I have a question for you guys. I'm restoring a 91 911 turbo with low miles. The car has a Andial S2 intercooler. I thought only 20 of these were made for 1992 models? I also heard Andial may have made more of these intercoolers for purchase? I know this is a very unique piece to any 965/964 Turbo. What do you think the market on BAT would be for this intercooler or how much value do you think this intercooler would add to my car's value? My car is being turned into a lightweight turbo. Thank you

 

I would love to have it for my 1992 965. what are you replacing with?

 

I'm not replacing it. For now, just curious about the History of these Andial 964 Turbo intercoolers. I noticed 78 people read the post and no replies. I think the average 964 turbo owner doesn't know about S2 Andial 965's. It might be worth more to me than anyone else.

 

You're correct, Scott. The S2 chapter in the history of the 965 is not well known or all that well documented. It tracks with C2 Carrera Cup car history. Two swings, two misses by PCNA in trying to production-based establish racing series similar to what was going on in Europe at the time.
I think it would hold the most value for someone who was restoring an S2.
Turbokraft makes a clone of it as well as others, I would imagine.

 

The S2 intercooler is very deceiving; at first glance it looks the same as the standard part : but that rear photo showing the neck and the additional depth that Andial created for the core (but keeping the same - or similar - overall dimensions) shows that it must be a good increase in capacity.

I don't think I have seen a decent set of pictures that show the difference next to the standard part.

 

My guess is it would fetch decent money sold alone. I don't think it would really add to the value of a car tho. Would you pay more for a 964T with an Andial IC? I don' think I would - or it would be very, very small increase - likely less than what it could sell for by itself. There's a guy in our local group who bought an S2 last summer - haven't seen it yet tho...

Brandon
'91 Turbo

 

The gold standard for turbo intercoolers was manufactured by Secan in France for the old 935's that ran in Europe in the 70's but they are unobtainable.

 

Paul, I'd like to find this intercooler. It was super light weight. Easy to remove and install. Always cool to the touch. This came from a 94 3.6 Turbo track-day car. I'll reach out to Patrick Motorsports and Rothsport.

 

Just saw this. It is my understanding that Ruf also used these on some of their period turbos. I have a friend with an S2 and AFAIK only 2 of the 20 have been destroyed. You aren't the only one with one of these and do we know if these were ANDIAl built or just installed? IIRC L8Apex had one years ago as well on his turbo but we are going way back. Also these were used on the race versions produced by ANDIAL and some of the LeMans raced cars so who knows.

Like my 3.8RSR speedlines how often do you come across a set. I see people asking $14k for stock I/C's and unless you want or need one there are far better I/C cores out there now. Secan is one that is always well received but the new Garrett I/C's I am using on my TT build are superior in efficiency today. You can probably build one cheap enough if you are good at fabricating or know someone.




My never ending twin turbo track car build these should stay cool on hot track days with 2 drivers pumping out 4-500 whp. Still a long way off from completion.

 

Cobalt, Wow that's a huge intercooler. Thanks for the Great Info. i googled the hell out of RUF and this intercooler and came up with zero results. I bought one of the Totaled S2's engines in the late 90's or 2000. That's what I was told. It was Some time before 9-11-01 wrecked my Porsche business. The engine went in that 92 American Roadster that shot out 4' flames. The intercooler went on this 91 Turbo that came back to me this year. After 20 years I had no idea where it went. Fast forward I would keep it with this turbo if she was a 1992 model. But Might come up for sale if B&B can make me a light weight Intercooler. Patrick Motorsports said it might take years for them to make one as B&B might be focused on Corvette exhausts.

 

Full Race sells the cores. Since this is a Twin turbo engine I originally was going to use the 993TT IC which was quite pricey. Then I had a friend do a solidworks flow study and found that the 993 design was limited and created a lot of turbulence and dead spots. We came up with this design adding the slight V shape to eliminate the dead spots. I made the end tanks out of aluminum sheet with a lot of bending and welding. Down side is the cores are so packed with fins that the weight is about the same possibly heavier than the stock unit and it sits a bit higher. This was designed to sit under the 3.8RSR wing and is pretty snug against the lid but leaves just enough clearance to prevent damage to either. This car will be driven by my wife, myself and if he behaves possibly my son so it will get a workout at track events. We figure the engine will be good for 650-700 WHP but I plan to detune it with multiple power settings depending on the tune selected. We are using speed sensors on the turbos to even things out and I was torn but decided to duct the WG's into the exhaust and I suspect this will be shooting flames as well. The mounting brackets are still in the works this was just to get it setup.

