evo Car of the Year 2016

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12-14-2016, 10:16 PM

#31

95spiderman

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan Smithee

Seriously - while the GTI CS has been breaking records and wowing the press overseas, VWoA has announced cancellation of all 2-door Golf/GTIs in the US.

maybe theyre afraid of coming civic type R?

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12-15-2016, 04:59 AM

#32

Waxer

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Quote:

Originally Posted by CAlexio

not to make too broad of a statement, but I think BMW has lost it's way.

Their performance cars are genuinely not desirable compared to competitors (m3 vs c63 with it's V8) or underperforming (M2 m4 gts). Their sedans are not beautiful.. new 7 series looks like a premium korean market sedan.. compare to mercedes gorgeous flowing lines. Their interiors remain relatively uninteresting.. and their M-brand has been totally diluted with their SUV's/crossovers etc. I don't feel the draw anymore.. after my 5 series wagon goes to heaven I'm going for an e63 wagon to replace it.. there is nothing desirable left in the brand for me.

Bingo. I used to love M's. They were sharp edged and agressive. Became round and soft. Boring too.

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12-15-2016, 05:14 AM

#33

Waxer

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Originally Posted by neanicu

I get it though...they are not going to give the title to a car just because it has a manual gearbox. And that's a good thing because we can trust their conclusions! And I'm sure the 991 GT3 won it fair and square against the competitors that year. It was the best car there! But take that car,improve it,make it even more involving for the driver by giving him/her more control and that's the recipe of success in today's competitive sports car world. Fast,loud,bombastic and having the computer making a great driver out of an average one doesn't cut it anymore. There's a lot more that makes a car special and the fact that the Golf GTI Clubsport finished 2nd ahead of cars that cost 10 times more should tell us something.

Ok. I get it now. A less powerful, heavier, less striking, slower GT3 with slower flappy paddles than the RS version wins in a previous year but the RS loses in a following year to a lesser Porsche with an mt and then the next year after that an "RS" with an mt and a reduced performance envelope in the form of basically the same car with the "S" removed from it's RS nomenclature wins. Oh, and you can't even buy the damn thing.

I call bs.

Sounds like mt bias to me.

Last edited by Waxer; 12-15-2016 at 05:32 AM.

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12-15-2016, 08:26 AM

#34

Gravs

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It is of course MT bias. They make no bones about that. There has to be a bias on something or it would be a 12-way tie.

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12-15-2016, 08:46 AM

#35

Nizer

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Waxer

Bingo. I used to love M's. They were sharp edged and agressive. Became round and soft. Boring too.

I would say more numb and soulless than round and soft. And not just M cars that have lost the plot. Seems to be the case with all BMW's these days. Maybe they're too focused on remote emission vehicles (as opposed to the phantom zero emission vehicles that the media keeps touting).

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12-15-2016, 09:15 AM

#36

FORENN

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Waxer

DCT for me is just fun as a mt and is in ways more fun.

Had to read that one twice. Thankfully, we'll have the choice with gen 2.

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12-15-2016, 10:22 AM

#37

Waxer

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Paul and Nizer: good points.

sports century: Context... likely because I'm fortunate to have 3 others with mt to scratch that itch.

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12-15-2016, 11:55 AM

#38

Nizer

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Graville

It is of course MT bias. They make no bones about that. There has to be a bias on something or it would be a 12-way tie.

Average age of that group looked to be late 30's/early 40's. Wonder what the outcome would've been if it was a bunch of 20-somethings....?

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12-15-2016, 12:15 PM

#39

neanicu

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I have other manual cars too and they don't compare to the experience of driving a modern manual GT Porsche. Sure,there are older manual Porsches which are wonderful to drive and more challenging/involving...they really work you and you need to be on top of your game to drive them well. The manual Mezger era is right in between on the evolution scale IMO and it will always remain a classic,because it makes the transition between older and newer.
I have said from the beginning that the characteristics of the DFI 9A1 engine and it's derivatives are quite different. This engine is an evolution. I'm still in love with the Mezger(call me a luddite),but I still made the switch to the 9A1 because I wanted to experience the modern GT Porsche. With all of its problems,it makes more power,revs quicker and sounds good(different).
I have known from the beginning that the 9A1 will fit perfectly to a manual gearbox. I have never swallowed AP's marketing BS about revving too fast for a manual. The 911R is a living proof of my beliefs. And the 991.2 GT3 will be a wonderful modern GT car with a manual gearbox. Everyone will need to experience it to know what I'm talking about,MARK MY WORDS!

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12-15-2016, 12:39 PM

#40

ChicagoM4

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Waxer

Bingo. I used to love M's. They were sharp edged and agressive. Became round and soft. Boring too.

Agree, and is why I gave up and sold my M4 after about 18 months. A good Sport Auto article sheds some light...

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/n...-11578320.html

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12-15-2016, 04:49 PM

#41

EST

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan Smithee

Seriously - while the GTI CS has been breaking records and wowing the press overseas, VWoA has announced cancellation of all 2-door Golf/GTIs in the US.

This 2-door GTI Clubsport S is very rare car, limited 400 units only (150 right hand drive cars) No back seats and it's manual!
So the 991 R is not so rare at all

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12-15-2016, 05:21 PM

#42

gmgracing

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Waxer

Bingo. I used to love M's. They were sharp edged and agressive. Became round and soft. Boring too.

The older bimmers make a nice compliment to newer Porsche's strangely enough.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/bmw0...4750158024076/

I enjoyed that review, sure it's just a bunch of fellow's subjective opinion, but it was a great way to spend a lunch break.

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12-15-2016, 07:03 PM

#43

golfnutintib

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can i get a v-dub gti cs in pts? i will pay 100k over

driver involvement, tactile feedback, and goodness of packaging over robotics, nannies and flash... any day of the week

i enjoy my mk v gti immensely... it isn't as much car as any of the porsches... but it is very very satisfying to drive and own in its own right