Lowering options on a 991.2
05-07-2020, 01:09 PM
#16
Rennlist Member
Stout, if I remember correctly, you had the TechArts with the DSC controller - do you still have that setup installed? If so, how do you like it now, considering you've had it for some time?
Eibach can apparently make linear-rate springs on demand. If I had it to do over again, this is the way I'd go if possible.
The TechArts look good but PASM doesn't like progressive spring rates. It isn't awful by any means, and actually rides a bit nicer around town, but the factory spring rates were better and PASM was set up for them. DSC has helped a bit, but its maker says linear rate springs are what's needed.
Short of serious coil-overs, I don't see the point of throwing out the PASM dampers—they're actually quite good.
The TechArts look good but PASM doesn't like progressive spring rates. It isn't awful by any means, and actually rides a bit nicer around town, but the factory spring rates were better and PASM was set up for them. DSC has helped a bit, but its maker says linear rate springs are what's needed.
Short of serious coil-overs, I don't see the point of throwing out the PASM dampers—they're actually quite good.
05-07-2020, 02:38 PM
#17
Rennlist Member
I cannot recommend any of the available options I have seen so far. It's a void someone will fill, sooner or later. Or, at least, I hope it is.
I had to ferry another car to a show last year and ended up driving next to my Carrera on LA freeways, and you can see what's wrong as the car goes down the road. It porpoises more than the stock car would, as the dampers try to cancel the secondary oscillation but don't get it quite right. Again, it isn't horrible—but it isn't spot on, either. And who doesn't want spot on in a 911? Especially when the 991.2 chassis is so good from the factory no matter which suspension is in there. There has to be a nice compromise with a spring set that keeps a linear rate, drops the car to 991.1 SPASM height or TechArt height (I'd actually prefer the slightly higher 991.1 SPASM height), and is then attenuated by DSC. I wouldn't mind a bit more spring than stock, but would love to keep the ride as close to stock as possible—and DSC would certainly help there.
Otoh, a lot of people are perfectly happy with the TechArt springs—and you might be also. Consider mine one take. The thing with suspension is the cost for install isn't cheap. Doing it twice is worse.
Tried to link two of the good guys, TPC and Sharkwerks, up to do this, and offered use of my car for development/testing (might be a fun Rennlist thread), but TPC doesn't need my help. They know how a car should sit, and how to dial a chassis in on their own turf. Still hoping they'll consider offering a spring set for Carreras and Carrera Ts. The latter don't need it as badly from a visual standpoint, but the 991.2 SPASM is clearly set higher than the 991.1 SPASM was. Suspect one spring set might even be able to service all 991.2 Carrera/S/T regardless of PASM or SPASM.
Last edited by stout; 05-07-2020 at 02:55 PM.
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05-07-2020, 03:02 PM
#18
Rennlist Member
Eibach can apparently make linear-rate springs on demand. If I had it to do over again, this is the way I'd go if possible.
The TechArts look good but PASM doesn't like progressive spring rates. It isn't awful by any means, and actually rides a bit nicer around town, but the factory spring rates were better and PASM was set up for them. DSC has helped a bit, but its maker says linear rate springs are what's needed.
Short of serious coil-overs, I don't see the point of throwing out the PASM dampers—they're actually quite good.
The TechArts look good but PASM doesn't like progressive spring rates. It isn't awful by any means, and actually rides a bit nicer around town, but the factory spring rates were better and PASM was set up for them. DSC has helped a bit, but its maker says linear rate springs are what's needed.
Short of serious coil-overs, I don't see the point of throwing out the PASM dampers—they're actually quite good.
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/1098...-thinking.html
I have been struggling with what to do - my base is too soft and also not low enough. I tossed around buying a used set of GTS springs and mating that with the sway bars, which I believe is the only differences from a suspension perspective between a base and an S/GTS? I also thought about seeing if I could order custom springs, which is what I believe forum member 4 point 0 did but there will be some research needed to understand spring lengths with respect to spring rates. Personally I would like something a bit stiffer than a GTS but within spec if what S/PASM can handle.
Mostly though this is just a thought exercise for me as I am feeling somewhat cheap these days...
05-07-2020, 04:02 PM
#19
Intermediate
Maybe this is the one you are speaking of?
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/1098...-thinking.html
Yes. Thank you. Subscribed!
I think the best plan for me is custom springs with a dsc v3. Sway bars would help. I would love TPC to jump in here. I use mine as a DD more than anything but want to start participating in club events.
https://rennlist.com/forums/991/1098...-thinking.html
Yes. Thank you. Subscribed!
I think the best plan for me is custom springs with a dsc v3. Sway bars would help. I would love TPC to jump in here. I use mine as a DD more than anything but want to start participating in club events.
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freshness (08-31-2021)
05-07-2020, 04:17 PM
#20
Rennlist Member
Stout, thank you for this. I am actually in process of installing the TechArt springs on a Base 991.2... I went in going that they're 95% there, but I was able to get them at under half price, and am doing the install myself.... so figured when adding budget into the equation, I should be happy... (fingers crossed, for now) 
The ideal scenario would be TPC offering a spring set designed to work with its DSC box. Mike and Tom know their stuff on spring rates, and if they offered a rear bar, I'd be interested in that too. They also think about the details, like bump steer, etc. Just wish there was something attractive between stock SUV height and full-on coil-over setups that are overkill for a street car—especially one with perfectly fine PASM dampers.
