to certain rates being developed more. Meaning when the guys who develop have a car with certain rates, those get far more time and development.

One more thing to consider.
At 75/150 the rear felt too stiff. When hitting a bump, the difference between front hitting and then double stiffness rear hitting was off putting. When I changed to 100/150 not only did the car come alive handling wise, but it felt better over speed bumps etc because it was far more similar thump front to rear, if that makes sense.

If I were you, I wouldn’t soften the rear, I’d stiffen the front. Make them more balanced and even. 70/120. In my Opinion will “Feel” better. It will definitely turn and stop better. Won’t dive and pitch as much. My 0.02c. YMMV.

Nathan_

I hear ya, and thanks for the input.

The car leaves the ground too much now, the damping is superb in controlling the wheels but it is hard to feel in control of the car with wheels in the air - makes it kinda difficult to steer or brake… Then in the cold (do you get that?) and wet conditions it is really hard to get the tyres to turn on, think wet and 4-5 degrees, I actually think more roll will help that. I went out in the 997 GT3 owned by Tractive UK and that is on 40/100 and it was mega cross country - if I can get that compliance over bad roads in normal mode whilst having sport mode for smoother roads I’ll be happy.

Worst case is I swap them again, pretty cheap to experiment with it, the Tractive on the track car are much, much stiffer so will meet with your approval