1GoodTurn

Hello All. Long post and sorry about it (feel free to skip it), but.....Looking for feedback on going from a base 911 (2009, Black, PDK, many options, $108K list) cab to a 2013 or 14 Boxster S (3 pedals) and if so, which options are important (sports plus, nav, pse, etc.). I'm hoping the new model will better fit my 6'1", 230 (and all my height is in my legs) frame.

Truth be told, the 997.2 is my first P car because, like so many, I "always" wanted a 911. Poster on the wall, etc. and it took me solidly into middle age to pull the trigger on it about two years ago. Regular working stiff here so for me it was to buy the newest one I could afford, eliminate IMS, get a PDK or live in fear of a clutch replacement and over-revs. Never owned a "euro" car, never owned a convertible. Blah, blah, whine, whine.

So, now I find that I love the car, but I baby it too much. Average 30 - 40 miles round trip about twice a month, just to make sure I get the oil to temp, put in the garage, clean it an plug in the battery tender. It's never seen rain (since I've owned it), never left alone in a parking lot, etc. Also, for 95% of the drive, I might as well be in a Buick, "Yes a Buick." So for that 5% on some country roads, I enjoy the turns and shifting with the buttons (sort of).

And now the dilema; Either I need to accept the loss on my purchase (probably $15K) and step up to a newer 911 S or GTS with a manual trans and maybe a skittles color (if I can find one in the right condition at an affordable price) and get over the paranoia of spending that much, and drive the bi_ch. All the while hoping that I will enjoy 95% of the drive (engaging?). Sometimes the 911 just seems sedate (boring?) until it exceeds handcuff speeds.

OR, maybe go to a boxster/cayman platform (couldn't care less about back seats) and have the "go cart" experience for 98% of the drive (I mean this in a very positive way). Although, the 911 does seem like a lot more car for not "too" much more money. Second OR; Leave the brand and go get a classic muscle car or another Vette (from my ill spent youth). Third OR; Go get a freakin' Miata. Ha! What was it they say about driving a slow car fast instead of a fast car slow?

Last option (by far the cheapest), swap out my buttons for a true paddle shift wheel and see what happens. Maybe add some noise to the exhaust, although that seems "cheezy" with a base Carerra. Still love the black car for about 5 minutes.

So, in conclusion, for those who've done it, do you miss the power? Do you regret the downsizing and look to go back into the bigger car? What haven't I asked? I really want to have something that I am drawn into driving more than 3000 miles in two years. Thanks in advance for your feedback.

prrod

Ok
I hear you.;
Was in your same shoes and went from a 997 to a 981.
The only thing that I miss is the torque from the bigger engine.
Otherwise, the 981 platform is a very enjoyable one which is the measure that I think you are looking for.
I also prefer the manual trans which IMO is more fun and engaging.
Depending on where you live, a Boxster s MT, sports exhaust, might be the ticket.
Nothing like open air motoring at the push of a button.
Good luck.

zedcat

Not exactly the same but I went from a 08 Carrera S to a 09 Cayman 2.9. I sometimes missed the 911 but still enjoyed the Cayman. The current 981s are very good. Have you test driven a 981 yet? Although you don't care about the back seats the most significant initial difference for me going between the cars is the relative feel of space in the 911. The Boxster/Cayman feels smaller to me. Not in a bad way necessarily but noticeable. Under way the mid engine feels quite a bit different especially on track. Have you considered DEs or Autox? That would help you get over babying the car! Good luck

1GoodTurn

Thanks for the responses. Still hoping for more input. I do certainly enjoy the drop top in my 997 (I'm in NC) for most of the year. Almost not interested in driving it unless I can take the top down. Hoping to get settled in a vehicle that keeps me more enthused for a long time. The coupe's look better, no doubt, be it a 911 or Cayman. Regarding getting on the track, maybe I haven't researched enough, but I was told "no roof, no roll bar, no track time." And losing low end torque is a concern for the smiles per mile. Just hoped an S (Cayman or Box) would feel at least about the same as what I currently have. There sure seems to be a LOT of base Caymans/Boxsters and I guess they lose more value (as a percentage) more quickly than the bigger brother. Oh well, good problem to have. Thanks again.

zedcat

Re- convertibles on track. Depends on the event organizer. Here in Texas PCA allows the 911 with the factory rollover protection to run DEs. Only club I know that doesn't allow them at all is BMW CCA. It's a fun way to see what the car's (and driver's!) capabilities are. For regular track work though, I'd rather have a coupe. And a bolt in roll bar. I'd say test drive a 981 S and see what you think about the low end. I've driven a few 981 S/ GTS with PDK and they are quick.

Zeus993

OK. I'll jump and put the OP out of his misery!

