Magdaddy

I've searched countless previous posts, but simply haven't found the answers I'm looking for.

So...here goes
Key phra$e$
1-clutch pack in the front of the transmission-periodic rebuild of friction discs
2-lateral and longitudinal acceleration sensors known to fail
3-the driveshaft within a driveshaft(torque tube)have bearings, can't replace just the bearings, so it's a rebuilt or new unit
4-valve guide wear on the 3.6, expen$ive top end rebuild

I've floundered back and forth between a 964, or a 993. The widebody look makes me lean toward the 993, but many are pricey. I've been advised to stay away from the 964 C4's because of the cost of the AWD pieces.

I plan(hope to anyway)use my Porsche as a year round DD here in Central New York, so a robust awd system is a must. I've read everything I could, and it simply appears handsdown, that the 964 C4 is much better in winter conditions, than a 993 C4.

I've seen many very nice, apparently well cared for 964 C4's listed for sale. The asking prices are incredibly reasonable. But, need any one, or two of the above big ticket beauties, and you just doubles your investment.

So, I'd like those of you who have had your 964 C4's for many years, put tons of miles on them, give me your thoughts.

What have your experiences been with the above referenced big $$ items?
I'm interested in a DD, street use only. Can I confidently consider a well cared for car with 100K on the odometer.

So, calm my fears, fan the flames?

Thanks

DaveK

I've been on rennlist almost since buying my car just over 8 years ago. In that time, I've hardly seen a single post of C4 drivetrain problems (I can only think of one in fact).

My car has about 180k miles on it - I've done about 60k of that - no AWD issues at all.

Periodic rebuild of the friction discs? That seems to be something I've neglected in 8 years.....

As for the accelerometers - the longitudinal one is a known cause of ABS problems, because it can get a bit stuck (clogged up with filings). It takes about 15 minutes to remove it, give it a clean (by blowing on it) and refit it. And it should be fine for another 10 years - hardly a reason not to buy the car!

Top end rebuilds are not exactly regular. Mine had one shortly before I bought the car. I've no plans for it to have another one any time soon.

wellcraft290

Well C4's here get a bad rap just to the respect of their handling for tracking. I own a C4 and love the car and the way it handles. As far as your concerns I have not read really any of them on here. There was some post on teh front end of a C4, but i think it ended up being installed incorreclty and not the car or parts, but this was a while back.
If you actually talk to C4 owners I feel you will hear little to no complaints or at least no more then the C2 counterpart. There are more moving parts, but they are all reliable.

As far as the valve guide wear issue and top end rebuilds you will find there is more issues on the 993 then the 964 motors. lots of people here have put tons of miles on their motors with no rebuilds etc.
Just find a well maintained example

altarchsa

1-clutch pack in the front of the transmission-periodic rebuild of friction discs
'89 is one-off - $800 - $900 for kit vs. $290 for other years, total cost ? (did mine myself)

2-lateral and longitudinal acceleration sensors known to fail
Cleaning ( DIY described elsewhere) usually resolves issues per previous posts. Never had trouble with mine (109K mi)

3-the driveshaft within a driveshaft(torque tube)have bearings, can't replace just the bearings, so it's a rebuilt or new unit
Have not had this problem

4-valve guide wear on the 3.6, expen$ive top end rebuild
Did mine myself except for valve work, which was probably about $400 machine shop costs plus valves - look em up, a little expensive, but don't skip if indicated by oil past the valve guides and smoking. See pic below of my experience.

lean toward the 993, but many are pricey
I have not driven a 993, but the 964 has to be a better value at today's prices.

stay away from the 964 C4's because of the cost of the AWD pieces
Only psart of my car I've NOT had a problem with. Other posts seem to confirm.

But, need any one, or two of the above big ticket beauties, and you just doubles your investment.
Me, me! Get a low mileage, alll records car and a PPI from a GOOD garage. Absolute must.

What have your experiences been with the above referenced big $$ items?
Lots of posts here of low cost, happy driving and only a few horror stories like mine.

altarchsa

P.S.

I've owned mid 70's 2wd 911's and this is my first C4. I would not buy another 2wd 911.

For sun, rain or snow, C4's are great!

