Hem

Thanks Steve!

JasonAndreas

Change fuel & air filters every 10k? Plug wires at 30k? Oxygen sensor at 30k? Distributor belt at 60k? You are kidding right? So speaking from the mechanical side of the industry, how many 964s have you actually worked on to come to these conclusions? Conclusions that are not even remotely close to the factory recommended service intervals?

Tmistry

Are 'factory service intervals' relevant on 20+ year old cars? To ensure a collector car lasts on the original engine, I think Steve's recommendation makes sense.

When I think factory recommended service intervals I think daily driver cars under maybe 5 or 10 years old tops. After this, it's up to the owner to determine the best interval based on use.

Maybe not, I'm no expert. It's all bunk anyway, since most 964 owners do a full rebuild every 10,000 miles. I, for one, am more diligent and opt for a top end reseal at the 5,000 interval as well. Might be excessive, but my Indy ****ing loves me!

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greg1990964

Jason, and you saying Steve is suggesting those intervals are long or short?

Mixter

+1. Great advise!

I also watch my temp gauge very closely. How the car is driven is important........RPMs, idling,speed, distance, etc. As most of us know these cars like long distance open highway driving. Short commutes and city driving with lots of idling not so good.

Goughary

Factory service intervals...

I find it humorous that anyone would believe that factory service intervals are set and designed to be "what's best for the motor"...

As far as I can see, factory service is included typically, and therefore setup to be as far from good for the motor and drivetrain as they can get away with. They would rather your car not break, because they would have to fix it...but they don't much care that you go 15k on old dirty oil before making your first oil change?

I'm sorry...but if the FAA followed your typical automotive service schedule...our planes would fall from the sky.

Following steve's, and others, advice for service, such as....change oil often, change plugs, wires etc, often, change trans fluid, often...a properly maintained engine and drivetrain will easily last hundreds of thousands of miles...

My oil gets changed at 3k miles. And it drains out nice and clean every 3k miles. I don't wait for fine ground metallic particles to turn my oil black before a change...Cuz that would be not so good...and in another 30k, I'll be sending my disy back to Steve for another belt change and full service...

So come on...clean fluids, clean fuels, replace worn stuff...and these cars go forever...any car goes forever when it's properly cared for...

RicardoD

Urgh Steve, you just increased my cost of ownership! Ignorance is bliss. I am now trying to find your post about the oil consumption rate that would indicate its time for new valve guides. I have 75k on my Tiptronic and it is running so great right now after my reseal and all new items you just listed above. Want to keep my daily driver running this way for a long time.

Mondrian

I think the quality benchmark is in reference to the class of car of same era, ie early 90's hi-performance sports car so if you are going to compare you have to look at the likes of Ferrari & Lamborghini.

As well as the excellent points covered by Steve I would also try and avoid heavy traffic conditions.

Proper engine warm up routine plays a huge role in engine life too.

PhatPhlatSix

As does oil-level. With the combined effect of leaks and oil-consumption, I wonder how many engines have suffered from too low a level?

I bought my car at 107k miles with a rebuilt engine. The previous owner sold it after it had had run a big end bearing, as well as having poor leakdown figures. A big-end bearing failure is most likely due to oil starvation at this mieleage...

JasonAndreas

So you haven't actually looked at the service intervals for the things I quoted above?

Ignition wires don't go bad in 30k miles, unless those miles takes 15+ years to accumulate. The 2nd generation Bosch O2 sensor has a service life between 60-100k miles, not 30k. Your 964 has two fuel filters, one of which is supposed to be replaced at 60k miles and not 10k, the other never although it is available as a replacement. That's pretty normal for all 911s...

Factory service was most definitely not included when the 964 or 993 were new although there was a two year warranty on some items. There are a few receipts from me in Adrian's books if you are curious as to what it cost back then.

I would never take Porsche service intervals as absolute gospel but I most definitely would question recommendations based on a sample size of zero serviced 964s when the alternative is based on actual durability testing. Which not-so-coincidentally is where FAA approved major maintenance intervals come from; manufacturer durability testing...

I'm not arguing with that but I do question the unnecessary recommendations given above that will easily increase the service costs for a 964 by three to four times, if not more. And provide zero benefit.

KaiB

So...In your own little way here, you're asking Weiner how many air cooled engines he's worked on and in.

That's almost cute!

Goughary

+1

JasonAndreas

I find it slightly disingenuous for someone to be making recommendations for replacement intervals of the 964 fuel filter, O2 sensor, plug wires, etc. without having ever actually replaced the fuel filter, O2 sensor or a set of plug wires in a 964. All the while saying they are "Speaking from the mechanical side of our industry". Especially when those recommendations are completely out of left field when compared to what people have been using for the last 25 years and what the manufacturer recommends to this day, even on their newer vehicles. The "list" will be downloaded by many who will then use it to question their own mechanics and dealers who have actual experience with the 964. A situation not all that different from telling 993 owners they should be using Techron to avoid clogging their SAI ports.

KaiB

I'll simply defer to you Jason as you are obviously the expert here.

Please tell us all how many air cooled engines you've been in to over the past, oh, 40 years or so.

greg1990964

Meow...