rhgindc

I've been searching online sites (CarGurus.com, Cars.com, Craiglist, etc) for over 4 months looking for a 981 Boxster S (2013 or 2014) with PDK & Sport Chrono. Most of the prices are much higher than the estimated cost I have priced via Kelly Blue Book or Edmunds.

As an example, I recently found a 2013 Boxster S with PDK/Sport Chrono for $40K with 32,000 miles at a big used car retailer.

Kelly Blue Book estimates this car to be $38.7K as a private party sale, and $36.8K as a trade-in.

Edmunds has the car to be $35.4K as a private party sale and $31.2 as a trade-in.

Is it difficult to find prices more in line with these estimates because of the area I live in (Southern California)? Or is it simply and supply and demand issue?

Lastly, is the 2013 Boxster S PDK/Sport Chrono with 32,000 miles a decent and reasonable buy for $40K?

Top Jimmy

Dealer is always going to ask for more than what a private party sale would be. Just remember that is the starting point of the negotiation, not the final sales price. They know it, and you should too. How they make their money is they give less on a trade in than what a private party seller would sell for, or for what they might get it at a wholesale auction. It is how they make money.

-TJ

manifold danger

I wouldn't be surprised if Southern California influences that as well as generally the cost of living there is very high- but there are a ton of other factors that might actually contribute to the opposite. I'm sure with higher income also comes more competition; the few times I've been to southern cal I've seen far more exotics than anywhere else I've been, and I live and work in the DC metro area so there's no shortage of income here. Also, the climate and income likely contribute to just a healthier market for sports cars in general, and thus a much higher inventory volume than the rest of the country that could also contribute to competitive pricing.

There's also just the simple possibility that the 981 values are actually trending upward. It would confirm a ton of the negative bias you'll likely see distributed throughout this forum and the enthusiast community at large towards the choice Porsche made with the 718. But there are already about a dozen other threads on that already...

Drew_K

Retail / dealer prices will be higher than private party prices, so the KBB price is actually accurate relative to the $40K dealer price you found. The Edmunds price seems pretty low though.

That $40K price sounds about right for that car. Just make sure it has your 'must have' options.

Archimedes

And private party asking prices are usually well above what the cars actually sell for. Most Porsche's owners seem to take a hit in the crack pipe before they set the price in their for sale ads.

RWPinNC

While your California location likely affects price some, remember that, among enthusiasts, this is a national market. I'm not sure that Edmunds or KBB capture the market for the cars that the participants on this board look for. There are likely a lot of cars that change hands with problematic histories, high mileage, in bad condition, or through non import dealers or lower end independent lots that might not even show up on our searches. Also the "trade-in" value as mentioned above can be a pretty depressing figure.

The 2013 you cited sounds very reasonable to me given that 987.2's in top condition are commonly mod-30's cars.

Kg11

KBB can be all over the place. A friend was telling me that a 20,000 mile 997 C2S manual loaded with options was being priced on KBB between $50-52k private party. A car like that will sell for $58-60k here private party all day long, and $65-70 at a dealer. I have found their prices to be somewhat reliable on easier to price cars, but nowhere near reality on in-demand Porsches. The good thing can be that you find someone selling their car for well below what it is worth, if you are in the right place at the right time. There was a guy over on the PCA classified that listed his 2015 Cayman S, which was sapphire blue and had 37,000 miles and previous CPO, with all performance options, for $47k. I tried to buy it; so did about 5 other people, and he ended up getting $51k. KBB was telling him $47k private party, but that is not even close to what a build like that is worth.

KBB does a terrible job pricing options. A build with 18-ways, PSE, X73, and 6MT is going to bring in a lot more than a build with a bunch of cosmetic fluff that no enthusiast cares about.

Slim987

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fast1

There's the wholesale price and then the retail price. It's easy to determine wholesale. Just check out auction prices or take your car to a Dealer and ask them what they will pay you for your car. Retail price is hit or miss. Generally a highly optioned car will take a hit when it comes to resale price, but the seller could get lucky and find a buyer who wants those options and is willing to pay a premium for them. A Dealer can't count on luck and must rely on how well a similar car has sold in the past.
As far as KBB is concerned, Kelley Blue Book receives real-world new car prices and used car prices from actual transaction information from numerous sources. Given the numerous transactions, there's no way for it to be perfect, but it does provide car buyers and sellers with a decent guide.

kiznarsh

Do you know if they account for private party sales through the DMV? I can see some kinda database for dealers and used car lots, but when Jack pays Chad with a cashier's check, only option would be the DMV.

I've also found NADA Guides to be a little more accurate than KBB.

fast1

https://www.kbb.com/car-advice/artic...e-book-values/

kiznarsh

Thanks for the link.

" Kelley Blue Book tracks consumer sale prices each year" but they didn't specify how they actually do that. If only Les was still around.

Kg11

You will get a pretty good idea of "real" prices by watching the classifieds here, seeing what sells and how quickly. Lots of cars are posted, but typically outside of a unicorn build, only the cars that are halfway between dealer and trade-in get purchased. BAT is not a bad resource either: the Cayman R spoken about above had a rough history and had a reserve not met at $42,500. The one listed last year went for $48k with PDK and about 30,000 miles, meaning that a 15,000 mile example in a 6-speed is likely worth $7-10k more ($2500 per 10k miles driven is a good rule of thumb for most cheaper Porsches, something that is a few years old at least, like a 997 or a 987) and 6MT is worth a premium on a car like that; easily $3-5k.

You can also bookmark cars on cars.com or Autotrader.com. See what the asking prices are, and see what sells quickly vs what sits for several months. It is pretty telling where the market is, outside of the unicorn type of car, in which a buyer just HAD to have that color or spec (such as a PTS build).

Regional differences will also play a part, but less than you may think. People aren't stupid: if they can save $10k by getting a clean car from Iowa or Alabama and pay $1500 for shipping, they will do so. Rarely are the price differences more than a few thousand: at times, they are even more expensive, as the selection in a smaller region is tiny and dealers can charge a premium. That is certainly the case in the PNW: 90% of Porsches on lots are SUVs, and the Porsches that people really lust after go for a pretty penny.

If you get a "deal" from a dealer, it is probably an off-brand mainstream dealer. Porsche dealers know what they have, as do independent performance dealers that carry luxury cars. You may stumble onto a deal if a Chevy or Ford dealer takes a trade, gives the seller a low value (often inadvertently) and then lists it for much lower than it should be listed as. I saw a 997 GTS4 with 10k miles listed for $70,000 that way; it was marked as an "S" and not a GTS. I have seen 991's mistakenly priced as 997's as they are both 2012 MY, but the difference is $10k for the same build. These big dealers get a lot of trades and sometimes they make a mistake.

Also, you can post here! Most people have an idea of what their car is worth, or have purchased recently.