I suspect this thing will scare the daylights out of me but 'while you're in there' happened.

Every inch of this build was custom and we are getting closer. The custom plumbing and harnesses are taking the most time.



Unlike other builds like this I have seen by Patrick Motorsports and others I couldn't have the headers hang down low as they did and I did not want to use a W collector like Porsche does so it was a bit tricky but this should save the engine in case I end up going high or slightly over the turtles.




I picked up a second track car which was a blast. Essentially a 964 cup with a little more oomph. But my son accidentally money shifted killing cylinder #1. So I have yet another project.

I suspect if I can learn to drive this thing it will blow the doors off some of the modern cars but will be a bear to drive at speed.

Engine is back out and now getting all the finish work done. Coil packs are marine grade and large but fit the budget and the same as what AEM sells just not branded as theirs. All custom harness and the plumbing of the oil & water for the turbos is what is taking the longest. We could have used silicone tubing but decided to do everything in aluminum or Stainless tubing instead and this is taking its sweet time.

🤞This thing will be up and running for a late season shake out and then ready for next season.


Using a GT3 intake which is another issue plumbing the IC to the intake.

 

Anthony, that's the best grade of turbo **** I think I've ever seen.
My advice is to keep the boy out of that car if you want it to live You have way too much time and $$$$ invested to be undone by a lack of experience.

 

 

I was in a 98 C4s with a twin turbo set up like what you are building. It was very painful for my neck muscles. I assume you are running two oil lines to the turbos? I see that line that runs in between them. Does that need a pump?

 

This is actually a low boost setup on an N/A 993 engine with custom pistons to change compression. Full everything internally. I even modified the hydraulic lifters to mechanical. It saves 3/4 of a pound of weight where needed. Coupled with a short geared box and 40/60GT3 LSD. This thing will fly. So this, assuming everything is planned out properly should feel like a very powerful N/A motor with a lot of torque and power. All this will be fine tuned on the dyno.

The turbos are Borg Warners latest witch you can bins build. Spec'd out with Stainless hot side, Ti impellers and speed sensors. We will be running oil from the oil bridge which feeds the rockers. Since they are now mechanical they should be fed by the hydraulic feeds through the shaft vs squirters and the extra oil should be enough to lube the turbos. I am also using a radiator from a tip trans mounted to my second oil cooler to run water wetter through them via a pump. It isn't necessary but I prefer to be overly cautious. I also made the return lines so they won't allow oil to flow back into the turbos after the engine is shut down. The pipes are not done in that picture but they have high spots that sit above the oil level in the case that the oil will have to make it's way past. Those lines terminate into a T that feeds directly into the case coming from 996TT turbo reservoirs that I had to cut and modify to fit and work. I decided not to use the BOV as I don't think they can control the boost to the level I am looking to.

The list is exhaustive and it has all gotten very complicated from something that started out as a simple rebuild. There is a rather large spreadsheet to document everything for future reference. I would guess if any of the well known shops put this much into it they would charge between $70k-100k for the work involved. Once all the wiring and custom work on the engine is done the engine goes back in the car and then the plumbing for the water lines and the rest gets completed. I still need to get the ABS system up and running but in the future I plan to upgrade that to maybe a BMW racing 4 channel system or 993 whatever works for the least $$. I might need to up the front rotors from 330mm. At the engines prior 330 whp and tq the 993RS brakes were adequate but I guess I will find out eventually. These three channel ABS systems are good in a straight line or bend but if you spin and end up going backwards you are SOL. I might install an ABS cut off for now. I will also use the ABS sensors to monitor wheel spin which can control the throttle via the ecu. That part is a later project. This will also have dual wideband and other little goodies.

The MCS 3WR system and full suspension upgrade should make this a well rounded and func ar to drive at speed. All in all fast but somewhat safe I want my wife to enjoy driving it. Right now she is a bit scared.

Sorry we are getting a bit off topic.