Porsche 991 GT3 Wrecked In UK With Only 80 Miles On The Clock
02-20-2014, 01:14 AM
#62
GT3 player par excellence
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well, **** happens.
it's a nice car, destroyed somehow.
i dont see what's the point of discussing this any further.
it's a nice car, destroyed somehow.
i dont see what's the point of discussing this any further.
02-20-2014, 01:25 AM
#63
02-20-2014, 03:43 AM
#65
Rennlist Member
Nothing really worthy of discussion... High power cars, rain, semi slicks and inexperience...
It's been done before, again in England... Maybe they are just crap drivers??
Jokes...
http://www.carscoops.com/2010/09/bp-...g-machine.html
This particular one was driving down a motorway... look where it ended up apparently after hitting a puddle... **** happens... Nothing to do with the 991 platform.
It's been done before, again in England... Maybe they are just crap drivers??
Jokes...http://www.carscoops.com/2010/09/bp-...g-machine.html
This particular one was driving down a motorway... look where it ended up apparently after hitting a puddle... **** happens... Nothing to do with the 991 platform.
02-20-2014, 04:41 AM
#66
Burning Brakes
Below 6deg C cold and wet on Sport Cups....not a recipe for longevity...
Btw the owner refused an offer of a replacement 991 GT3 build slot..
and opted for a V12 S....so afraid of twitchy cars....he ain't.
Btw the owner refused an offer of a replacement 991 GT3 build slot..
and opted for a V12 S....so afraid of twitchy cars....he ain't.
02-20-2014, 05:44 AM
#67
Rennlist Member
A week after I picked my car, I was driving in the city, and temperature was around 34F, and all of the sudden I encountered a downpour. The tires were still cold, and I was stopped at a red light, waiting to turn right. After it turned green, I took off from a stop turning right, and the rear end came loose quickly, but I am used to this, and made a quick steering correction and the car was back inline. I can't say I hit the gas too hard, but I also was not too gentle, and I honestly did not expect the back end to come loose so easily. The next day I swapped the tires for the Michlien PA4's and I never had any trouble since including driving the car on snow and ice. On winter tires the car handles wet roads so well, that I have to remind myself it is raining and I need to take it easy. It actually handles better than my 991 4S wearing P Zero's in the wet. The moral of the story this car is very capable and great handling car, but you must wear the correct shoes before you run in the rain or the snow. The sport cup tires in the wet cold weather can be unpredictable and can be disastrous if this is your first 911. I remember the day before this incident it was also raining and cold but the car felt predictable and the sport cups did so well, and I was really impressed with their performance and was thinking to skip the winter tire. In my opinion there are too many factors that effect the performance of a track summer tire on very cold wet public roads, and sometimes sh**t happens, but why take a risk with $150k car on public road. I recommend that people who drive their cars in cold wet winters to invest in a winter tire set, so they can enjoy driving this great car and breaking it in worry free, and while enjoying to drive it aggressively occasionally even during bad weather.
Last edited by mqandil; 03-09-2015 at 12:08 AM.
02-20-2014, 06:37 AM
#68
Former Vendor
I had a *similar* thing happen at TWS, with a 991 2S. My student was a Yellow (basically a step more advanced than a new solo driver in Texas PCA speak). She kept commenting that things didn't feel right, and every once in a while it stepped out on her a bit - but she was still learning to the car and asking the car to do extreme things every once in a while, so I chalked it up to driver error. But, no - the car was actually trying to kill her. All nannies on. Finally she asked me to drive and holey sheet....second corner into the session the car went haywire and did a 90 degree step out while at the apex of a corner (and we were going pretty slow). It turned out to be a sensor malfunction that wigged out the Torque vectoring and yaw control system.
Point is that these things are getting really really complex, and if the nannies lose track of a sense of reality, they can cause the vehicle to behave very radically.
Point is that these things are getting really really complex, and if the nannies lose track of a sense of reality, they can cause the vehicle to behave very radically.
