Car & Driver instrumented test of GT3
10-06-2013, 10:02 AM
#76
Rennlist Member
True but there are moments of joy on short sections of road. I have a freeway off-ramp nearby that is fabulous. Corner entry at freeway speeds gives you the opportunity to trail brake into a slightly uphill, decreasing radius corner. This is followed by a constant radius section that opens up into an increasing radius corner exit, followed by a spirited merger (hostile takeover?) into traffic. Little sections like this where you can use the technology make running a car like the GT3 on the street enjoyable and less like taxiing your F18 to work....
10-06-2013, 10:06 AM
#77
Rennlist Member
For me the GT3 will be a weekend car used for some weekend cruising/dinner out with the wife, spirited drives in less populated areas and some track days (3-5 per year) where I can comfortably drive to about 7-8/10ths. Will I ever get to or want to find the limits of this car, perhaps, but it's not necessary for me but it's nice to know that I have a car that's capable of getting me to within 7-8/10ths of my race car.
Yes, there will be the occasional C&C/car show to share the passion with other car enthusiast...
I am very excited to get this car and all these amazing results are making the wait so much harder..
10-06-2013, 11:06 AM
#78
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Maybe not. I have no idea what Manifold's driving skill level is, however the bigger the discrepancy between car capability and driver skill, the more boring the ride. Hence the reason miata's are so popular. It's easy to feel like you are maxing the thing out.
Many people won't be used the level of speed in which the GT3 can travel and will mentally set limits far lower. M's have been fun because they seem active at any speed with their heavy feeling handling.
Many people won't be used the level of speed in which the GT3 can travel and will mentally set limits far lower. M's have been fun because they seem active at any speed with their heavy feeling handling.
10-06-2013, 11:36 AM
#79
Drifting
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It takes a Ferrari .1 second longer to hit that quarter mile, even though its only going slightly faster when it does it? So much for having double the cylinders!
10-06-2013, 12:13 PM
#80
Maybe not. I have no idea what Manifold's driving skill level is, however the bigger the discrepancy between car capability and driver skill, the more boring the ride. Hence the reason miata's are so popular. It's easy to feel like you are maxing the thing out.
Many people won't be used the level of speed in which the GT3 can travel and will mentally set limits far lower. M's have been fun because they seem active at any speed with their heavy feeling handling.
Many people won't be used the level of speed in which the GT3 can travel and will mentally set limits far lower. M's have been fun because they seem active at any speed with their heavy feeling handling.
I've owned a couple E46 M3s and several 911s, turbo included, and must say my GT3 was fun all the time. I know where this is going, so I'll say it now. I expect similar fun with PDK S for a variety of reasons.
What I am certain I will love is the feel of the taut chassis, the eagerness to rev, the sound, steering, etc. all those things we all love that do not have to be exploited only on the track to appreciate (yes, full appreciation can be track) I don't care if I am categorized as a wannabe, C&C guy, whatever, (one C&C event in my life btw) I just love hardcore cars and don't live my life by putting people and things in tidy boxes. I love the track and wish I could own a true track car, but that's another story.
^ For what it's worth...
10-06-2013, 01:49 PM
#81
Burning Brakes
Manifold, Make no mistake, this car will be driven as intended on the track even if it is only 3-5 times a year !!
10-06-2013, 02:03 PM
#82
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Why I don't track street cars anymore.
Of course you can always gut your new GT3 and add fire suppression system, full cage, harnesses, kill switch, fuel cell......
Of course you can always gut your new GT3 and add fire suppression system, full cage, harnesses, kill switch, fuel cell......
10-06-2013, 02:10 PM
#83
Burning Brakes
10-06-2013, 03:04 PM
#84
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Maybe not. I have no idea what Manifold's driving skill level is, however the bigger the discrepancy between car capability and driver skill, the more boring the ride. Hence the reason miata's are so popular. It's easy to feel like you are maxing the thing out.
Many people won't be used the level of speed in which the GT3 can travel and will mentally set limits far lower. M's have been fun because they seem active at any speed with their heavy feeling handling.
Many people won't be used the level of speed in which the GT3 can travel and will mentally set limits far lower. M's have been fun because they seem active at any speed with their heavy feeling handling.
I instruct with PCA, Chin, and other clubs, and my pace is about the same as the faster drivers in similar cars in the upper run groups. So not bad, but well below what you and many others are doing.
