Long time lurker, first time poster.

I have been looking for a weekender car for a few months, coming close a few times, but not having purchased yet. I have learned a tremendous amount reading here, and for that I thank you all.

Recently came across a 2016 911 Carrera 4 Black Edition. Love the car, and the build list, but have never seen a 4 that wasn't a 4S. (But I often see S's that are not 4S's!)

Is this unusual? Are there any things to consider - weight, complexity, power? It is a PDK car, so manual clutching is not an issue.

Thank you for your assistance!

 

Have had a 2013 Carrera 4 PDK for over 4 years as a daily driver (7000 miles/year) and it's the best car I've ever owned in my 74 years. Put the winter wheel/tire set on in November and take off in April. 350 hp. is plenty for me and the oil changes are easy. You will have no regrets.

 

Non S 4s are rare indeed albeit not worth anymore than the other so don't let someone tell you otherwise. Basically, the non-S has a less powerful engine. Someone here was looking for a new 4 and talked to numerous dealers and could not even find an allocation for one since he was told that very few were available since the demand was very low.

 

C4s are indeed rare. I tried ordering a new 2018 C4 but there were no allocations. There were only five cars in the country (US) and all PDKs. So I ended up ordering a C4S. In the 991.2, I couldn't discern a big difference between the performance of the two turbo engines.
In the 991.1, I prefer the larger 3.8 L in the S and 4S models. I had a Boxster S with the 3.4 and 315 hp in a lighter car. The car was fast (not as fast as my C4S) but I had to always keep it in a lower gear to get the performance. On the same backroads, I used to leave my Boxster in second or third whereas in my C4S I can be in third or fourth because of the torque.

 

I would never be able to get over the 3.4L vs 3.8L and the brakes.

 

I was the one Bob Z referred to regarding a C4.

I did indeed look for a C4. After driving different models and trims, the base engine had sufficient power for me. Enthusiast reviews found initial acceleration to be very responsive (possibly due to the smaller turbos spinning up quicker). There's a 50HP difference between base and S. For everyday driving a base would be more than adequate.

My order for an optioned base C4 was a no, the explanation was no more base models available late in the 991.2 production run, they would be glad to build a 4S.

Ended up with the C4S, of course it was substantially more than my initial configuration but if a wanted to buy, other options were virtually non-existent.

You won't be disappointed with a C4S, I'm enjoying mine very much.

Of note:

Carrera turbo engines have so much torque down low that you can have the revs around 3k and accelerate hard w/o issue. Just did the PTX at Barber Motorsports and ran the course in a manual GTS using only 3-4 shifts for the entire track. Instructors said you could run 4th gear only w/o an issue. Impressive.

 

A lot depends on how much you get into the whole scene. My first Porsche was a C4, it was phenomenal, and I got a killer deal on it. But as I got more into it all, niggling in the back of my mind I half regretted not getting an S. No particular reason, mind you; the C4 did absolutely everything I ever asked of it.

 

Probably my play. Get this, enjoy for the two year plus CPO period, move up to what's next....

 

I get the bigger motor, since you can enjoy the higher hp on the street. But the brakes on every modern 911 are capable of locking the wheels (not including the ABS). The limiting factor of brake "power" is tires.

Yes, on a track after many laps, bigger brakes could be better. But a C4 or C4S is not a track machine, right?

 

The S brakes are fine for occasional track use and overkill for street. As for what is a track car, I've seen every type of model at local autocross events.

If you're going for serious tracking, ceramics are the way to go, they're phenomenal. Drove them at a Barber PTX over two days and there was no fade plus stopping capacity that has to be experienced first hand.

 

I think if you only ever drove the C4, you would be super happy with it. I borrowed a C4 convertible years ago and thought it was plenty fun to drive. Then wanted to find a one pre owned and couldn’t then wanted a new one and couldn’t find that. They really did not build many. In the end I felt the GTS was a better package for a car that is going to be kept for a while.

 

Have enjoyed my 2014 C4 since 2016 with 40k miles now. 350 hp is plenty of power for me and I can drive it all year round (with snows all round from November to March). My advice is don't think you need more power and bigger brakes unless you track the car. If so, maybe go for a C4S otherwise a C4 is a great car.

 

what I realized while shopping for a 911 is that it is very difficult to find the car you really want unless you order it. They are all differently specced and there are endless possibilities, colours, seats, transmissions, trims, painted bits, convertible, engine, suspension etc etc etc etc. you prob will have to make a concession on something, so my advice to you is make a list of what's really important and try to aim for 75% of that on a used car. maybe you will end up with a 4 or a 4s or a gts, but at least you'll get the things that matter the most to you. :-)

 

This is the essential to ownership.

The "S" is window dressing.

IMO

 

I drove an 991S and non S when I was looking and liked the "feel" of the S with PDK. I liked the non S with a MT. Mine is not a 4, however, so slightly lighter weight. I'm referring to the 991.1 generation.