But about slippery roads...this is how I destroyed my 951: Onramp, about 60 mph, pouring rain, +8C and MPS2's (295-18) and a LSD. When about to join the motorway I had to cross onramp's about inch deep grooves. Forward tires made it, rears did not...instant rear aquaplaning while on a slight steering movement and an inclination on the road. The rear passed me from the left before I had time to react. And I had been driving on the snow with RWD cars for 20 years then. No traction whatsoever, nor deceleration on wet grass either...went to the ditch and trees behind it with a same speed I had onramp... So I can see how the accident happened, IF the nannies were turned off.
02-20-2014, 07:26 AM
#69
The "article" makes it sound as if Porsche AG are offering him a new build in compensation, which I doubt. Just a guess, but it's far more likely that it's the dealer showing some compassion (as well as seeing an opportunity to make a sale) and offering the gentleman another allocation slot.
It's just my suspicious nature, but I find it very odd that Porsche as a corporation would be involved in this, since it's apparently the insurance that have paid off and not warranty compensation from the factory, which is what would happen if it were a defective part. As you pointed out, it would be "amazing" if this was already resolved and Porsche were offering a replacement.
It's just my suspicious nature, but I find it very odd that Porsche as a corporation would be involved in this, since it's apparently the insurance that have paid off and not warranty compensation from the factory, which is what would happen if it were a defective part. As you pointed out, it would be "amazing" if this was already resolved and Porsche were offering a replacement.
02-20-2014, 08:36 AM
#71
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I had a *similar* thing happen at TWS, with a 991 2S. My student was a Yellow (basically a step more advanced than a new solo driver in Texas PCA speak). She kept commenting that things didn't feel right, and every once in a while it stepped out on her a bit - but she was still learning to the car and asking the car to do extreme things every once in a while, so I chalked it up to driver error. But, no - the car was actually trying to kill her. All nannies on. Finally she asked me to drive and holey sheet....second corner into the session the car went haywire and did a 90 degree step out while at the apex of a corner (and we were going pretty slow). It turned out to be a sensor malfunction that wigged out the Torque vectoring and yaw control system.
Point is that these things are getting really really complex, and if the nannies lose track of a sense of reality, they can cause the vehicle to behave very radically.
Point is that these things are getting really really complex, and if the nannies lose track of a sense of reality, they can cause the vehicle to behave very radically.
I've found it very helpful to drive student's cars, really helps identify whether problems are attributable to the car or driver, and the how the car will respond when pushed a bit.
02-20-2014, 08:47 AM
#72
Rennlist Member
Wow, that's scary. I know of a Cayman that spun and hit a wall with PSM on, neither instructor in the car nor driver had any idea what happened, and instructor thought the driver was driving quite well. The track is bumpy in that corner and there was mud on one side, so my guess is that PSM got confused and made things worse. Would the outcome have been better with PSM off? We'll never know, but I do wonder.
I've found it very helpful to drive student's cars, really helps identify whether problems are attributable to the car or driver, and the how the car will respond when pushed a bit.
I've found it very helpful to drive student's cars, really helps identify whether problems are attributable to the car or driver, and the how the car will respond when pushed a bit.
02-20-2014, 08:48 AM
#73
As an old safety guy. Several things come to mind,first, I think the 991 gt3 has another new item being all wheel steering. Add this to the fact that all 991's have electric assisted steering. Therefore it is worthwhile to at least exam an un-commanded steering imput that unbalanced the car on wet and slippery conditions with cold tires. Not saying this happened but it is worth looking at.
By the way I am impressed that Porsche is being pro active in stepping up to handle the issues
By the way I am impressed that Porsche is being pro active in stepping up to handle the issues
02-20-2014, 12:48 PM
#75
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I'm not a vehicle forensics experts by any means but the extent of damage seen appears to be out of proportion to a collision occurring after losing control at 50 mph. Assuming the vehicle was going 50, then it spun, it would have lost a bit of momentum. Hard not to jump to conclusions but....