Jooyoung99

I don't agree with your statement. In Los Angeles, you pay 9% sales tax on the new car price. However, when you lease, you only pay sales tax on the payment.

Depending on the money factor, if you plan to sell your car within 1 or 2 years, you would've spent less regardless of sale price.

Give you an example:

1. Purchase: Price $150K, Sales Tax $13.5K, APR 2.25%, Sale Price after a Year $130K = You've spent $20K in depreciation, $13.5K Sales Tax and $3.3 in Interest which is $36.8K spent.
2. Lease: Price $150K, Sales Tax $2.2K, Money Factor 4%, Lease Acquisition Fee $1,000, Sale Price after a Year $130K = You've spent $20K depreciation, $6K interest, $2.2K Sales Tax, $1,000 Acquisition Fees which is $29.2K

All in all, leasing is $7.6K cheaper than purchasing.

WernerE

Leasing is nearly always preferable to pay cash or finance, assuming equivalent rates of interest/money factor.

Advantages of leasing, again (sigh):

1. You receive depreciation protection with leasing (if the car is worth only 40% at end of lease, it's the factory's loss, not yours -- not true if you bought or financed).
2. Less sales tax paid, particularly if your state doesn't have trade-in credits on replacement vehicles.
3. Better cash flow, including lower down payment and monthly payment
4. More options at end of lease (easier to buy or walk -- no hassle of sale).
5. Higher tax deductions via deduction of lease payments (net of inclusion amounts) vs. very limited depreciation deduction for business use in 2014 with "luxury" vehicles.
6. Leasing can actually improve credit scores (you're only borrowing on approx. half of the car's MSRP).

Customers complain, foolishly, over lease payments for 3 years and then have to pay 50%+ to buy the car. One should WANT the highest possible residual. To take an extreme example: If the residual was 99%, one's monthly payment would be $50 per month. Who wouldn't want that deal?

For cash customers, they're foregoing an opportunity cost with their money. I agree that 4.8% is not a great rate to arbitrage from, but it's probably comparable to finance rates, in which case one can put more money at work under a lease.

Lease depreciating assets; Finance appreciating assets ...J Paul Getty.

KenU

Just curious what lease payments are/would be with no cap cost outlay and just mv, inception fees, etc. The variable would obviously be including sales tax of your state or not in the payment, amount of miles, # of months, etc.

Anyone care to share what lease payment they've been quoted recently or are paying along with the above stated variables? One northeast dealer said to me a few weeks ago "we've been leasing the GT3's around the $2,300 per month range, just inception fees for 36 mos."What I don't remember 100% was the miles, which I think he said was 10k.

Thanks

Jooyoung99

On my car with $150K, 24 mo was $3200 before tax, 36 mo was $2670 before tax, 60 mo was $1890 before tax. They were all $5K drive off with 6K miles per year.

KenU

^ Thanks

hfm

https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3/...l#post11659091

Sure, I will pay approximately $65k down but, my monthly payment on a $100k loan is lower and, after six years, even after factoring in sales tax, I will have a car to show for it and, I can drive as many miles as I want without huge mileage fees.

Out of curiosity, what is your residual if you wanted to buy the car at lease end?

Dan (doesn't think lease is always the right solution and thinks most GT3 will be financed rather than leased)

Jooyoung99

I have to look at my lease document. If you plan to keep it for more than 18 months, it's better to finance it 72 months with 2.25%. For me, I know I don't want to keep the car that long. As soon as the RS is out, I'm switching.

Also, Porsche financial has same mileage penalty of 30 cents per mile on all of their cars. This includes GT3. Which I think is crazy. I leased a Cayman, it was 30 cents, leased a Macan S 30 cents, leased a GT3 30 cents.

Jooyoung99

Not in California. We don't have that here. You don't get a break on the sales tax on your trade. Hence, it makes more sense to lease in California vs Nevada.

Jooyoung99

I hate google for the fact that you can no longer BS and get away with it.

nlpamg

This is really interesting. I was planning on buying my car with a substantial down payment, but I'm not sure if I want to keep this car for more than 24-36 months, so leasing may be an option.

I wonder what the amortization schedule looks like for 60 months, that is, how badly would I be upside down at 24-36 months if I decided to trade the car in or get rid of the lease.

Jooyoung99

I did the same calculation. I did 36 months. Basically at 18 months, your payoff balance is the same. Before 18 months, Lease has lower payoff. After 18 months, 72 months with 2.25% has lower payoff. Basically, any tax benefit you got from leasing is gone after 18 months since leasing has much higher money factor / rate.

So if you want to keep the car past 18 mo, better to finance it.

If the purchase price is $150K, you'll finance $165K due to fees and tax. Your payment is $2400 for 72 mo at 2.25%. After 24 mo, your payoff is $112K, after 36 mo your payoff is $85K.

nlpamg

Gotcha, thanks! This is making my decision easier.

I guess I'll finance then. 72 at 2.25% isn't bad at all. I assume this is not through Porsche Financial though, as I can get a tad bit lower than that from B of A.

For people wanting the smallest payment possible, I've heard that Porsche FS has an 84 month loan term as well and there are some other companies that do financing with longer terms. Those seem like interesting options as well, so long as the interest rate isn't significantly more. What do you think?

cajuncroc

It seems like the residuals on the GT3 are significantly worse that the base 911, which seems strange. Are PFS assuming the GT3 are tracked?

nlpamg

I think PFS knows that this is a model in high demand, so they can take advantage of it.

CAlexio

I don't think lease residuals on this car are in any way related to actual used values. No way a 2 yr old gt3 with 10k miles is worth 54% of it's price...


Anyway, leasing is not for me... But, I'm intrigued by these super long finance periods... I always thought these were for sup-prime borrowers, but it actually makes sense to have as low a payment as possible so as to keep money working for you. In my situation, don't shoot me for being honest.. I want the gt3 for the sheer novelty of it, and for European delivery experience. It's too much car for my abilities, my license is precarious after too many tickets so I couldn't push it on the road, and I wouldn't have the budget to seriously track it (not the risk tolerance). I'm thinking I'll keep the car for 6 mo... One year max, and sell after maybe 5k miles for hopefully something close to what I purchased it. Tunis means leasing is out of the question for me, and I have to factor the 10% tax rate into my total ownership cost. If I can finance for 72 months with no money down.. I might just do it, with the awareness that after 12 mo I might be slightly upside down on the loan + tax loss. If I think ab how my equity portfolio grows each day.. Would seem crazy to put in any money at all. Even a poseur like me can learn so much on this dang forum..