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Turbo..but why..??

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Old May 8, 2023 | 09:57 AM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by K996
... I'm really enjoying walking into the garage and seeing it sitting there. slightly menacing, totally ****n gorgeous and just waiting to be taken out...
This part here.... that is what I do. It's not a daily for me so every day on my way into or out of the house is a special moment to glance at the most beautiful car I've ever owned. I had not driven mine for a month until last night when I refilled the Meth tank, primed it and went for a spin - and remembered how special this car is to me.

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Old May 8, 2023 | 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by K996
Yeah I've been in the same boat and as a 3-day owner of a 991.1 TTS and coming in as a 99 996 C2 I feel somewhat qualified to respond.

I'm also a pre-owned buyer and I've always had the poverty-porsches after my first one being a 77 924 (Weltmeister edition in Martini color interior) in high school, second being the much-maligned 99 996 C2 that I happily drove as a daily for 20 yrs and in the past couple of years I started looking at what would be my next car.
I started looking at 911 t/ts just before covid but wasnt ready to pull the trigger and then the markets went crazy, the C8's came out, eventually I put a deposit on a list for a C8 z06 but dealers are still charging too much for admission and after trying a couple of different cars on rental (C8, mustangs, challenger) I rethought the practicality and what I liked about 2 back seats, a bigger cabin and the better view from the drivers seat.....so back to 911's.

So that's my background, minimal mods to the 996 (exhaust, eurospec lowering kit w/springs and sway bars, center console delete, replaced seats and stereo) and really just enjoying driving it.
It's such a small, nimble and tossable car and my wife and I like to do brunch in midtown so its' always easy to find street parking and slip in there not really worrying about minor bumps or scuffs. After 20 yrs though, it's old to me from a power and driving standpoint but I still enjoy looking at it in the garage and walking up on the street or in the parking lot, the 996 design is so clean and has really aged well.
It's just been a really fun car to daily and at the ever-decreasing value for a paid off car, it's a no-stress vehicle to drive and not really worry about. At 113k miles I'm way past any IMS concerns and I've loved to air it out on interstate onramps, etc.
Just super enjoyable and fun with a 6 speed.

So... now I also own a Turbo S. Hmm, how is that feeling? I mean it is absolutely gorgeous, but she's a THICC girl....I think I hadnt realized just how much wider and longer she is than my 996C2. I mean inside on the road it's not that noticeable but parking in the garage or next to other vehicles it becomes frighteningly apparent.
Of course, all the obvious stuff (better lights, glass roof, carbon brakes, improved infotainment, better dash, better interior, better seats, ridiculous acceleration, handling and stopping)....i mean the newer car is noticeably newer and objectively better in all these areas. Hands down, no discussion needed.

And yet... it still DRIVES and FEELS remarkably similar in a surprising number of ways. The way the car moves over uneven roads, the road noise is more muffled but still there and the same tone, the seating and visibility over the hood....I mean it is crazy how there is still some DNA from the older cars in there.
I really did not expect that it would feel so similar in certain ways, in her first ride in the car even my wife who is not a car gal said these things that I was already thinking... it was weird.

So although I havent even prepped it for sale, I am already a bit nostalgic for the 996. I mean it was the right car at the right time for me and I enjoyed it immensely.
I will prob still take it out before deciding exactly what I'm going to do with it but it was time for a new car and I wanted to see what the other side was like.

The 991.1 has a lot more power, it's very liveable so far and is just a much more visually striking car.
It's also an automatic, a very amazing automatic but it does "feel" like there's less to do in the car when you're not shifting gears... hard to explain but maybe it is a bit more boring?
That said, I showed my wife what 'launch control' does and she was laughing/screaming the whole way to triple digit speeds... I mean it's just a different experience and I'm still figuring it out.

Part of it was just wanting one before I get too old to really enjoy it, part of it was that my fleet of vehicles is aging and it's time, part of it was having the funds and not needing it for other stuff but overall I'm really enjoying walking into the garage and seeing it sitting there. slightly menacing, totally ****n gorgeous and just waiting to be taken out.

The power is amazing, but now I'm finally understanding how you can have pretty much the same experience in other porsches and that's something I wasnt expecting.

Good luck and let us know what happens!
I have five 911s from 997 to 992, and have driven several 996 and air-cooled. I find that they all have a similar dynamic which is unique to these rear-engine cars, they’re all variations on a particular theme.
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Old May 8, 2023 | 01:11 PM
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The next Porsche I buy will be a GT4 with a manual - as noted above the 991tts is a fantastic all around car, point and shoot precision, electronics just enough to still let the analogue shine through if you're feeling super daring, but, it will never have a manual again, and even though I understand why that is, it does not make it any less sad.

