.2GT3 VS .2GTS vid
09-16-2017, 11:22 AM
#32
Agreed and I too would love to have one. The point is that the GTS is one hell of a car and a tremendous value for the performance you get. For 90% of buyers who want a combination of creature comforts and performance, the GTS checks the right boxes.
09-16-2017, 11:53 AM
#33
Both insanely fast cars. The new GTS is absolutely awesome...but the howl of that GT3 and the stratospheric redline are hard to beat IMO. Interesting to me how this thread started off as .2 GT3 vs .2GTS yet a certain individual takes every opportunity to fire up the .1 and .2 debate. I'll let you look back and see who brought it up. Will have to get a .2 car one day (hopefully can keep my .1 as well). One thing for certain: whether you have the .2 GT3 or a .2 GTS you have one of the very best cars on the road and should be out driving it!
Cheers,
NF
Cheers,
NF
09-16-2017, 02:15 PM
#34
All this talk about torque, like someone said we have gone all Camaro on 911. The Turbo and its torque come at a price and that is not just sound, when the .2S runs out of breath and power at the cool 6500rpm, the NA engine has just come alive and revs and makes power for an additional 2500 cycles, that is what I look forward to and pay the premium not the low down torque that pretty much all force feed cars make these days. Heck the new Boxster S is faster than nearly all NA 911 to 60, my truck (X5M) is probably faster too, who cares...I guess at the end it all depends what you bought the car for. When it comes to track performance, I am sure .2 GT3 will top the GTS in the hands of same driver and I believe there are track times to prove that.
09-16-2017, 05:31 PM
#35
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Yes. Haha.
Drag racing? Nope.
Track with turns? Much more about the driver. Also, I don't care about what times the sting got in either. Also, the same driver may be faster in a #2 car but that only matters if they are getting monies for lap times.
Detailed mine today while day drinking and smoking a cigar. Fell in love all over again.
Drag racing? Nope.
Track with turns? Much more about the driver. Also, I don't care about what times the sting got in either. Also, the same driver may be faster in a #2 car but that only matters if they are getting monies for lap times.
Detailed mine today while day drinking and smoking a cigar. Fell in love all over again.
09-16-2017, 05:38 PM
#36
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All this talk about torque, like someone said we have gone all Camaro on 911. The Turbo and its torque come at a price and that is not just sound, when the .2S runs out of breath and power at the cool 6500rpm, the NA engine has just come alive and revs and makes power for an additional 2500 cycles, that is what I look forward to and pay the premium not the low down torque that pretty much all force feed cars make these days. Heck the new Boxster S is faster than nearly all NA 911 to 60, my truck (X5M) is probably faster too, who cares...I guess at the end it all depends what you bought the car for. When it comes to track performance, I am sure .2 GT3 will top the GTS in the hands of same driver and I believe there are track times to prove that.
Nobody ever brings up the 3.4 #1 car anymore.... there is a huge following of this car because of the engine, power and the way it makes power.
There's also a 997.2 crowd that is laughing at all of us; mocking our computers on wheels.
And then there's the last of the handmade air cooled peeps that love their evil cars that tried to bankrupt the brand.
And the old farts with a 356 stating that a 911 is NARP.
I'd gladly drive any and feel fortunate to have the one that IMO hits the peak of the drivers car vs technology vs fast bell curve.
09-16-2017, 07:14 PM
#37
Bottom line: The 991.2 GTS is producing 100 MORE HP at 3600 rpm than the GT3.
If that's not impressive... I don't know what is!
If that's not impressive... I don't know what is!
09-16-2017, 07:38 PM
#38
All this talk about torque, like someone said we have gone all Camaro on 911. The Turbo and its torque come at a price and that is not just sound, when the .2S runs out of breath and power at the cool 6500rpm, the NA engine has just come alive and revs and makes power for an additional 2500 cycles, that is what I look forward to and pay the premium not the low down torque that pretty much all force feed cars make these days. Heck the new Boxster S is faster than nearly all NA 911 to 60, my truck (X5M) is probably faster too, who cares...I guess at the end it all depends what you bought the car for. When it comes to track performance, I am sure .2 GT3 will top the GTS in the hands of same driver and I believe there are track times to prove that.
09-16-2017, 07:45 PM
#40
Sticky seems to keep missing why N/A 911's are revered and why every N/A 911 will hold better value in the future over his 991.2.
It's not acceleration. It's not MPG. It's soulfulness, sound, rev rewarding powerband (file under soul) and visceral engagement.
Nobody in their right mind disputes the 991.2's are absolute beasts. Much like the 718, one upside to the a car that's historically known for its auditory quality losing that auditory quality, is that Porsche had to compensate by making it perform immaculately. Of course, the 991.2 doesn't sound near as bad as a 718, but the worst sounding N/A flat 6 sounds eons better, and it just leaves a lot to be desired in that category, namely compared to previous 911's. I know of guys with 991.2 GTS's who say their Macan GTS's sound better (and louder).
The 991.2 is as superior to the 991.1 in performance as the latter is to the former in sound and rev happiness (and imo that's being generous to 991.2's). Both have their perks and will fulfill different people's needs.
