Can I afford a Porsche 964?
09-10-2009, 11:51 AM
#62
Three Wheelin'
VERY few S2's here - I think I have one of 2-3 from 1990 in all of Canada?
Much more common over there, eh? A great car - but mods are limited - so I'm thinking the OP will dig the turbo more.
Running costs on the S2 are negligible though. Knock on wood - there's not much to break!
And one last thought - the OP has clearly shown maturity and focus by accumulating cash and graduating. Time to apply the same dicipline and "do the right thing" - starting off slower/smaller and working one's way up the automotive food chain.
RK
Much more common over there, eh? A great car - but mods are limited - so I'm thinking the OP will dig the turbo more.
Running costs on the S2 are negligible though. Knock on wood - there's not much to break!
And one last thought - the OP has clearly shown maturity and focus by accumulating cash and graduating. Time to apply the same dicipline and "do the right thing" - starting off slower/smaller and working one's way up the automotive food chain.
RK
09-11-2009, 09:55 AM
#64
I played it safe...still do...I own two Hondas and a Porsche. Just got the Porsche though (I paid cash and finally feel I can afford to "own" it).
Idiots throwing caution to the wind have forced my (and my kids) money to be spent on Banks, the US auto industry, bail outs, buy outs, adjusted mortgages, and so on. I instead I have a fixed 30 year mortgage (with a decent down payment), I max out my 401K each year (and have since I was 26), and embrace dollar cost averaging and the time value of money.
Go buy a nice sporty fun car and have fun. I (for one) will be impressed not by your flashy belongings but by your well maintained home, healthy bank account, and secure retirement (and that I haven't had to help you with any of it). Not far in the future I'm sure you will work a pcar into the mix. You said you were an impulse buyer. That tells me you know you have traits you need to keep in check. Keep them in check.
Idiots throwing caution to the wind have forced my (and my kids) money to be spent on Banks, the US auto industry, bail outs, buy outs, adjusted mortgages, and so on. I instead I have a fixed 30 year mortgage (with a decent down payment), I max out my 401K each year (and have since I was 26), and embrace dollar cost averaging and the time value of money.
Go buy a nice sporty fun car and have fun. I (for one) will be impressed not by your flashy belongings but by your well maintained home, healthy bank account, and secure retirement (and that I haven't had to help you with any of it). Not far in the future I'm sure you will work a pcar into the mix. You said you were an impulse buyer. That tells me you know you have traits you need to keep in check. Keep them in check.
09-11-2009, 06:42 PM
#65
Instructor
Interesting thread.
I have also been looking for a 911 for some time now - initially a 3.2/G50, but then started considering a 964 (C4).
I am looking for a weekend toy, something that feels like a sports car, I currently drive a BMW 330CiC, and I love it, but its an automatic, and a bit tame. It will remain my daily driver.
I am not raiding my kids college fund, but am wary of spending $18-$20K and still having a money pit, that is constantly looking for the next $1000's to be spent on it.
I hear both, that these cars are dependable and not money pits, but I am also hearing the opposite.
For the same money I can get a much newer 350Z, or a Z4 m Roadster, or even a Boxster - or maybe the 3.2/G50 in better repair and fewer things that can possibly go wrong.
Its a first class problem!
Love some input, or if anyone is sellying here in So Cal let me know.
I have also been looking for a 911 for some time now - initially a 3.2/G50, but then started considering a 964 (C4).
I am looking for a weekend toy, something that feels like a sports car, I currently drive a BMW 330CiC, and I love it, but its an automatic, and a bit tame. It will remain my daily driver.
I am not raiding my kids college fund, but am wary of spending $18-$20K and still having a money pit, that is constantly looking for the next $1000's to be spent on it.
I hear both, that these cars are dependable and not money pits, but I am also hearing the opposite.
For the same money I can get a much newer 350Z, or a Z4 m Roadster, or even a Boxster - or maybe the 3.2/G50 in better repair and fewer things that can possibly go wrong.
Its a first class problem!
Love some input, or if anyone is sellying here in So Cal let me know.
09-11-2009, 08:09 PM
#66
Racer
Join Date: Apr 2008
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Interesting thread.
I have also been looking for a 911 for some time now - initially a 3.2/G50, but then started considering a 964 (C4).
I hear both, that these cars are dependable and not money pits, but I am also hearing the opposite.
For the same money I can get a much newer 350Z, or a Z4 m Roadster, or even a Boxster - or maybe the 3.2/G50 in better repair and fewer things that can possibly go wrong.
Its a first class problem!
Love some input, or if anyone is sellying here in So Cal let me know.
I have also been looking for a 911 for some time now - initially a 3.2/G50, but then started considering a 964 (C4).
I hear both, that these cars are dependable and not money pits, but I am also hearing the opposite.
