Boatsonthebrain

I remember coming across a few posts recently where someone was looking into converting a C4 into a C2. The April 2007 Panorama just arrived in the mail today and featured is the first of a multi-part article on how to do this conversion. Part I discusses the "options, the issues and the motivation".

Should be an interesting read!

GothingNC

Excellence magazine had a write up by Bruce Anderson replying to the question of the C4 to C2 converison.

It would be a lot cheaper just to sell the car and purchase a C2.

John

garrett376

So far, a dud. It's got misinformation and portrays the C4 as a piece of crap car that nobody should purchase. You gotta' love one guy's opinion taken as gospel...

IrocMan

The C4 to C2 conversion is interesting for turbos (993) or if the C4 has already been hardly tuned and that in this case the preparation of the frame/engine/chassis is more work than the conversion itself.

But there can also be some feelings consideration... sometime

Boatsonthebrain

Kind of a scary article for current or potential (like me) C4 owners .
2 x $2076 to replace acceleration sensors, rebuilt torque tube for $1455, rebuild clutch pack which controls front to rear power split for who knows how much, on top of the potential for a top/bottom end rebuild, clutch/flywheel replacement, etc. How's a poor bloke able to have money for important things like upgrades??

Of course, not all these things will happen at once. Good thing there is no substitute for Porsche!

TR6

Not to start a C4 vs C2 debate, but I would think it would only make sense to own a C4 if you were driving it regularly in slippery conditions (snow, ice, lots of rain). And even then, I don't know that I would want a first generation C4 (the 964 version). I seem to recall reading the 993 version of the C4 had much improved 4 wheel drive technology. For my situation in sunny Texas, a C4 would make no sense and only mean more potential cost for repairs and upkeep.

MassGuy

You cannot be afraid to own a 911 if you are then you should not even consider it. These cars are built to last. Like everything they get wear and the potential for repairs does exist but look at what you get for the risk.

For me my 911 is worth all of it. Be it a 993 or a 964 C2 or C4 there is no debate having one is better than not.

IrocMan

Well, I'm not a specialist but I'm not certain the 964 C4 system is so bad and that 993 is really better. The 993 may be simpler, easier to maintan and maybe cheaper. The 964 is efficient with its dynamic braking system to avoid wheels to slipper.
This gives the 964 C4 a great grip on any surface. I owned a 1990 C4 in France (and lived in Champagne were there was snow every year) and was on the road whatever the conditions could be - I had a lot of fun on snow.
I've also known an off road endurance car which was built on a 1991 C4 engine and transmission. The guy kept the ABS sensors and everything and that was a terrible weapon on mud. With less than 300 hp he could play with the big boys. Everybody was speaking of the "959 Dakar-like" because of the 4WD and rear 3.6 with a Porsche label
Unfortunately he had to remove all the electronics later because of regulations, and really update the car to remain fast (and compensate the traction control he lost).

Marc Shaw

Not to propage the 964 versus 993 debate but some would disagree and suggest that the 964 has a superior system that was not developed with cost-cutting as a concern.

Marc

Boatsonthebrain

Perhaps more interesting than a C2/C4 debate might be how many C4 owners here have had to:

(1) replace (not just clean) an acceleration sensor

(2) rebuild/ replace torque tube

(3) rebuild/replace clutch pack on power transfer unit

Any other problems specific to the C4 drivetrain that should be included in this informal poll?

TR6

Aren't there some additional steps to bleeding/flushing the brakes? Something about needing a Bosch hammer...

N51

The latest(April) issue of Panorama has a C4-to-C2 conversion being performed by Joel Reiser. Part I in a series. It is customer specific in its' needs. That is, a mostly tracked and supercharged C4 that will also be converted to a six speed.

Noah

ilko

You don't need a hammer to bleed the brakes. You do need it to bleed the PDAS system.

The AWD system in the C4 is very complex and yes, it is costly to replace. But ask any Porsche mechanic how many of those items they've had to replace. Not that many. Porsche developed the AWD system without any regard to cost. They just wanted to make sure they built the best AWD system ever. That was before the bean counters implemented the rule of "Build me a car for $XX,XXX."

N51

For myself, the debate is not about which is better. For very different reasons, I want both.

For those living in areas with higher precipitation, whether rain or snow, it extends the driving time and provides additional safety.

In addition to Marc's links, I believe Geoff has stated that he has had the opportunity to drive both the 993 and 964 version and prefers - and drives - the 964 C4.

Noah

C4Russ

My C4 has a 120,000 on the clock and I've not noticed any issues that make me afraid to drive it daily and I do. I drive it year round, snow, rain, ice.

Truthfully there is more mis-information about the 964 then any other model. Many writers continue those false rumors to this day. I'd say it's because they have little to no practical experience or time in this model. The 964 is a fine Porsche, fully deserving of the 911 badge.

Frankly, they are the best value in the 911 family. Their are many, many examples of much less capable cars, i.e. 1980-1989 years specifically, that sell for far more and are much less capable, less comfortable and just as costly to own.

Unless one own's a model, they ought to not 'share' the rumors they have read or heard from sources other then actual owners.

YMMV