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Old May 9, 2023 | 01:10 AM
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It's funny that after driving a manual, I still find myself reaching for the shifter and thinking about pushing in the clutch (even though my 991.2 TTS has a PDK) when I am faced with a unexpected situation -- a force of habit I suppose after years of driving a 997.2 C4S manual). At the same time, I am in complete awe with the overall engineering and mechanical precision/speed of the PDK.

Last edited by Greg2010; May 9, 2023 at 09:18 AM.
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Old May 12, 2023 | 11:42 AM
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To give you a different perspective, a business partner of mine went from from a Cayman to a 991.1 TTS. He really liked it but missed the manual and go-kart like feel of the Cayman. He "stuck" with it until his GF crashed his TTS and it was a write off. I was hunting for a GT3 and just happened to drive the TT. I loved it and i wanted to get rid of my 997 Carrera S and 993 Convertible (silly move I know). But i had no space. So based on the test drive I changed my mind and ended up getting a TT. He switched too from the TTS and he ended up getting a GT3. He loves it and still owns it. I'd say the Turbo is a car that's an incredible swiss army knife. I've modified it to address some items - like the exhaust is fairly anemic, I only got the TT so it could use a bit more HP and TQ and the PDK / throttle response could be improved in normal mode. Plus the DSC module improves the ride and handling.

But at the end of the day - i love the Turbo line. May always have one. But if you want a harder, louder, better track weapon, more go-kart like - that's not great as a daily driver, the GT3 may be better for you. The Turbo is still very sporty and capable on a track or a canyon and obviously its incredibly fast. And you can drive it out for dinner with the wife and go to Costco

So I would highly recommend the TT/S. But drive one and also only you can tell what you want out of a car.
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Old May 12, 2023 | 11:52 AM
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It all depends on what else you have in your garage. I have a 488 Spider, 991.2 Turbo S, a Cayenne GTS Coupe, and a Charger Hellcat Redeye. Each vehicle serves its purpose in the fleet. For now the Turbo S slots in perfectly next to the 488 and Charger.
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Old May 12, 2023 | 11:25 PM
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Great advice here guys.. thank you. Have to say I look forward to reading any new conversations.

Costco...sha-yit odear...Theres no way my car would be going any where near there..or any super market for that matter!!...lol
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Old May 13, 2023 | 11:42 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by EmMHoLLa
It all depends on what else you have in your garage. I have a 488 Spider, 991.2 Turbo S, a Cayenne GTS Coupe, and a Charger Hellcat Redeye. Each vehicle serves its purpose in the fleet. For now the Turbo S slots in perfectly next to the 488 and Charger.
I love the profile picture, is that your garage or is it where they did your PPF?
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Old May 13, 2023 | 05:30 PM
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Originally Posted by gbakerge
I love the profile picture, is that your garage or is it where they did your PPF?
Its where I did my Paint Correction. Really nice space.
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Old May 14, 2023 | 12:47 AM
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Originally Posted by rodsky
To give you a different perspective, a business partner of mine went from from a Cayman to a 991.1 TTS. He really liked it but missed the manual and go-kart like feel of the Cayman. He "stuck" with it until his GF crashed his TTS and it was a write off. I was hunting for a GT3 and just happened to drive the TT. I loved it and i wanted to get rid of my 997 Carrera S and 993 Convertible (silly move I know). But i had no space. So based on the test drive I changed my mind and ended up getting a TT. He switched too from the TTS and he ended up getting a GT3. He loves it and still owns it. I'd say the Turbo is a car that's an incredible swiss army knife. I've modified it to address some items - like the exhaust is fairly anemic, I only got the TT so it could use a bit more HP and TQ and the PDK / throttle response could be improved in normal mode. Plus the DSC module improves the ride and handling.

But at the end of the day - i love the Turbo line. May always have one. But if you want a harder, louder, better track weapon, more go-kart like - that's not great as a daily driver, the GT3 may be better for you. The Turbo is still very sporty andcapable on a track or a canyon and obviously its incredibly fast. And you can drive it out for dinner with the wife and go to Costco