For the same money I can get a much newer 350Z, or a Z4 m Roadster, or even a Boxster - or maybe the 3.2/G50 in better repair and fewer things that can possibly go wrong.
Its a first class problem!
Love some input, or if anyone is sellying here in So Cal let me know.
When I was first looking, I drove a friend's 3.2. No ABS or air bag or PS and not as much power helped lead me to the 964.
Sure, you can get faster, newer cars. But for me, the 964 has an unbeatable combination of performance, looks, and classy tradition. I have no regrets whatsoever.
I sure wish the weather would clear so I could go drive it!
Bets of luck in your search!
09-12-2009, 02:43 AM
#68
Intermediate
Join Date: Jul 2009
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i think i am going to save for another year and then go for it.. i would like to be more comfortable with my payments. thanks for the advice guys.
the 964 has been my dream car and i am gonna go for it.
10-16-2009, 09:44 AM
#70
Rennlist Member
I haven't recently re-read the previous post, so this may have been brought up before (LOTS of good advise here!):
Two things (among many others) to add to your (+) or (-) columns
Those are great cars mentioned above, but I knew a 911 was right for me because there was no other car I was interested in (except an M3, for the back seat). I ONLY wanted a 911... if like me, you only want a 911, there is nothing else you can do? So I had to look for the best car that I could afford and then take the future as it comes? 911s are ALL about passion, it's a love thing and sure it stings if a (infrequent) big repair springs up. But you fix it and keep moving on because you love your car...
Many times I look at my car and wonder how it could only be worth $15K in the market? This car, with it's unique characteristics, looks, built quality offers so much. I punches way above its weight! This is my first 911 and as far as I'm concerned the car has already paid for itself in the last 20,000 miles of adventures I've already had in it. That's how I would look at 964 ownership. Like a parent, you love it no matter what... you might worry about it or get angry at it at times, put it's a part of you and worth so much more than the $15,000 it might cost you. Otherwise don't stand in the way of another person finding their "life changing" 964.
The next thing, budget money for upgrades (in your 2nd or 3rd year of ownership) because if you truly love 911s, then after you find a good one and keep it running in excellent health, you will want to make it your perfect 911. Suspension, wheels/tires, interior/exterior mods, etc.
Do it!
Two things (among many others) to add to your (+) or (-) columns
For the same money I can get a much newer 350Z, or a Z4 m Roadster, or even a Boxster
Many times I look at my car and wonder how it could only be worth $15K in the market? This car, with it's unique characteristics, looks, built quality offers so much. I punches way above its weight! This is my first 911 and as far as I'm concerned the car has already paid for itself in the last 20,000 miles of adventures I've already had in it. That's how I would look at 964 ownership. Like a parent, you love it no matter what... you might worry about it or get angry at it at times, put it's a part of you and worth so much more than the $15,000 it might cost you. Otherwise don't stand in the way of another person finding their "life changing" 964.
The next thing, budget money for upgrades (in your 2nd or 3rd year of ownership) because if you truly love 911s, then after you find a good one and keep it running in excellent health, you will want to make it your perfect 911. Suspension, wheels/tires, interior/exterior mods, etc.
Do it!
10-16-2009, 12:50 PM
#71
Rennlist Member
Buying a 964 is a little like dating...a mix of emotional and logical decision making. The logical side says to save up and pay cash. I tend to agree with this because performance-wise and on paper, there are a lot of options out there for equal or lesser money. My favorite alternative is the E36 M3. I've owned 2 and will probably buy another one of these years. They are that good, and so practical and versatile. You gotta really want a 964 because even with the current valuations, they are not the most logical purchases.
Emotionally, buying a 964 is like dating the hot-looking chick in school that has a little bad-streak in her and will probably leave you, cheat on you, or treat you like $hit if you don't take care of her. The repercussions are severe. But the passion, emotions, and the attention you will get while being with her are unparalleled and completely worth it.
If you decide to buy one, find one that isn't too high-maintenance (i.e., PPI), give her a lot of TLC, and she will treat you well with many years of happiness. Good luck with your search. These are terrific cars to own.
Emotionally, buying a 964 is like dating the hot-looking chick in school that has a little bad-streak in her and will probably leave you, cheat on you, or treat you like $hit if you don't take care of her. The repercussions are severe. But the passion, emotions, and the attention you will get while being with her are unparalleled and completely worth it.
If you decide to buy one, find one that isn't too high-maintenance (i.e., PPI), give her a lot of TLC, and she will treat you well with many years of happiness. Good luck with your search. These are terrific cars to own.
10-16-2009, 01:14 PM
#72
Professor of Pending Projects
Rennlist Member
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10-16-2009, 08:36 PM
#73
Rennlist Member
I say go for it... provided you can afford to buy a REALLY good example of the model/iteration you're looking for. This, in my experience means (relatively) low mileage and good maintenance history - basically, I would not buy a used Pcar that was not in the top 10% condition-wise for its age.