Nothing against C2 owners. Seems to me that they are usually track enthusiasts. They don't like the PDAS control on track.

altarchsa

P.P.S.

Re: valves and heads, 993's have a check engine light issue that results from the small passageway that recircs exhaust to the cylinder getting clogged.

I think you'll find the major difference between the 964ers and 993ers is the purist opinion of 964ers re: styling and handling.

Also, just my opinion, but I ventured onto the 993 forum when I was considering buying one and got a terrible reception from several of them. Many of them seem not as friendly as everyone on the 964 forum.

velocitylover

I can concure with all posts above and with tweeking my C-4 is very close to C-2 in terms of handling(or the same hard to tell ).
For the purpose of all season commuting you cannot go wrong...
Cost wise I've yet to have a problem with my awd system so don't know (currently 92 000 miles)
I drove a couple other C-2's and like my C-4 better (back in early 90's I raced a RWD car in european rallys and did well so it is not a complaint against rwd in fact I love them!!)
If you don't buy a C-4 it should't be because of reliability reasons related to AWD system.
Good luck with your choice

Magdaddy

I've had quite a few conversations with 993 posters, many more private than public. They are just as enthusiastic, and welcoming, as you 964'ers IMHO.

I absolutely love the 993 C4S, but the current prices are insane. A car that cost $80K 16 years ago is still worth high 50's! Hard to swallow.

Thanks for the reply's so far guys, I'm loving it. Nice to know I'll have enough to maintain/mod my future 964 and save for my daughters college edaumacation 2.

tgage

In 10 years, I've yet to have an issue with the drivetrain of my C4.... rather the opposite... the drivetrain has gotten "ME" out of trouble. The car holds much better than my C2 did... and recently was the only car we had that could get us around in our recent ice storm.

...but then you know, s* happens.... just has not happend to me yet.

tom

BlueHeeler

My car is 150K miles. The drive train is fine.

I went out in my friends fwd civic in the snow last week. In retrospect I should have taken the P-car. I could not believe how much better the C4 is compared to a fwd car which should be good in snow. The C4 spoils you.

In the snow, gravel, mud a little green light shows up on the dash letting you know you are C4-wheel'in and instant traction. I have directional summer tires and the fronts are on backwards (don't ask) and it is still the best bad weather car I have ever owned. It is easy to pass 4x4 SUVs spinning all four up hills. It also launches like a maniac in the dry.

My car has some unrelated issues, but the drive line is not a concern.

ian89C4

I have also not had any of the problems that you are describing or worried about.
I do have the engine out of the car but I am doing a full reseal on my own. I guess I didn't really "need" to but winter is a good time to do it. The oil leaks are due to the 20 years the old girl has been tearing around on the roads.
I love the car and how it handles. They are beasts on the track and hold their own with much lighter cars. Don't let the problems that you are worried about deter you from seeking out a well maintained 964 C4, they are indeed great cars and I don't think that you will find many folks on here that have had those problems.

Regards and good luck!

Indycam

"year round DD here in Central New York" ?
Salt / slush / ice / idiots ?
Save a 964 , buy a 993 .

Oracle

Mag,
The C4 has more moving parts that will wear and eventually need fix or replace.
This is true with any AWD car. If you're a bit afraid of the possibility of another system that will need $$ then you know the answer...

The C4 are always cheaper and I suspect it has to do with the eventual maintenance required that won't be cheap if you had to drop the diff or if the electronics go bad.

Personally I chose a C2 because the car has fewer parts to break, I won't drive it in the snow anyway (for that I have a domestic appliance) and it's faster than the C4 ;-)

race911

No mention of the price range you're looking at. I think that makes a huge difference as to what kind of car you can reasonably expect.

To the point of $50K C4S's. Uh, yeah I suppose if it's on of those 2K mile 3-D pieces of art. Late last year when I kind of shopped mine to the 993 forum I was informed I would be lucky to get $25K for mine........

In any case, the 6 years and 40K miles I had my '92 C4 (80K-120K) I never had a problem. Car saw hard track use for two of those years.

DWS964

I had to recently replace a leaking slave cylinder on. The lateral diff lock. Easy change. New part is expensive but I found a used part at dcAuto for $100. Interesting to note that I found a service record at 45K where the same part was replaced.