Metal Guru

There's a reason that the manual says to disconnect the battery before starting any work. In actual fact, you'll never know what really happened.
If you can't source an EZ, there are other options.
PM Black_Hat. He has gone through this and would walk you through what he did.

cobalt

I contacted them and they would not work on them and ship through customs for a reason they wouldn't disclose. Porsche lists these as discontinued. They did sell refurbished ones a while back but pricey. The 02 for the 3.6 was available refurbished but now seems to be superseded or this is the refurbished part number. Quite the core charge.

http://www.sunsetporscheparts.com/oe...he/965602706bx



I have a couple of spare units for the 3.6 unfortunately none for the 3.3. I do have some EZ68's used by Brumos for their 3.3l race cars. These featured programable chipsets that I have no idea what they did.

I don't know what the differences are so I can't tell you if a 3.6 will work in a 3.3 but I am assuming it won't the other way around. The EZ68's might work on your car.

If it helps I would be happy to lend you them to see if it resolves the problem. IIRC there is a white insulating grease that needs to be used with these as well. Not sure what for but I am assuming it prevents arching? anyone know what the grease is for?

If anyone knows whether an 02 will work in place of an 01 let us know. Otherwise I can send you the EZ68 and hope it works I have never tested them.

Metal Guru

It's thermally conductive dielectric grease; it keeps the EZ cool by coupling it to the aluminum back plane it mounts to.
There is an automotive grade silicone grease available from Summit Racing and local auto parts stores.

urquattro20Vt

In my opinion this is really the one Achilles Heal to the 964 Turbo. If you scour the internet, parts yards and dealers you may find one. For $2500+ I assume. And you'll have a 26 year old ignition computer that may die a month later. Or last for years. Who knows. I think the solution is likely going to be MSD ignition or something like that. I think you'll have to remove the motor and install a toothed timing wheel....

Good luck - sorry you have to deal with this.

maverick

thanks very much for all the input guys.....
Anthony, PM and email sent.

TT Surgeon

would that 02 unit from sunset work in a 3.3 turbo?

maverick

All the great minds say the 02 which is the 3.6 controller will not work on the 3.3.....

Metal Guru

Did they say why?

cobalt

I pulled this from an article Adrian Streather Published.

Basic operation of the electronic ignition control unit
(Bosch EZ69).
(Applicable to all 964 Turbo versions).
The control unit receives inputs from:
Flywheel speed sensor (pulse generator in the parts catalogue).
Fuel octane code.
Boost air temperature. 0° throttle switch.
Power via the relay.
The control unit also has a pressure sensor installed. This pressure sensor is
connected to the throttle body. The purpose of the pressure sensor is to provide
engine load (amount and pressure of air entering the engine) data to the ignition
control unit.

Note:
The pressure sensor in the ignition control unit has the same role as the air
flow sensor in the normally aspirated engines.
The control unit then calculates the correct dwell angle and when to fire each spark plug based in calculations from all the electronic inputs
the pressure input and pre-programmed digital maps.

The outputs from the control unit are:

Signal at the ignition transformer
Engine speed (rpm) to the turbo boost control unit and to the tachometer (rev
counter).

M64/50 engine:
Whilst similar to the earlier M30/69 engine ignition system some changes to the
M64/50 were introduced the 964 Turbo 3.6 made its appearance in model year 1993.

These differences are:

The installation of a new ignition control unit with modified ignition mapping pre-programmed into the control unit (part number 965 602 706 02).
The pressure sensor line is relocated to the downstream section of the throttle
body. This was done to reduce the impacts of full load pulsations on the pressure sensor installed in the control unit.

I am assuming the chip in the unit I am sending maverick played with the mapping as well. I guess we will find out soon enough what changes were made by Andial. AFAIK these were for the #58 Brumos 3.3 964 race car based on the hand written markings.

Metal Guru

The revised mapping may be some ignition advance to account for cams with more overlap. Otherwise I don't see how it can be much different.
Put a timing light on the crank damper to verify this.

maverick

...Anthony truly exemplifies why this forum community is so great.....really appreciate the support and help......i will keep this post updated with the progress and findings as they come in....very hopeful for positive outcome and interested to see what the "black box" does for #304

Metal Guru

You have to take what Streather has written about Turbos with a grain of salt.
To whit:

The control unit also has a pressure sensor installed. This pressure sensor is connected to the throttle body.

Then Streather further states:

The pressure sensor line is relocated to the downstream section of the throttle
body. This was done to reduce the impacts of full load pulsations on the pressure sensor installed in the control unit.

In actual fact, the hose to the sensor was never connected to the throttle body, either upstream or downstream, but to the intake manifold.

Granted, this is a minor error but trust me, there are much bigger ones in that book.

As reference material for Turbos go, Streather's book belongs on your coffee table, not in your garage.

cobalt

I did this quickly and it did not dawn on me that he has that info incorrectly noted. I should know by now but honestly I have a hard time keeping N/A and turbo differences isolated in my head.

I agree he made a lot of mistakes in his book. There are entire sections with incorrect info especially his documentation of production numbers which we now all know are way off, however there is a good portion of his work that is correct and he spent a lot of time breaking things down long before most anyone had a clue.

I give him credit for taking on the challenge although I think he might have relied on too many outside sources for his information without verification. I would not put it on my coffee table but I agree anything should be verified before used.

I am curious what Maverick finds out with the custom chip EZ unit. No doubt there are enough differences between these units that Porsche needed to make a revision. It would be interesting to see what happens to a 3.3 when a 3.6 unit is installed.

JasonAndreas

Do you want me to take a look when I am back in the states next month? I can pull an EPROM reader out of storage that I can bring to the IMSA race @ LimeRock or we can do it via regular mail.

Metal Guru

It's not your fault. I read it twice and said "What the hell?"

The 3.6 had a little hotter cams than the 3.3 if I'm reading cam specs correctly. I think they added a little advance to the timing since that diluted mixture (for those not familiar with cam overlap; at overlap when intake and exhaust valves are open together, some exhaust gets pulled into the combustion chamber) needs a little more time to burn.
Guess we'll find out soon.