My first 911 at age 22 was just such a car. Had it not had the roof so rudely severed at the factory, it would have been a keeper.
Bought with 20K miles, excellent shape. I was able to afford it with relatively inexpensive maintenance, and was thereafter able to sell it for a price that was very close to my initial investment. I am repeating that scenario now for the 3rd time with my 993.
Tough act to duplicate if the car in question is average/below average. And you have to be patient. These excellent examples do not come around often at fair prices - you have to be willing to search, and wait, for the right one.
Good luck!
Matt
My first 911 at age 22 was just such a car. Had it not had the roof so rudely severed at the factory, it would have been a keeper.
Bought with 20K miles, excellent shape. I was able to afford it with relatively inexpensive maintenance, and was thereafter able to sell it for a price that was very close to my initial investment. I am repeating that scenario now for the 3rd time with my 993.
Tough act to duplicate if the car in question is average/below average. And you have to be patient. These excellent examples do not come around often at fair prices - you have to be willing to search, and wait, for the right one.
Good luck!
Matt
10-17-2009, 12:52 AM
#74
Rennlist Member
I bought my first 911 at 28 and I've owned six other 911s since then over the past nine years including a 930 and four 993s.
I don't think you are taking a "big" risk by buying a 964/993 nor do I think it's the most prudent thing to do. That said, here is some food for thought:
1) you saved over $15k at age 22. That shows you are likely not impulsive or irresponsible and will do just fine.
2) you are buying a car that will not see much depreciation - if things get tough and you have to sell, you won't loose much if you're smart about it
3) If you do make a "mistake" and have to sell at a small loss, it will be a good and cheap lesson - success in life comes from taking chances and making "mistakes" (experience)
4) you are only young once - have fun but do continue to balance fun with prudence (you are doing so by being on this site and asking this question)
5) it will likely take you a few months to find the right car and you don't seem to be in a hurry. Keep saving and thinking this through so that you're 100% sure when the right car comes along
6) look for a good buy. Right now there are many deals. Someone here bought a strong and beautiful example for $10k with ~100k mi.
7) People keep mentioning $5k rebuilds. I was smart (and lucky) about the cars I bought and I've never had to do one on any of my cars - knock on wood. There are many cars well into 100k mi that run very strong on the original engine (though many here would have you think otherwise)
8) Mittigate your risk by doing lots of research (get intimate with the search feature on this site and learn the issues these cars have) and getting a good PPI when the right car comes along
9) Should you decide that a 911 is really not prudent, I would pick up a used Mini Cooper S for ~$10k. Small, tossable and fun like the 964/993 but newer, more reliable(?) and cheaper to service/modify.
Best of luck and have fun with your decision and search. And remember, take calculated risks while you are young. What you learn will be worth it's weight in gold as you get older. You won't always be free of responsibilities like a mortgage and family as wisely stated above.
I don't think you are taking a "big" risk by buying a 964/993 nor do I think it's the most prudent thing to do. That said, here is some food for thought:
1) you saved over $15k at age 22. That shows you are likely not impulsive or irresponsible and will do just fine.
2) you are buying a car that will not see much depreciation - if things get tough and you have to sell, you won't loose much if you're smart about it
3) If you do make a "mistake" and have to sell at a small loss, it will be a good and cheap lesson - success in life comes from taking chances and making "mistakes" (experience)
4) you are only young once - have fun but do continue to balance fun with prudence (you are doing so by being on this site and asking this question)
5) it will likely take you a few months to find the right car and you don't seem to be in a hurry. Keep saving and thinking this through so that you're 100% sure when the right car comes along
6) look for a good buy. Right now there are many deals. Someone here bought a strong and beautiful example for $10k with ~100k mi.
7) People keep mentioning $5k rebuilds. I was smart (and lucky) about the cars I bought and I've never had to do one on any of my cars - knock on wood. There are many cars well into 100k mi that run very strong on the original engine (though many here would have you think otherwise)
8) Mittigate your risk by doing lots of research (get intimate with the search feature on this site and learn the issues these cars have) and getting a good PPI when the right car comes along
9) Should you decide that a 911 is really not prudent, I would pick up a used Mini Cooper S for ~$10k. Small, tossable and fun like the 964/993 but newer, more reliable(?) and cheaper to service/modify.
Best of luck and have fun with your decision and search. And remember, take calculated risks while you are young. What you learn will be worth it's weight in gold as you get older. You won't always be free of responsibilities like a mortgage and family as wisely stated above.
10-17-2009, 09:13 AM
#75
Three Wheelin'
louis you say take a small loss. Do you really feel the 964 is stil depreciating? I think just the whole economy but will sell for more money in a few years then they do now.