First off is to set correct the notion that owning ANY Porsche is misery because it simply is not. They are all GREAT cars and I've owned and driven a bunch of them and am fortunate to have made enough right choices in life to afford them. Porsche ownership is not a right but a privilege born out of many years of hard work and good choices and passion for experiences of excellence. It sounds like the OP is in a similar position and like many of us is always looking for something better that what he has. I relate to this as I have been and often am in the same boat. You reading this may be in a similar situation of never being satisfied and on receiving your new Porsche with 24 hours you are back on the forum classifieds and AutoTrader looking for the next one. Sound familiar? Maybe this is a characteristic of middle-aged men grasping for threads of excitement in our lives. I don't know for sure but I do know this is not true with my wife. She in many ways is going the opposite direction and looking for stability and calmness. She drives a 528i at the speed limit, stops at every stop sign etc... but for myself and others there's still a strong pulse for excitement and for the hunt, And better P-cars than other woman, right? P-cars are MUCH much less expensive in the end.

So for 1GoodTurn, from one hunter to the another, I would acknowledge you for still being in the hunt and well done!

Now back to your car. I've owned an 06 997.1 coupe (loved it) and wanted a cab so picked up an 08 TT cab. I found the way it drove to be heavy and under-steered like a mother! And the power of the TT? Gobs of it but after you've punched it for a couple of times it's like going to the fair ground and riding a roller-coaster. It gets old and I longed for something more pure, more lively, something with more drama. I drove 964's and 993's and finally settled on a Boxster Spyder MT. Now THIS is a visceral car and so full of life and fun. And it's legacy precedes - yes precedes - the legendary 911 with is Spyder 550 heritage. So your consideration of a 981 Boxster/Cayman is absolutely with merit.

But here's the thing - if you do swap cars, be ready to start looking for another! There is no perfect P-car. You will miss, as I do, some of the things about the 997. That's a GREAT car and if you replace the steering wheel, as I recommend you do first, with a Sports Wheel with paddle shifters it will be even greater. And if you don't have a sports exhaust then put one on to make it EVEN greater. And quit babying it and go and drive the snot out it. They are meant for this. Put some nicks in the paint, some miles on the odometer, some butt time behind that wheel and THEN decide if you want to swap it out. You may completely change your mind! And if you don't, go drive some different P-cars and you may decided to swap and there is no better P-car to change into than a Boxser/Cayman. They are, IMO, the best of the Porsche sport car line. Do I miss the power of the 997's? Nope. With the weight loss of the Spyder the HP:wt is better than the C2S and almost the same as the TT. Do I miss the size? Maybe.

But I do find the Spyder not the best in inclement weather so I picked up a 2015 Macan S to fill that need. So all is great but... I am now back looking at 997's like yours!

So here's a plan for you:
1. Swap out the steering wheel on your 997.2 for a Sports with paddle shifters.
2. Swap out the exhaust for a PSE (budget permitting) or a good after-market Fabspeed, AWE etc...
3. Drive the snot out of it and "bond" with it
4. Continue looking and driving as many P-cars as you can get your hands on!

Good look with your hunt. Better cars may exist out there but not my much.

Archimedes

If you go from a base 991 to a 981 Cayman S, you won't notice any dropoff in power, the difference isn't really noticeable at all. And if you're going for the go karty feel in the 981, make sure you get the X73 suspension, unless the roads really, really suck where you live.

drwuss

See if you can find/afford a boxer gts, I would recommend checking one out. Check all the cars you are interested in out and make up your own mind. FWIW The roads where I was in NC were phenomenal so I would also aim for a gts with x73 (sport chassis). It sounds like you are set on the manual, but PDK will be faster on the 981 because the ratios are a little better for setting times…

I would drive the snot out of your current car regardless of what plan you take. A friend has a 997.2 c4s and he keeps wanting to get a powerkit or exhaust and when we do the math he should just trade up to the next model. He got the better wheel for his PDK, and doesn't want to put any more $ into the car because he would have spent GTS $ on his c4s. Maybe your car is a different scenario, but I would do some math before buying "upgrades" for your car.

1GoodTurn

Hi and thanks to all for the responses. I agree about not putting too much $ into my existing car. The sport wheel with "flappy" paddles was a thought to lose the buttons (and unfortunately the heated Carbon Fiber wheel, multi-function I don't use much, if at all). And yes, going to a manual (unless I was popping for a $160k GT3) or I'd just keep my own PDK. I already know how solid my car is and zero mechanical issues. I honestly think that is my main (mistake) issue for a weekend car. In reality, I'll never have enough time to enjoy it on a track anyway.

As far as getting specific options, the selection seems limited. There are a couple of Box GTS' but, I can't see spending $80 on a used one of those when I can get a lot of a 911 for that. Again a fair number of base Box/Cay with manuals and "S's" with PDK. I have seen a Cay S with minimal options that looks good but no PASM, no X-73 (could add for around $2500 but probably look for aftermarket, if anything), no PSE (I can add that or equivalent), with Sports Chrono, with Sports Plus button, with Nav (which I've grown to like just to "look ahead" for cross roads). Not sure if these or other "missing" options should be a deal breaker. It'll take my car and 20k to buy.

I do appreciate the advice to start by swapping my wheel and live with it for a while but, my main concern with that is losing another model year (value) and selling a convertible in winter equals more loss. I'd probably wait until spring. Thoughts?