10-06-2013, 03:14 PM
#85
Race Director
True but there are moments of joy on short sections of road. I have a freeway off-ramp nearby that is fabulous. Corner entry at freeway speeds gives you the opportunity to trail brake into a slightly uphill, decreasing radius corner. This is followed by a constant radius section that opens up into an increasing radius corner exit, followed by a spirited merger (hostile takeover?) into traffic. Little sections like this where you can use the technology make running a car like the GT3 on the street enjoyable and less like taxiing your F18 to work....
Last edited by Mike in CA; 10-06-2013 at 06:05 PM. Reason: typo
10-06-2013, 07:01 PM
#86
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Completely agreed. One of the reasons I sold my 997 GT3 after tracking it and building a dedicated track car. But dedicated track cars are a PITA. So I'm going full circle again.
10-06-2013, 08:36 PM
#87
Rennlist Member
To answer your question, the car that C & D tested had the following options: PCCB, sound package plus, sport chrono clock, guards red seatbelts, and telephone module. The tires were Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2.
Every car magazine has their own testing procedures, as long as they are consistent between different cars. I would never compare objective numbers of the same car from different magazines.
Car and Driver consistently gets some of the lowest acceleration times in the industry, so take the results with that in mind.
Nonetheless, it seems the 991 GT3 is extemely fast (anything under 4 seconds for the sprint to 60-62mph is more than fast enough for me), and I think the PDK is a big part of it. One thing I do like about C & D is that they always do the rolling 5-60 mph test, which is much more repesentative of "real life" accelerating as fast as possible without launch control or manually launching the car by dropping the clutch at high revs. 5-60 mph in 3.9 seconds is DAMN fast for everyday pulling away from a stoplight.
Now I can't wait for Sport Auto to do their supertest on this car so we'll get an indpendent measure of the Ring and Hockenheim laptimes.
Every car magazine has their own testing procedures, as long as they are consistent between different cars. I would never compare objective numbers of the same car from different magazines.
Car and Driver consistently gets some of the lowest acceleration times in the industry, so take the results with that in mind.
Nonetheless, it seems the 991 GT3 is extemely fast (anything under 4 seconds for the sprint to 60-62mph is more than fast enough for me), and I think the PDK is a big part of it. One thing I do like about C & D is that they always do the rolling 5-60 mph test, which is much more repesentative of "real life" accelerating as fast as possible without launch control or manually launching the car by dropping the clutch at high revs. 5-60 mph in 3.9 seconds is DAMN fast for everyday pulling away from a stoplight.
Now I can't wait for Sport Auto to do their supertest on this car so we'll get an indpendent measure of the Ring and Hockenheim laptimes.
I understand we may have Sport Auto's numbers before the end of November. But I may have been misinformed.I will always wonder if one of my posts will turn around to bite me in the ace.
10-06-2013, 09:08 PM
#88
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OK fine, I'll modify and qualify this statement. The 991 GT3 will be among the fastest cars at DEs, so it'll substantially help drivers in every run group be among the faster cars in their run group, especially in the intermediate and higher run groups where drivers generally leave less on the table.
10-06-2013, 09:27 PM
#89
Rennlist Member
Not to throw this thread off-topic, but since the subject of fuel has been discussed briefly, I was wondering: Has there ever been anyone who has ever run a premium "race gas" or high octane race fuel through their street/track car exclusively - i.e. never filled their car from the pump or gas station?
Would it eventually cause engine damage because "aftermarket" fuels may be of lower quality? Or are they better engineered and of a higher quality than you get out of the gas pump?
I know there are many car enthusiasts who concern themselves with who makes the best motor oil, the best brand, the best synthetic, etc... Why not the same concern for fuel? I imagine it would unbelievably expensive to run a car on C16 over 100,000+ miles, but hey, only the best for your baby right?
Would it eventually cause engine damage because "aftermarket" fuels may be of lower quality? Or are they better engineered and of a higher quality than you get out of the gas pump?
I know there are many car enthusiasts who concern themselves with who makes the best motor oil, the best brand, the best synthetic, etc... Why not the same concern for fuel? I imagine it would unbelievably expensive to run a car on C16 over 100,000+ miles, but hey, only the best for your baby right?
10-06-2013, 09:51 PM
#90
Nordschleife Master
my understanding is the car runs best with gas for which it is tuned- DME settings and burning higher octane will not provide any performance benefit and if you do and often can damage the cats.