Motor Trend: 2018 PORSCHE 911 GT3 FIRST TEST: BEAUTY BEHELD
02-17-2018, 10:40 PM
#76
Burning Brakes
^That's awesome! I'll actually be in Sebring tomorrow... GT4 though, yes in the manual. 
All it takes is a blown shift... or a misshift... or too early... or... well you catch my drift. I don't toot my horn on being the fastest/bestest (lol) most consistent shifter but no way can I mimic the PDK-S telepathic capabilities at every turn, upshift/downshift, and every single lap... I just give credit where credit is due. Even racecar drivers make human errors in shifting.
All it takes is a blown shift... or a misshift... or too early... or... well you catch my drift. I don't toot my horn on being the fastest/bestest (lol) most consistent shifter but no way can I mimic the PDK-S telepathic capabilities at every turn, upshift/downshift, and every single lap... I just give credit where credit is due. Even racecar drivers make human errors in shifting.
02-17-2018, 11:41 PM
#77
Race Director
Originally Posted by Psup4s
Anyone who has driven a manual or even considers himself a "stick pro" knows this statement is true.
an example: I was in a 24-hr endurance race a few weeks ago, Mazda Miata.. considerably lower cost vehicle in case of mistake. Coming into a hairpin corner holding the inside line on the car ahead of us in our class, jockeying for position. We had a momentum car with less power, heat is on to pass under braking as our only real opportunity. I shifted down into 2nd instead of 4th... wild overrevs into redline zone.. damn! Corrected shifter position quickly, but screwed up my braking and had a mild brake-lockup moment, put two wheels in the dirt.. a few bumps, lost the position, got back into the groove to chase my competitor down again.
In a manual gt3 that could have been a hugely expensive engine mistake, or at very minimum, shown up on a ecu analysis when selling the car.. not to mention I would have probably ripped off front bumper going off and back on track with two wheels. Same thing Wouldn't have happened with pdk.. manual shifting under stressful or competitive situations, even track days, leave you open to errors like this.. pdk allows you to completely eliminate that variable.
I still went manual gt3 because I'm not paid to go fast, and I want max engagement with my car. , but I can't imagine as the talentless driver that I am, risking this car on track in such a way..
02-18-2018, 12:15 AM
#78
Burning Brakes
I can confirm this as definitely a "non-pro"..
an example: I was in a 24-hr endurance race a few weeks ago, Mazda Miata.. considerably lower cost vehicle in case of mistake. Coming into a hairpin corner holding the inside line on the car ahead of us in our class, jockeying for position. We had a momentum car with less power, heat is on to pass under braking as our only real opportunity. I shifted down into 2nd instead of 4th... wild overrevs into redline zone.. damn! Corrected shifter position quickly, but screwed up my braking and had a mild brake-lockup moment, put two wheels in the dirt.. a few bumps, lost the position, got back into the groove to chase my competitor down again.
In a manual gt3 that could have been a hugely expensive engine mistake, or at very minimum, shown up on a ecu analysis when selling the car.. not to mention I would have probably ripped off front bumper going off and back on track with two wheels. Same thing Wouldn't have happened with pdk.. manual shifting under stressful or competitive situations, even track days, leave you open to errors like this.. pdk allows you to completely eliminate that variable.
I still went manual gt3 because I'm not paid to go fast, and I want max engagement with my car. , but I can't imagine as the talentless driver that I am, risking this car on track in such a way..
an example: I was in a 24-hr endurance race a few weeks ago, Mazda Miata.. considerably lower cost vehicle in case of mistake. Coming into a hairpin corner holding the inside line on the car ahead of us in our class, jockeying for position. We had a momentum car with less power, heat is on to pass under braking as our only real opportunity. I shifted down into 2nd instead of 4th... wild overrevs into redline zone.. damn! Corrected shifter position quickly, but screwed up my braking and had a mild brake-lockup moment, put two wheels in the dirt.. a few bumps, lost the position, got back into the groove to chase my competitor down again.
In a manual gt3 that could have been a hugely expensive engine mistake, or at very minimum, shown up on a ecu analysis when selling the car.. not to mention I would have probably ripped off front bumper going off and back on track with two wheels. Same thing Wouldn't have happened with pdk.. manual shifting under stressful or competitive situations, even track days, leave you open to errors like this.. pdk allows you to completely eliminate that variable.
I still went manual gt3 because I'm not paid to go fast, and I want max engagement with my car. , but I can't imagine as the talentless driver that I am, risking this car on track in such a way..
Money shifting sucks, been there done that . Wish there was a fail safe mechanism of some sort.
02-18-2018, 01:03 AM
#79
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
I think of a MT like a mortar and pestle.
Yes, if I'm cooking at home for pleasure or for friends, I'll use a mortar and pestle to make things like pesto or guac or aioli.
But if I make at my restaurant, trying to keep up with the dinner crowd, it's a blender all the way. More uniform, faster, and definitely more efficient. Almost a necessity.
No right or wrong. Just really how you want to cook, or drive, and what your purpose in cooking or driving is.
