lumpking

I want to get a daily driver. I really love the 964 turbos but the 993 turbos have substantially more stock power. Are the 964 turbos really worth 60k+ ? Most of the ads I see are around that price. That is a comp to a nice 993 turbo. Why are they maintaining such a high resale value? What should I expect to pay for a well maintained 964 turbo?

thanks

Metal Guru

Here's your future using a Turbo as a daily driver:
(1) Your the kind of guy who finds putting air into his tires challenging. You must pay a mechanic to do everything. Budget $1000/month (parts and labor) average and have another car to drive when the Turbo is at the shop.
(2) You suffer from "the knack" and working on a Turbo is something you relish. Budget an average of $500/month for parts and plan to spend many weekends fixing stuff at random times (especially if you are the kind of guy that wants his car to be perfect, like myself). Since the car will be down on weekends you better be the kind of guy who works well under pressure if you need said Turbo to take you to work on Monday AM.

Either way it's a very expensive proposition. Don't forget gas and the Turbo doesn't exactly sip the stuff.

While we're talking about perfect cars, daily driving of a Turbo (or any 16 year old car) will tear it up pretty good so you can abandon the fantasy of winning the local wash and shine concourse.

lumpking

Gosh Metal, Tell me how you really feel. I was under the impression that these were bullet proof as long as they weren't abused or improperly modified. I don't think others would agree with your cost estimates but thank you for the input.

One of Twenty

Guru,

I typically take both of mine to my tech for work and I spare no mechanical or cosmetic expense on either of mine.

Money spent since I've owned my 964 Turbo S2 (993TT - new only $1,500 or so) - my 964 Turbo S2 is NOT a daily driver, 49k miles:

2005: $4,803.68
2006: $1,450.00
2007: $317.99
2008: $8,362.99

Total: $14,935.99


Cheers,


Greg

biglicks

I'm with Greg on this one, while I admit I've spent a few $$ on mine since purchase, it's been the cost of mods/upgrades that I've spent the money on. I've had mine since October 2007, so far had a service at a specialist $500, replaced a holed exhaust pipe (I've opted to replace the whole system, although the part I needed could have been purchased for $240, the only other thing I really needed was a rear seatbelt, cost $140. Next job I have one bust speaker, so all will get replaced.

Mods is another story, wastegate $100, sport cat $1000; GSF exhaust $1000

To answer your original question 60k+ is impossible to answer, is it US dollars etc? If it is US that price seams high, I would say about 35-45 would get you in to a decent one, higher numbers for mint garage queens, as a daily driver you don't need one of these. I think I'll have to leave it to others to comment on the 993TT, I've never driven or owned one.

Regards
Steve

kimo964

I've put over 8k on my turbo in the last 12 months. The only thing I had to do was a few oil changes, bleed the brakes once and an alignment. Less than 700.00. Lucky, my car came with all the mods I wanted so I haven't spent anything in that dept.

I have other cars to alternate to but if I had to daily drive the Turbo, I would not hesitate for a sec. Not too stiff, working ac, plenty of power & reliable..at least mine is.

I'll let others chime in on the 993tt vs 964t comparision and the values of the 964t.

Flachbau

I think it really depends on how you drive the car and what kind of commute you have (your commute will be the primary miles put on a daily driver). If you have long and largely a stop and go commute - forget it. The maintenance expense will be too high for a car that is not being driven as intended (excess clutch wear etc.). A long and fast canyon drive to work would be great but also wearing on the car.

Maybe you could look at it in the context of your track bike. How many track days do your tires last and how soft of a compound do you use? That may tell you something about how your experience will go (mine last one to two track days max and I use the softest compound I can for the weather conditions). So I would predict that as daily driver a 3.6 turbo would not be a good choice for me.

If you don't mind spending the money then it may not matter, but also know that as you put excessive miles on the car the value drops steeply whether they are commute miles or track miles.

cobalt

I agree with the others.

Two fold reason why the 964 turbos are holding their value:
Low production numbers.

Last of the RWD single turbo Iconic Porsche that still has the raw old school feel with modern updates. Last rear wheel turbo car made for US consumption until the release of the GT2.

There were almost as many 993TT's made in a single year then all 964 turbos for US consumption. The 3.6 is relatively low with 411 stock turbos and we still don't know how many of those were shipped to other countries within the America's and how many were used for IMSA race series. At least 50 cars are gone or have salvage titles and a fair portion are getting up in miles.

Supply and demand appears to be keeping pricing on an upward swing, staying flat at a min. There are fewer and fewer unmolested low mileage cars available each year.

Power is relevant. If you add up drive train loss, the 993TT has 18-20% due to the AWD system vs 15% of the single rwd cars. So the differences negate themselves. The 993TT puts down 328hp across 4 wheels which helps when launching but the AWD system adds weight. the 94 306 and the 91-92 at 272 give or take. These numbers can easily be modified on any car.

the 993TT has EFI v CIS. Better gas mileage and smoother power curve. It makes for a much easier DD car. You will find most of us don't DD our cars. It is a lot of car and requires your complete attention. AS you get older you appreciate an easy DD car. To be honest for power and comfort with all the modern conveniences nothing is better than a 996TT for the price as a DD. It isn't raw or as much fun IMO but is a hell of a lot of car for the $$ and is not all consuming like the older turbos. It doesn't get the attention the older cars do which sometimes can be a good thing.

Maintenance is relative to the initial condition of the car, the conditions of your commute and how you plan on addressing it's needs as with any used car.

In 10k miles i have more $$ into mods then maintenance.

Metal Guru

Compared to, say, a Ferrari, yes they are more reliable (bulletproof is pushing it) but the bottom line is they are older used cars that have received varying amounts of attention.
Have a read of some of the recent threads here where guys drove their cars every day, rain or shine, winter and summer, and are now bailing out because the cars essentially "bankrupted" them (I'm exaggerating a little here).
As for myself, my Turbo is a special treat to be driven when I have time to really relax and enjoy it. If I drove it every day it would quickly become just another expensive transportation appliance to me.

lumpking

Thanks every one for the opinions. I think I have decided on the 964 as apposed to the 993tt. I think I knew that's what I would do, hence the post in this forum. My search will start in Jan.

Metal, thanks for the opposing view on cost. I hope my experience will prove you wrong but there is certainly no way to avoid high dollar maint when you deal with a 14-17 Y/O performance car. Not even one engineered to Pcar standards.

biglicks

I think that's exactly the right kind of attitude to adopt taking on one of these.

Steve

Megatron-UK

As a counterpoint to some of the guys comments above, In the 2 years of owning mine, I've done just over 6000 miles and have done little other than service it.

The exhaust system needs replacing shortly, but that's due to 15 years of crap UK weather, more than anything else.

In terms of fuel and insurance though, they're not cheap to run in that respect. You're not going to get above 19/20mpg at the best.

Gandara

Yeah, gotta consider that MPG