Though, I do find it funny how after 50+ years of 911's building reputations as the most revered sports cars in the world, reputations as anti-torque, rev monsters.. all of a sudden we have some guys going full Camaro with the torquegasms because Porsche boosted the Carreras. Torque is great, immense fun on roads, and it's in healthy supply on a plethora of cars that previous N/A 911's obliterated in comparison reviews, despite muscle-car "torque bros"' kicks and screams.
It's not acceleration. It's not MPG. It's soulfulness, sound, rev rewarding powerband (file under soul) and visceral engagement.
Nobody in their right mind disputes the 991.2's are absolute beasts. Much like the 718, one upside to the a car that's historically known for its auditory quality losing that auditory quality, is that Porsche had to compensate by making it perform immaculately. Of course, the 991.2 doesn't sound near as bad as a 718, but the worst sounding N/A flat 6 sounds eons better, and it just leaves a lot to be desired in that category, namely compared to previous 911's. I know of guys with 991.2 GTS's who say their Macan GTS's sound better (and louder).
The 991.2 is as superior to the 991.1 in performance as the latter is to the former in sound and rev happiness (and imo that's being generous to 991.2's). Both have their perks and will fulfill different people's needs.
Though, I do find it funny how after 50+ years of 911's building reputations as the most revered sports cars in the world, reputations as anti-torque, rev monsters.. all of a sudden we have some guys going full Camaro with the torquegasms because Porsche boosted the Carreras. Torque is great, immense fun on roads, and it's in healthy supply on a plethora of cars that previous N/A 911's obliterated in comparison reviews, despite muscle-car "torque bros"' kicks and screams.
I'm pointing out the 991.2 offers incredible bang for the buck. Some guy earlier in this thread said there are plenty of cars that are quicker 0-60 for half the money and I have yet to see him post a single example.
The 991.2 is indeed a huge step forward performance wise. Why this makes NA people so insecure I have no idea. The GTS is literally beating the newest and strongest GT3 with the best naturally aspirated flat-6 ever made in acceleration for less money. That doesn't mean the GT3 is bad to drive or doesn't have appeal. It's just a performance fact and one some people still are struggling to deal with.
Also, you thinking 'all of a sudden' people are talking torque or tuning Porsches shows you have not paid attention to previous turbocharged 911's. This is nothing new. There just are more turbocharged Porsches than ever before.
09-16-2017, 07:48 PM
#41
09-16-2017, 08:24 PM
#42
Rennlist Member
I have the X51 (on the 991.2 C2S) and its a missile but also very linear in its responses (both engine and throttle). Hills and corners are your friend 
Not sure what the issue is with the NA guys on Rennlist - the lag/throttle debates are largely ill informed and you have 3500 to 7500 rpm (4000 rpm) to play with Vs. 5000 to 9000 rpm (4000 rpm). Of course the higher revving engine generates higher losses.
To get a car with a better turbocharged engine you have to buy a 488, which according to a poster here, the 488 engine was rated ahead of the new GT3 engine by Porsches own works drivers.
No real dog in this fight, they are both fantastic machines.
Not sure what the issue is with the NA guys on Rennlist - the lag/throttle debates are largely ill informed and you have 3500 to 7500 rpm (4000 rpm) to play with Vs. 5000 to 9000 rpm (4000 rpm). Of course the higher revving engine generates higher losses.
To get a car with a better turbocharged engine you have to buy a 488, which according to a poster here, the 488 engine was rated ahead of the new GT3 engine by Porsches own works drivers.
No real dog in this fight, they are both fantastic machines.
I recently picked up my 991.2 GTS. It is a quick car and pretty torquey. When I get in my 488 after driving the GTS, the difference in power, quickness, and agility isn't incremental, but rather a quantum leap forward.
I hate to say this...but porsche could've done a much better job with the exhaust note on the GTS. It is a significant disappointment.
09-16-2017, 09:40 PM
#44
Sorry thats incorrect - look at the Sport Auto test with Chris Gebhardt driving both Cars.
The Sport Auto tests at Hockenheim Kurs were driven by Chris Gebhardt e.g. 991.2 GT3, 991.2 GTS, 991.2 Turbo and 991.1 GT3RS
For reference and also driven by Chris Gebhardt, the 488 GTB ran 1:07.0 dead and the AMG GT R did it in 1:06.7.
The Sport Auto tests at Hockenheim Kurs were driven by Chris Gebhardt e.g. 991.2 GT3, 991.2 GTS, 991.2 Turbo and 991.1 GT3RS
For reference and also driven by Chris Gebhardt, the 488 GTB ran 1:07.0 dead and the AMG GT R did it in 1:06.7.
Last edited by randr; 09-16-2017 at 09:56 PM.
09-16-2017, 10:00 PM
#45
Sorry thats incorrect - look at the Sport Auto test with Chris Gebhardt driving both Cars.
The Sport Auto tests at Hockenheim Kurs were driven by Chris Gebhardt e.g. 991.2 GT3, 991.2 GTS, 991.2 Turbo and 991.1 GT3RS
For reference and also driven by Chris Gebhardt, the 488 GTB ran 1:07.0 dead and the AMG GT R did it in 1:06.7.
The Sport Auto tests at Hockenheim Kurs were driven by Chris Gebhardt e.g. 991.2 GT3, 991.2 GTS, 991.2 Turbo and 991.1 GT3RS
For reference and also driven by Chris Gebhardt, the 488 GTB ran 1:07.0 dead and the AMG GT R did it in 1:06.7.