3-Pedals

Need some advice here. I am considering a 991.2 GT3 that is at this point 6+ years old. The only maintenance that it ever had was an oil change that happened twice in 6 years. No plugs, no brake fluid, filter, even tires are original/expired. I have never bought a car like this and I wanted to ask the experts here for their feedback.

If I try to certify the car through a Porsche dealer, they are going to easily give me a bill of $10,000 (including the $3000-4000 flat fee for PCNA) as the car needs new tires, new spark plugs, new belts (both of them), new filters, and brake fluid flushed. If I dont want to pursue this option and simply not certify it, then I am taking a pretty massive risk of buying an out of warranty car, albeit practically new but with an unpredictable future. Car might have genuine problems from day one that simply never got caught because it was never driven.

The other separate question is what happens to a brake fluid when a car sits 6+ years. Can there be concerns with corrosion or longer term damage to brake lines/pump/etc? When I asked this question to a dealer here, they said if this was their dealership, even if I paid $10,000 they wouldnt certify the car because of how far behind it is in maintenance schedule. I guess that's the other thing, is there anything like it's too late? I mean I know the argument of spark plugs dont just go bad and some people think its excessive to replace them every 2 years but we do it because of corrosion concerns and what not. Say I buy the car and try to do the plugs myself and one of them snaps in half and now I need to do an engine out service and a lot of headache.

Maybe buying a practically brand new car that is so old isn't really a vise decision afterall.

dbv1

Most cars in general never get a single brake flush, we’re the exception here. I think you’ll be fine. I’m more curious how easy will the steel plug will come out of aluminum head after 6 years and no anti seize used on the thread.

You’ll also be paying more than a little bit for the low mileage. If you actually drive that car afterwards, you burn the premium you paid. Out of curiosity, what do you intend to do with the car?

3-Pedals

I will drive it and I will drive it some more and some more lol. So not a flipper. Not trying to invest my money. Yes you are right I am going pay premium up front and lose some of that very quickly but there arent that many no story cars out there.

The plugs might just snap off in a sense maybe they would have had snapped off 4 years ago when they should have been done in the 2 year service. Maybe one of them was defective/weak. The problem now is, Porsche will not take any responsibility and the repair will be very costly. Are you sure the brake lines, connections, pump, will have no condensation related long term damage? What about clutch? I dont even know what happens to a car when its never driven for years like this and what to look for during PPI.

rk-d

Two oil changes in 6 years?

Personally, I’d walk. “Buy the owner”. Whoever owned that car, didn’t care about it.

dbv1

At one point, I’ve done a brake flush on a 8 year old Audi that never had a flush before. It was fine, clutch and all. The brake fluid coming out was dark green (supposed to be light yellow) and the pedal got a lot harder after but no problems otherwise. That car was driven somewhat regularly though.

38D

he said it was very low mileage car. If the car is only getting 500 miles a year, you absolutely don’t need to change the oil every year.

3-Pedals

Actually, that is not correct. You need to change the oil no later than 1 year because of condensation. Also oil does break down with time. This car had no oil change for almost 4 years and the oil is probably in an extremely bad state. I dont actually know if Porsche would even warranty this car. Even if the dealer does the CPO and the engine blows 6 months later, I'm afraid they'll turn around and say the maintenance on the car was way late and no CPO coverage for you.

38D

condensation only forms inside the engine if there are large swing is the temps a garage is seeing, and you are consistently getting below the dew point. As most of the Porsche engine is aluminum, you’re really talking about the bearings and rings that have the possibility to corrode with condensation. The oil film on these parts will protect for a long while. And no oil doesn’t just break down from sitting, at least not in the timeframes we are talking about here.

BryanCO

You seemed to already have formed your opinion and seem overly worried about the cars condition. Doesn’t sound like that would be an enjoyable way to start an ownership experience.

Me. I would get a PPI, bake the service cost into the price, buy it (assuming the spec and deal was right) and not worry so much.

Turbo Racer

I think these cars are pretty bulletproof. If I really wanted the car, I’d get a PPI, do the maintenance and get the cpo. And then drive it gingerly for a few hundred miles and then go for it. I agree about maintenance being a major key to longevity. But, would you rather have a 10k mile car that had 8k track miles on it but well maintained? I don’t know about the multiplier effect on track miles is 3-4x? It’s all relative and unless you’re buying from an honest private party who’s sharing with you what conditions the car was driven under it’s always a bit of a guessing game.

zedcat

I've seen brake fluid turn to a gel. Saw this in a motorcycle that sat for about 8 years. (The bike was exposed to the elements part of the time.) Easy enough to check the master and to bleed the calipers to check. Also consider the fuel system. How long has it been sitting currently? how old is the gas in the tank?