1GoodTurn

Hi and thanks to all for the responses. I agree about not putting too much $ into my existing car. The sport wheel with "flappy" paddles was a thought to lose the buttons (and unfortunately the heated Carbon Fiber wheel, multi-function I don't use much, if at all). And yes, going to a manual (unless I was popping for a $160k GT3) or I'd just keep my own PDK. I already know how solid my car is and zero mechanical issues. I honestly think that is my main (mistake) issue for a weekend car. In reality, I'll never have enough time to enjoy it on a track anyway.

As far as getting specific options, the selection seems limited. There are a couple of Box GTS' but, I can't see spending $80 on a used one of those when I can get a lot of a 911 for that. Again a fair number of base Box/Cay with manuals and "S's" with PDK. I have seen a Cay S with minimal options that looks good but no PASM, no X-73 (could add for around $2500 but probably look for aftermarket, if anything), no PSE (I can add that or equivalent), with Sports Chrono, with Sports Plus button, with Nav (which I've grown to like just to "look ahead" for cross roads). Not sure if these or other "missing" options should be a deal breaker. It'll take my car and 20k to buy.

I do appreciate the advice to start by swapping my wheel and live with it for a while but, my main concern with that is losing another model year (value) and selling a convertible in winter equals more loss. I'd probably wait until spring. Thoughts?

1GoodTurn

Hello and thanks to all those "playing along." Went to a local dealer yesterday and (no surprise) they had NO Box/Cay S with a 6 speed. So, I got to drive a Cay 2.7 with a manual (just to remind me why I am doing this to myself), then a Box S, PDK, Sports Wheel w/paddles, PSE, Sports Chrono, just to check out paddles and the "oomph" factor. Have to say, while I know the coupe would look better in the garage, dropping the top was still "more better!" especially for a big guy in a small car. But, when I got back in my base Cab 911, the torque in the "twisties" or hammer down in a straight line was much more obvious than I expected. So, currently wondering if the 6 speed S Box/Cay is worth the "give" of low end on current ride. Does that get easier with time or does the itch get worse (Zeus993???)? And you're right, they're all great in their own way! Thanks again.

Jurisnamja

I went from a 997.2 CS PDK with paddles to a base 981 Boxster manual. I also used to own the original 986 Boxster (manual) and a 987.1 Boxster S (manual). There is clearly a big difference in power/torque between the 997 CS and a base 981, but the old adage that it is more fun to drive a slow car fast than a fast car slow is true. Plus, like you, I was only driving my 997 couple of times a week at most since it was my "weekend" car. With my 981, it's my DD so I enjoy it everyday, and I get to really push the engine without having to worry about being thrown in jail. Also, as fantastic as the PDK is with the paddles, it just can't match the enjoyment of rowing through the gears with one of the best manuals in the world... but that's just my humble opinion.

Having said all that, I think you will need to assess what you want to do with you P-car and how you think you will enjoy it best. Clearly the current arrangement isn't leaving you satisfied so you might need a change... perhaps upgrade your car and make it a DD (or at least drive it more) or get a Boxster/Cayman (you can find great deals on slightly used 981). Either way these are "first world" problems and no matter what, you'll still have a P-car. Good luck!

996toomey

I did it and am very happy with my ordered 2014 Boxster S with X73. I am 6'1" tall and about 200 pounds and never considered a Boxster until the newest version came out. I never fit well in the older models. I did not have enough leg room or headroom. The 981 platform is much larger and very roomy. I also like the interior on it very much.

This is my fifth Porsche going back over 20 years and by far it is one of the most fun of all of them.

My last Porsche prior to this one was a 2008 GT three and of course you miss the power but this car is fun in other ways and I find myself driving it much more and never need my battery tender.

Zeus993

1GoodTurn - My thoughts here are that it depends on what kind of driving you like. With more power there's less shifting, less engagement with the actual physical motions of driving. For example,with the 08 Twin Turbo I had you simply kept it in one gear, hammerd the accelerator and waited for the rush of power. That got a bit old. With the heavier AWD car I also felt, as others have confirmed, that it "plowed" through the corners, understeering like a mo fo. For my type of driving I found that frustrating.

Enter in the lighter, RWD, mid-engine Boxster platform. With the Spyder I dropped from 480 to 320 HP but shed 846 lbs and gained a mid-engined car with top that dropped. Sounds like you got bitten by the open-air experience cab on your last test drive. There's noting like it. Sunroofs just don't do it IMO. So the car is so much lighter, nimble, and responsive. You hit the accelerator and bamn, the car shoots forward. Downshift, enter the corner, and the car rotates as tight as you can turn it. Perfect for my kind of weekend driving (I picked up a Macan S for the daily drive) up in the local twisties. And the Spyder top? Pure engineering genius. However I did get a bit wet yesterday and had to pull over in the city to "don" it. Like putting up a tent in the rain!

And that leads me to my next suggestion is to go and drive a 987.2 Boxster Spyder. They are GREAT buys, more power, and come in manual transmission for the full on driving experience. With the Spyder I do not miss the extra power as it's compensated with the drop in weight. It's the perfect weekend driver.

Check these out: The first silver one is a MT with the GT2 Carbon-back seats: http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-s...bar=true&Log=0