Les Quam

COBALT, in regard to HP I have never had mine on a chassis dyno and the only person I know who has, came up with 455 HP at the rear wheels. I have however raced my flatnose turbo S against my old 2001 twin turbo and the flatnose beat it pretty easily. So easily that I sold my 01 and bought an 03 X 50 twin turbo which the flatnose could not beat but was able to hang with. The X 50 had no lag got early jump once flatnose boost came on the two cars were even. At some point I will get the flatnose on a dyno. But right now all I do is show it. In regard to value, a flatnose with 1600 miles that was originally ordered by Michael Jordan sold last week by a dealer known as Road Scholars sold for 140 according to that dealer, who sold it for a collector who bought it from a dealer in the midwest in the 130s this summer. I know of 3 other sales in America of flatnose turboS. One sold mid 90s from Bev. Hills Porsche two years ago. Two sold by Ray Joeseph around 100 last year of RPM motorsports. A dealer who I did not trust tried to sell me a non flatnose 94 turbo S back East a year ago with 12,00 miles. To learn more about this car go to flachbau.com a website devoted to these cars.

cobalt

Les Quam,

455 at the rear wheels or at the flywheel? I was under the impression you couldn't achieve these numbers at the rear wheels with CIS. Even with the
larger intercooler more aggressive cams, turbo and spring upgrade.

I visited the flachbau website he states that the X88 option produces 385 FWHP. and some 500+ pounds of torque. My mechanic who services this S feels with the mods done to my car I am about the same hp less torque as the S. He does factory X88 modes quite often. I was told they are not as comfortable for the street as the stock config.

My mechanic and the person with the S has tried to convince me to have the factory upgrade done to my car but I didn't think it would be worth it.

This S doesn't get driven much either, I believe he has under 12K miles on it. The one time he tracked the car against the latest Ferraris and several modified 500+ hp tt's he said he out powered them. He said the car is no were near as fast as his BTR but definatly very fast close to his GT2. I am very curious to know what results you get when you dyno it. What is your impression of the streetability? I am already spinning my rear wheels in first and second gears with 285 S02's in the rear.

Les Quam

COBALT, remember that 455 was hearsay , not something I have seen. The only thing I'm sure of is that it beat my 01 TT. And hung with my x 50. I am not an expert on these cars, I stumbled on to mine it has 4000 original miles and was sold here in Vegas by my dealer and by my current salesperson. Both prior owners died and I bought it from estate while I was trying to buy another Porsche the decedent had. I did not even know what it was when I first saw it. Neither did the estate since they sold it to me for what a regular 94 TT sell's for. I will tell you about a conversation I had this summer with the Porsche factory engine builder who was at my dealership this summer doing torture testing on the prototype Carrera GT. His name was Helmut and he has been with Porsche for about 26 years and he has helped develop the new CGT motor. During our conversation I told him that my 94 S had beat my 01 TT. I asked him how that was possible. He told me that in 94 150 race engines had been built for the 94 911 Turbo racing program. 75 went to race cars the rest went to 94 Turbo S. He told me that motor was slipped past Fed regs. and produced well over 400 HP. He would not tell me anymore, or the actual HP. But he was very proud of that motor and had me bring the car down, so the other factory engineers could look at it. He told me never to sell it because they can't do cars like that anymore. He told me he and several others actually built the 94 S motors. Anyway he talked more about that motor then thr CGT. He did tell me the CGT motor puts out 620 HP not the 604 as made public. As for streetability mine is OK, if I modulate throttle properly. Like I said I'm not an expert on this 94 car you now know as much as I do. And you know a whole lot more about 94s then I do. As for dyno , my Porsche nut cousin has spent months detailing the car for shows and now when I try to drive it, he spends 2 hours cleaning for every hour I drive it. And makes me feel guilty if I get it dirty. This nut has every nut and bolt both top and bottom so clean you could eat off it. It's now a dreaded garage queen trailered to show's. A sad ending to a great car. It may never see a dyno or the street for that matter. Makes me want to cry actually.

cobalt

She sounds like a beauty. If you have any pictures I would love to see them. Defenitly don't seller her she will only appreciate.

