Makmov

Some will say it's probably one of the most reliable things on the whole car.

91 C4 135k no AWD issues.

Laker

I realize that, but my point was that if I had a choice between a car with an airbag, vs. one without (all other things being equal), I would pay a premium for the one with airbags. As annoying as the faults are, they are well worth the headaches in the event of an accident. (same reason I choose the C4, safety)

Henry964

You choosed a C4 for safety reasons, I choosed a C2 because I wanted to learn to drive a 911 just like the ones I lusted for when I was a teenager ( in the beautiful sixties) I am still trying....

Laker

Henry, this is my first Porsche, I was afraid if it was a C2, it would be wrapped around a tree very quickly. Also being a fan of Audi's quattro system, (and having their marketing tagline stuck in my head "An unfair advantage") I am hooked on AWD for life :-)

xeps

I have an 89 C4, ~100k miles, no AWD issues to date.

If we were talking about current vehicles and airbag systems, I would entirely agree with you. No question. However, I would be rather hesitant to compare a first generation airbag that is now 20 years old with newer systems.

Laker

I am comparing a first generation airbag to no airbag at all. The original comment (Barry's) is the '89 964 could save the owner, airbag fault/maintenance headaches since there isn't one. Agree, but my point is, it is worth the headaches compared to broken ribs or worse, if something unfortunate should happen.

sml

So was he.

His point was that 20yr old airbag technology is different to current airbag technology. With sensoring/monitoring equipment, airbag inflation rates, reports of airbags exploding when driving down a road with no impact, etc etc. You'll get better experts than me to explain the details but that is the concept anyway.

Laker

Barry was, but I was referring to the post directly above mine by xeps that I believe assumes I was comparing a 964 to a modern car. I was comparing a '89 964 with a '90 in similar shape.

SML, are you saying that you find the 964 airbag system so unreliable, that if you could wave a magic wand an make it entirely disappear from your car, you would? Is it that bad?

ian89C4

For a track car it saves weight

sml

I am just sharing opinions.
But there are some facts behind the technology argument.
And there are some facts behind accidental detonation.
And with the extra ABS equipment, there are more parts to fail.
Personally, I would prefer to have 20yr old airbags.
My 964 does not have airbags (from factory).
Some people remove them because their opinion is that they are dangerous based on the above and hence they feel safer without.
No big deal either way - no right or wrong answer (subject to crash testing data that is never going to happen).

Laker

Understood, the new guys like me are here to learn from the veterans' experiences and opinions.

Sorry to have gone off topic, for what it's worth I have not had any AWD issues and neither did the previous owner in the prior 8 yrs.

Bearclaw

Sorry, I didn't mean to muddy the waters by dragging the issue of the airbag system into the conversation. I guess my somewhat misguided point was to relate AWD system concerns to a priority order of 964 concerns in general. In the context of all the things to be worried about, the AWD is very low on my list, while the airbag system is much higher, based on personal experience and the threads I've read here.

I agree that the airbag in this car has some value, although I will never feel as safe in this little car, surrounded by semi's on the freeway, as I do in my Subaru or my Volvo, protected by umpteen airbags. But I'm the type that can't stand to have any component of my car not working, and this system has truly tried my patience. The light is on now on my car, and I believe this time it's another front sensor. According to the service records I have that go back the life of the car, they've been replaced twice. It might need the "clock solder" fix at this point, as well. When the SRS system "burps", it throws the light, but when light is on, I don't know whether I have an airbag or not. Honestly, other than the fact that I'm pissed I have a dash light on, I feel okay with that and I drive it with the same cavalier abandon.

For me personally, yup and yup.

DWS964

Back to the AWD (PDAS) system - I had one issue with my 93 C4 - the lateral slave lock on the side of the differential case developed a leaking seal. A small drip, but considering the high pressure of the PDAS system, it was something that needed replacing. I purchased a used item from DC Automotive and easily changed it. There have been a few failures of these little hydraulic cylinders; and a couple of folks here on RL have attempted rebuilding them, without success, I believe. The price of new ones? don't even try asking....
One potentially key piece of maintenance that many C4's are neglected - is flushing/bleeding of the hydraulic system feeding the PDAS system. Not straightforward, a few methods and opinions, may require a Bosch Hammer diagnostic tool to execute the procedure, and a lot of shops may not even know that it should be done when flushing the normal brake fluid circuits. I do it myself, and the first time I did it on both of my cars - really nasty old black oozing stuff came out. There was a noticeable difference after flushing with new fluid.
Good luck. I have two C4's, and maybe a third is on it's way....

elbeee964

My sentiments exactly... re Tessa.

Bearclaw

With the obviously very advanced system she has, she has nothing to fear.

However, her restraint system has the unique characteristic of weakening the restraint systems of others near to her.