Yes, if I'm cooking at home for pleasure or for friends, I'll use a mortar and pestle to make things like pesto or guac or aioli.
But if I make at my restaurant, trying to keep up with the dinner crowd, it's a blender all the way. More uniform, faster, and definitely more efficient. Almost a necessity.
No right or wrong. Just really how you want to cook, or drive, and what your purpose in cooking or driving is.
02-18-2018, 01:06 AM
#80
Rennlist Member
I think of a MT like a mortar and pestle.
Yes, if I'm cooking at home for pleasure or for friends, I'll use a mortar and pestle to make things like pesto or guac or aioli.
But if I make at my restaurant, trying to keep up with the dinner crowd, it's a blender all the way. More uniform, faster, and definitely more efficient. Almost a necessity.
No right or wrong. Just really how you want to cook, or drive, and what your purpose in cooking or driving is.
Yes, if I'm cooking at home for pleasure or for friends, I'll use a mortar and pestle to make things like pesto or guac or aioli.
But if I make at my restaurant, trying to keep up with the dinner crowd, it's a blender all the way. More uniform, faster, and definitely more efficient. Almost a necessity.
No right or wrong. Just really how you want to cook, or drive, and what your purpose in cooking or driving is.
02-18-2018, 11:55 AM
#81
Pro
02-18-2018, 12:13 PM
#82
Race Director
Originally Posted by ipse dixit
I think of a MT like a mortar and pestle.
Yes, if I'm cooking at home for pleasure or for friends, I'll use a mortar and pestle to make things like pesto or guac or aioli.
But if I make at my restaurant, trying to keep up with the dinner crowd, it's a blender all the way. More uniform, faster, and definitely more efficient. Almost a necessity.
No right or wrong. Just really how you want to cook, or drive, and what your purpose in cooking or driving is.
Yes, if I'm cooking at home for pleasure or for friends, I'll use a mortar and pestle to make things like pesto or guac or aioli.
But if I make at my restaurant, trying to keep up with the dinner crowd, it's a blender all the way. More uniform, faster, and definitely more efficient. Almost a necessity.
No right or wrong. Just really how you want to cook, or drive, and what your purpose in cooking or driving is.
But I agree with your point
02-18-2018, 01:27 PM
#83
I have a manual GT3 991.2 and you can see the difference in shifting between MT video and mine
It seems like Porsche is working hard to convince owner about PDK superiority so when they take it away in 992.2 model they say we provided manuals and no one bought them.
02-18-2018, 01:31 PM
#84
Drifting
Agree, pdk is def safer in that type of situation. I would still order a manual if I was getting a .2 as well. I'm not a race car driver either and my track time is very limited but that would not deter me from having a manual.
Money shifting sucks, been there done that . Wish there was a fail safe mechanism of some sort.
Money shifting sucks, been there done that . Wish there was a fail safe mechanism of some sort.
02-18-2018, 02:17 PM
#85
Rennlist Member
Was that Randy? If yes then the Manual is at least a full second faster than the PDK if he power shifts. He was shifting too slow. Taking his shifts speeds into account and the fact the manual had comfort seats it will be a second faster easily.
I have a manual GT3 991.2 and you can see the difference in shifting between MT video and mine https://youtu.be/aU8LgxczyoY
It seems like Porsche is working hard to convince owner about PDK superiority so when they take it away in 992.2 model they say we provided manuals and no one bought them.
By the way the sport bottom now allows you to do no lift shifts which can cut your shifting times significantly. Mark
02-18-2018, 02:21 PM
#86
Instructor
Shifting times add up?
What's an average quick shift time with a manual? 0.2-0.5 seconds? I think I average around 3-4 shifts per lap on Big Willow, if I'm not hitting traffic. That's 0.5-1 second faster right there
02-18-2018, 02:46 PM
#87
‘I believe this was Joe driving since it was posted on his channel. He is Orthojoe on the Rennlist. He is a great driver, but could be taking it easy on new car.
By the way the sport bottom now allows you to do no lift shifts which can cut your shifting times significantly. Mark
02-18-2018, 02:48 PM
#88
A power shift is around .15 max according to acceleration logs in my Cobb and that was in my Evo X. The manual in the GT3 is even faster but i dont have a way to measure it.
02-18-2018, 02:49 PM
#89
Burning Brakes
I think of a MT like a mortar and pestle.
Yes, if I'm cooking at home for pleasure or for friends, I'll use a mortar and pestle to make things like pesto or guac or aioli.
But if I make at my restaurant, trying to keep up with the dinner crowd, it's a blender all the way. More uniform, faster, and definitely more efficient. Almost a necessity.
No right or wrong. Just really how you want to cook, or drive, and what your purpose in cooking or driving is.
Yes, if I'm cooking at home for pleasure or for friends, I'll use a mortar and pestle to make things like pesto or guac or aioli.
But if I make at my restaurant, trying to keep up with the dinner crowd, it's a blender all the way. More uniform, faster, and definitely more efficient. Almost a necessity.
No right or wrong. Just really how you want to cook, or drive, and what your purpose in cooking or driving is.