Since Porsche measures HP at the Flywheel and not at the wheels I would have to say it's FWHP which sounds right. At this time I don't see the need to modify my engine considering how fast the car is already but if it's worth doing anything the S upgrade is the only way to go with these cars.

Thanks for the info and don't forget the pictures if you have the time.

Regards,

Anthony

PS How does the car compare to your GT2. The other S owner claims his S is about as fast as his GT2. I assume the 97 S is a tt. and you sold the 03 X 50?

cobalt

Just revisited the slopenose listing on E-bay. The current bid is $42,600 meeting the reserve. I figured with all the parts and the fact that this guy says the car only needs minor work that he would ask a bit more. I guess the speculation was correct this car has more damage than meets the eye.

Staffan

Where going through this a year ago with a friends car, was in contact with experts at Porsche in Germany. At first it looked like the only thing needed to be changed was a fender and a door.

My friends car which was beyond repair had what looked like a small dent in the roof. That was the tell sign it had structurel damage. The sunroof is popping out on this car!

If Porsche refuses to fix a car by bending or welding in high streanght steel componenets for liability reasons, what will the insurance companys response be if there was an accident some time in the future ?

Les Quam

COBALT, as for pictures, they should be on the flachbau.com site any day now. I have never raced the 94 S with the 97 turbo S or the GT 2. However I don't think it will keep up with the GT 2. But feels like it will stay with if not beat the 97 S. I will e mail you when the pictures hit the website. My 2 cents on adding the mods for HP is to leave it alone. Their is always someone faster and it takes away from the original nature of the car. My 2 cents is the cars are a thing of beauty why go inside a pristine motor?

cobalt

Les Quam, Thanks for the info and the advice. I don't plan on making any changes, at least at this time. The car is fast enough as it is and is quite streetable. I am looking forward to seing the pictures. It is a shame she has become a garage queen, however it appears you have enough toys to play with.

Cupcar#12

Thought i would weigh in on this one since the damage is extremly similiar to the damamge on my cup car - which is going to be fixed this summer.
The way they are talking about fixing the car is not an approved porsche method and in deed if this ever happens again is extremly dangerious. you can't just clip the front and weld on a new section from the shock towers forward - you have to rebuild it peice by peice - the reason for this is that there are overalpping sections of metal that have to be welding together in the front structure and you simpily can not get it done right from just one side.
My 2 cents - the repair should run in the neighbor hood of about 20K to do right once you repaint the car (you have to make the color match exactly)
The fender will not jsut bolt on - and could be very different from the left just b/c of the way it was made (no real production stampings for these)

cobalt

He pulled the add just a few hours before closing. Someone had a bid for $42,600 meeting the reserve. Either he expected it to go for more or someone made him an offer. Still say something more than meets the eye is going on there.

Les Quam

www.specialtysales.com is selling a black on black 94 turbo S flatnose for 129,000 with a documented history. Nice pictures on website.

Mark S.

I received an email from the guy who owns this car with respect to his experience getting a replacement fender from Porsche. He said the front fender from Porsche (which took eight months to get) was a hatchet job and that he could have made a better fender himself. I don't doubt his assessment as according to Porsche they can't find the orginal design plans or jigs for this car and therefore can't reproduce any of the custom parts! I think this will make these cars very valuable in the future.

As to dyno results I had my car (3.6 Turbo S) SAE rear wheel dynoed several years ago (results still not posted on my website - my bad). They are:

SAE actual (unadjusted) HP 370.1
SAE actual (unadjusted) Torque 374.3

SAE adjusted HP 356.7
SAE adjusted Torque 360.8

Add 12% to 15% markup to crank HP.

I'd post dyno charts if I could figure out how.

Mark

Staffan

Mark, very impressive numbers indeed!