3-Pedals

I would rather have a car with more miles (ideally 5,000 or less), no track time, owner like me who does all the maintenance on time or more frequently. Hard to find a car like that.

The cost of the maintenance (through Porsche) is pretty high and will be my responsibility. The seller is a flipper trying to maximize the profit. I’ll be in this car pretty high $$$$. I cant just do the maintenance myself and then CPO it. It has to happen before the sale.

3-Pedals

Good point. The car has been sitting for over a year with the same gas from probably 2-3 years ago.

Kitc2246

Does the car start and run now? Original battery on a CTEK? How was the car stored? Any chance of rodent damage? In a heated garage, outside, etc. High or low humidity state? OP state very low miles, but how often was the car driven? Short trips or long enough to get engine oil up to operating temp. Stored at vacation home or hangar queen?

All of this depends on your risk tolerance. You could get a great bargain with considerable effort from a good indy who can thoroughly test all the neglected systems. A CPO obviously gives peace of mind but at what cost.

OP didn't say how many miles, but if truly low miles means fewer heat cycles on the plugs. I'd tell my indy the history of the car. They have techniques and penetrating fluid to gently remove the plugs. I would not be overly concerned about the plugs. Potential engine and brake corrosion are. Not to mention the fuel system. There are other systems like the AC, tires, belts, gaskets and seals that my have deteriorated and quickly fail. Tires may be beyond the 5-6 year point, but an inspection for dry rot will confirm. Considering the car and HP I'd replace, but a tire with no visible dry rot between the treads and on the sidewall is not necessarily unsafe based on its age.

Same issue with the two oil changes. I'd argue that a low mileage car can easily go two years on an oil change. OP didn't say when the last was, but today's oils have much more corrosion and rust inhibitors. I've done oil analysis after a year with a TBN indicating it should easily last another year or more. If the owner routinely started and idled the car or very short trips that's a concern. While some moisture in the oil comes from humidity, IMO the majority in most cars is from combustion and not getting to operating temperature. How much from humidity depends on its environmental factors.

Same issue with the brake fluid. Environmental conditions will be the big factor in how much moisture has been absorbed in the brake fluid. Most manufactures recommend a two year change under normal driving conditions. Even if you test the brake fluid for its current moisture level not sure how you translate that into corrosion. A change is clearly way over due, but would start with a moisture test first just to know.

I'd have a long discussion with a good indy familiar with this model car and discuss its history. I'd asked them what and how they would check for engine, fuel and brake system corrosion. Best and worst case. What other systems like AC would be their other concern. I'd definitely have the engine bore scoped. I'd want to hear what my indy says about the fuel and brake system. My indy rebuilds/restores very old Porsches. Suspect he routinely replaces the whole fuel and brake system on the older car, but not sure how much technical inspection he does first. Many of the older cars do not have ABS. Not sure how you easily inspect ABS for corrosion. Replacing would be $$$.

If the current owner won't let you do a through PPI to include potential engine, fuel and brake system corrosion I'd walk. That said you might be able to negotiate a significant discount on a car that will be fine with updated maintenance.

Guess I assumed the car at least started and runs, but excellent point on the gas. but relatively easy to check. Assuming it has a good battery, if it starts and runs, great, if not quickly could be a bad sign. I it has to be towed for a PPI, another good reason to pass. A full tank would mean less condensation. Stabilizer would be another plus.

Let us know what you decide. Would be really interested in the actually condition of the engine oil, brake fluids, etc.

3-Pedals

Car has a little over 100 miles. First oil change was done in 2 years. Second and last oil change was done 3 years after (1 year ago from now). Which means the first tank of gas that the selling dealer put in the car may actually be still in the car after 6 years. I'm not sure what's worse, keeping gas in the car for 6 years OR idling it extensively to the point it burns the gas and you put new gas (but you are idling a brand new non broken in car with oil thats 2 and 3 years old respectively).

Maybe not the right car for a "non-flipper" person. I have no idea why people do this.

Also you guys do understand that if I ask "was the car driven around" "where was it kept" "was fuel stabilizer used" etc, I cant really ever be 100% sure the answers are factually accurate.