So I would highly recommend the TT/S. But drive one and also only you can tell what you want out of a car.
I feel rodsky has the right idea on the turbo vs. GT3 subject, I think it depends on what kind of driving you prefer for the car and as he says, drive one, but I say drive both, you may be surprised. The turbo has turned into a softer grand touring type car, extremely capable, comfortable, very fast, but soft and isolated feeling compared to the GT cars. It is the Swiss army knife, but not without tradeoffs. The GT3 is very alive, very connected to the road, extremely compliant over bumps, yet firm without the turbo softness, bounce and body roll. It's a scalpel and feels much more planted and capable on twisty mountain roads, which is where the turbos weight becomes very noticeable. The GT3 is light, nimble, has a lower to the ground seating position, screams at 7-9,000 RPM's, it just does everything in an extremely sporty manner and at a very high level. It is literally one of the fastest cars in the world around the ring, bettering cars with much more horsepower. It lacks the effortless torque of the turbo, so you have to really drive it to wring out the performance, which is exactly what makes it fun to drive and more involving. Max power is at 8,250 RPM! IMO, if you are looking for a very sporty, super involving, performance oriented car that will be extremely exciting. every time you use it - the GT3 is the ticket. I find myself driving the turbo S less and less and the times I do, I find myself wishing I had the RS instead. But that is probably because I live in an area of country roads and light traffic in general. I am able to really drive the car every time I use, I am not stuck in traffic. Conversely, if I lived in NYC, LA or a large metro area, maybe I'd be reaching for the turbo more, so they each have their place. But still, if a weekend special type garaged car, it would be a GT3 for me, if I had to choose. It has plenty of power for the street, it's a 10 second car and over 600 lbs. lighter than a turbo. That 600 lbs. makes up a lot of the HP/Torque difference in real world driving. And the GT3 PDK is instant, it feels lightening quick, which adds to the excitement and experience. I have been a modified Porsche turbo driver for several generations, but am finding the GT3 just more fun. The turbo is obviously the car if you are looking to straight line race, 1/4 mile, 1/2 mile, 60-130 bragging rights, etc. Like rodsky says, drive one, only you will know what's best for you, but I would add drive both and then you will really know, as they are two completely different experiences. Then you will really know.
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Old May 14, 2023 | 12:58 AM
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^ 992 TTS has more of a GT3 feel and sound than the 991.2 TTS, especially with Sport PASM (lowered 10 mm and stiffer). Suspension was tuned by the motorsports division.
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Old May 14, 2023 | 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Manifold
^ 992 TTS has more of a GT3 feel and sound than the 991.2 TTS, especially with Sport PASM (lowered 10 mm and stiffer). Suspension was tuned by the motorsports division.
That sounds like a nice step in the right direction...I feel it really needs a more dialed in suspension, as it's kind of floaty as delivered (for me). I installed the DSC, in an attempt to improve it and it still leaves a lot to be desired for my taste. Sounding more like a GT3 would also be a great tweak, but unless they raise the RPM limit, it will be impossible to develop the aural feedback of titanium internals reciprocating at 8-9,000 RPM and the resulting driving characteristics, which is just magical. But they are different cars with different purposes. The turbo does what it does brilliantly - brutally fast, comfortable with a luxurious appointed interior, heated A/C everything, sunroof, great looks, exceptional performance, quieter, insulated, 4 seats, etc., it's a great touring car, but will never provide the experience of the GT3 version. IMO, getting in and driving the GT3 is a real event, it's just a very special experience. Sort of like a sporting event, akin to going skiing for the day. It's a lightweight race car made street legal, it's more work, more feedback, more concentration and more fun - but you have to want and enjoy that kind of experience. It's not for everybody. I have both and appreciate each for what they offer.

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Old May 14, 2023 | 01:10 AM
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What I also like about the GT3, for me, is that it needs nothing other than an exhaust, IMO. I am not compelled to do power mods, suspension mods, cosmetic mods, it is so great right out of the box for ultimate fun street use. The car literally needs nothing and looks great as delivered. I have always spent a ton of money modding, trying to improve the turbos and here comes the GT3 needing nothing. All I did is add the Edguard bolster protectors and it's good to go. That's a nice change.

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Old May 14, 2023 | 01:36 AM
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Thanks for all the input guys..

I'd also looked at a GT3 but I think it maybe more a of a single persons car..not as in un married or spliced up type of single but as a driver type single. It's louder and more jiggly than a turbo/s. For that point alone I think the Turbo is a better option. Don't need it screaming to 8500 to know I'm going fast.
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Old May 14, 2023 | 01:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Andrewpiper
Thanks for all the input guys..

I'd also looked at a GT3 but I think it maybe more a of a single persons car..not as in un married or spliced up type of single but as a driver type single. It's louder and more jiggly than a turbo/s. For that point alone I think the Turbo is a better option. Don't need it screaming to 8500 to know I'm going fast.
Understood, that's why they have all the models. FYI - I'm older and the wife loves it, so it's just individual driving style/experience preference. We like the GT3 for mountain drives, rallies, events and the occasional car show, even a dinner out sometimes, i.e. when we want a very special, engaging driving experience. I use the turbo mainly for office commuting, sometimes dinner out and other misc. tasks. I used it for weekend fun until I got the GT3 and then the GT3 stole that role. So, if you are only going to have one, it really boils down to what you want most out of the car.

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