I cannot recommend any of the available options I have seen so far. It's a void someone will fill, sooner or later. Or, at least, I hope it is.
I did about 2 years/15,000 miles ago after spending 1.5 years and 14,000 miles with the stock setup (and testing a bunch of others 991.2s with PASM as well as SPASM). Sharkwerks handled the install, and did a great job. While I am very impressed with the DSC controller, I cannot say I am as enthusiastic about the TechArt springs—but it should be noted that I've been accused of having a damper fetish and have been thoroughly spoiled while road and track testing Porsche's very best chassis as well as a (very) few aftermarket setups that really were brilliant. The TechArt springs are actually ride a bit nicer than stock in most situations due to their progressive rate coils, but PASM isn't designed to suddenly transition to higher spring rates—like when you hit a transition on a freeway or certain other bumps. It's a "5% of the time" problem, but the stock setup did it better.
I had to ferry another car to a show last year and ended up driving next to my Carrera on LA freeways, and you can see what's wrong as the car goes down the road. It porpoises more than the stock car would, as the dampers try to cancel the secondary oscillation but don't get it quite right. Again, it isn't horrible—but it isn't spot on, either. And who doesn't want spot on in a 911? Especially when the 991.2 chassis is so good from the factory no matter which suspension is in there. There has to be a nice compromise with a spring set that keeps a linear rate, drops the car to 991.1 SPASM height or TechArt height (I'd actually prefer the slightly higher 991.1 SPASM height), and is then attenuated by DSC. I wouldn't mind a bit more spring than stock, but would love to keep the ride as close to stock as possible—and DSC would certainly help there.
Otoh, a lot of people are perfectly happy with the TechArt springs—and you might be also. Consider mine one take. The thing with suspension is the cost for install isn't cheap. Doing it twice is worse.
Tried to link two of the good guys, TPC and Sharkwerks, up to do this, and offered use of my car for development/testing (might be a fun Rennlist thread), but TPC doesn't need my help. They know how a car should sit, and how to dial a chassis in on their own turf. Still hoping they'll consider offering a spring set for Carreras and Carrera Ts. The latter don't need it as badly from a visual standpoint, but the 991.2 SPASM is clearly set higher than the 991.1 SPASM was. Suspect one spring set might even be able to service all 991.2 Carrera/S/T regardless of PASM or SPASM.
I cannot recommend any of the available options I have seen so far. It's a void someone will fill, sooner or later. Or, at least, I hope it is.
I did about 2 years/15,000 miles ago after spending 1.5 years and 14,000 miles with the stock setup (and testing a bunch of others 991.2s with PASM as well as SPASM). Sharkwerks handled the install, and did a great job. While I am very impressed with the DSC controller, I cannot say I am as enthusiastic about the TechArt springs—but it should be noted that I've been accused of having a damper fetish and have been thoroughly spoiled while road and track testing Porsche's very best chassis as well as a (very) few aftermarket setups that really were brilliant. The TechArt springs are actually ride a bit nicer than stock in most situations due to their progressive rate coils, but PASM isn't designed to suddenly transition to higher spring rates—like when you hit a transition on a freeway or certain other bumps. It's a "5% of the time" problem, but the stock setup did it better.
I had to ferry another car to a show last year and ended up driving next to my Carrera on LA freeways, and you can see what's wrong as the car goes down the road. It porpoises more than the stock car would, as the dampers try to cancel the secondary oscillation but don't get it quite right. Again, it isn't horrible—but it isn't spot on, either. And who doesn't want spot on in a 911? Especially when the 991.2 chassis is so good from the factory no matter which suspension is in there. There has to be a nice compromise with a spring set that keeps a linear rate, drops the car to 991.1 SPASM height or TechArt height (I'd actually prefer the slightly higher 991.1 SPASM height), and is then attenuated by DSC. I wouldn't mind a bit more spring than stock, but would love to keep the ride as close to stock as possible—and DSC would certainly help there.
Otoh, a lot of people are perfectly happy with the TechArt springs—and you might be also. Consider mine one take. The thing with suspension is the cost for install isn't cheap. Doing it twice is worse.
Tried to link two of the good guys, TPC and Sharkwerks, up to do this, and offered use of my car for development/testing (might be a fun Rennlist thread), but TPC doesn't need my help. They know how a car should sit, and how to dial a chassis in on their own turf. Still hoping they'll consider offering a spring set for Carreras and Carrera Ts. The latter don't need it as badly from a visual standpoint, but the 991.2 SPASM is clearly set higher than the 991.1 SPASM was. Suspect one spring set might even be able to service all 991.2 Carrera/S/T regardless of PASM or SPASM.
05-07-2020, 05:00 PM
#21
Rennlist Member
i have techart springs and dsc v3, theres some pogo effect which i dont like but its not terrible, i will probably move to bilstein b16 at some point
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05-08-2020, 10:20 PM
#22
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05-08-2020, 10:39 PM
#24
Rennlist Member
This is the approach I'm taking... It'd be similar ride quality to my current Base PASM, look a bit better... and will do for now.
11-18-2021, 05:55 PM
#26
Burning Brakes
Did anyone ever check with Eibach about custom springs?
