Suspension ???
#16
Nordschleife Master
The HR Spring rates are as follows:
EDIT: The editor keeps kicking out the spaces. Sorry for the hard to read tables. It looks correct in the editor.
Lowering Springs - Progressive Rates
C2/C4 front 190-225 rear 220-265
RSA front 250-275 rear 270-295
Turbo front 230-265 rear 280-320
Coilovers - Progressive Rates
C2/C4 front 250-270 rear 265-285 year 89-90
C2/C4 front 250-285 rear 265-285 year 91-94
Turbo front 260-285 rear 275-320
Stock spring rates **
89-91 C2/C4 front 158 rear 189
92-94 C2/C4 front 169 rear 189
91-94 Option M030 front 169 rear 263
93-94 RS America front 169 rear 263
91-92 Turbo 3.3 front 169 rear 263
1992 Carrera RS (European) front 247 rear 440 Progressive Rate
1992 Carrera Cup USA front 247 rear 440 Progressive Rate
Carrera Cup Racing Car front 200-600 rear 240-800 Progressive Rate
** The above stock spring rates were compled by someone else, maybe Bill Gregory, I can't remember.
The Koni adjustables are gas not oil like traditional Koni shocks
Bilstein HD shocks are designed for stock spring rates, the sports are designed for upgraded springs. Unfortunately, the sports don't seem to be available for the 964. You can see the varied spring rates, particularly in the rear where one damper is available. This may result in less than ideal dampening for a particular spring rate.
I have factory M030 and am going to simply install the lowering springs that were on my race car when I bought it. They are Red with no markings. I have been in a C2 with M030 and Red H&R springs and thought it was about right for the roads here and the ride height visual was nice.
EDIT: The editor keeps kicking out the spaces. Sorry for the hard to read tables. It looks correct in the editor.
Lowering Springs - Progressive Rates
C2/C4 front 190-225 rear 220-265
RSA front 250-275 rear 270-295
Turbo front 230-265 rear 280-320
Coilovers - Progressive Rates
C2/C4 front 250-270 rear 265-285 year 89-90
C2/C4 front 250-285 rear 265-285 year 91-94
Turbo front 260-285 rear 275-320
Stock spring rates **
89-91 C2/C4 front 158 rear 189
92-94 C2/C4 front 169 rear 189
91-94 Option M030 front 169 rear 263
93-94 RS America front 169 rear 263
91-92 Turbo 3.3 front 169 rear 263
1992 Carrera RS (European) front 247 rear 440 Progressive Rate
1992 Carrera Cup USA front 247 rear 440 Progressive Rate
Carrera Cup Racing Car front 200-600 rear 240-800 Progressive Rate
** The above stock spring rates were compled by someone else, maybe Bill Gregory, I can't remember.
The Koni adjustables are gas not oil like traditional Koni shocks
Bilstein HD shocks are designed for stock spring rates, the sports are designed for upgraded springs. Unfortunately, the sports don't seem to be available for the 964. You can see the varied spring rates, particularly in the rear where one damper is available. This may result in less than ideal dampening for a particular spring rate.
I have factory M030 and am going to simply install the lowering springs that were on my race car when I bought it. They are Red with no markings. I have been in a C2 with M030 and Red H&R springs and thought it was about right for the roads here and the ride height visual was nice.
Last edited by Geoffrey; 01-15-2007 at 10:52 AM.
#17
Drifting
I recommend the Bilstien H&R setup for a mainly street, sometimes track setup. DIY install is pretty easy, check out http://www.porsche964.co.uk/technical/jclowering.htm for a HOWTO.
For just track work, I have been very very happy with my JIC-Cross setup. I think my spring rates come out to 580f 800r or something close to that:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/..._pg1.htm#item2
I did the install myself on both sets, it's fairly easy. You should have a large breaker bar ready for those rear lower bolts. Once done, go get a good alignment and corner balance.
For just track work, I have been very very happy with my JIC-Cross setup. I think my spring rates come out to 580f 800r or something close to that:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/..._pg1.htm#item2
I did the install myself on both sets, it's fairly easy. You should have a large breaker bar ready for those rear lower bolts. Once done, go get a good alignment and corner balance.
#19
Like Geoffrey I also have the M030 suspension, and I where also considering the red HR lowering springs with the original shocks/dampers.
The car can still perform well on the german autobahn at topspeed so neither the shocks or springs are finished yet, but I would like it a bit stiffer for the track days.
I know that it would be best to buy new shock/dampers as well, but frankly I just feel that I have spend so much money on the car the past year so....
I would of course still need an alignment and a corner weighing.
The car can still perform well on the german autobahn at topspeed so neither the shocks or springs are finished yet, but I would like it a bit stiffer for the track days.
I know that it would be best to buy new shock/dampers as well, but frankly I just feel that I have spend so much money on the car the past year so....
I would of course still need an alignment and a corner weighing.
#20
Technical Guru
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by Geoffrey
The editor keeps kicking out the spaces. Sorry for the hard to read tables. It looks correct in the editor.
Code:
Lowering Springs - Progressive Rates C2/C4 front 190-225 rear 220-265 RSA front 250-275 rear 270-295 Turbo front 230-265 rear 280-320 Coilovers - Progressive Rates C2/C4 front 250-270 rear 265-285 year 89-90 C2/C4 front 250-285 rear 265-285 year 91-94 Turbo front 260-285 rear 275-320 Stock spring rates ** 89-91 C2/C4 front 158 rear 189 92-94 C2/C4 front 169 rear 189 91-94 Option M030 front 169 rear 263 93-94 RS America front 169 rear 263 91-92 Turbo 3.3 front 169 rear 263 1992 Carrera RS (European) front 247 rear 440 Progressive Rate 1992 Carrera Cup USA front 247 rear 440 Progressive Rate Carrera Cup Racing Car front 200-600 rear 240-800 Progressive Rate
Originally Posted by Geoffrey
Bilstein HD shocks are designed for stock spring rates, the sports are designed for upgraded springs.
#21
Agent Orange
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Slightly off-topic but relevant: Does anybody have the part numbers of the two hex bolts that connect the bottom of the front shocks to the wheel assembly? I know they have to be replaced with new ones when installing the suspension but I can't find the part numbers. Any help will be appreciated!
#23
Anybody want to swab a set H&R reds for a set of H&R greens? I find the reds a little tough on the roads (rock pits) of Houston. No wonder there are so many SUV's here...
#24
Burning Brakes
for what it's worth.....i installed the H&R greens and the bilsteins but first had the shocks re-valved for more rebound damping. i felt the front end was too bouncy so i had the rebound increased another 12 percent on the front only. then i thought the front end was still too stiff compared to the rear so i intalled some 200lb/in 2.5 inch diameter springs from hypercoil. this required some custom parts and some mods to some existing perches.
i like this set-up very much so far. the car feels more balanced front to rear. compared to the H&Rs that were on the front, the car feels like there's weight in the trunk. it handles good during normal semi aggressive driving. i haven't pushed it real hard yet.
BTW I have the H&R rates at 190 to 255 front. since i could really feel the difference, I can tell for sure they (the H&Rs) were greater than 200lb/in
i like this set-up very much so far. the car feels more balanced front to rear. compared to the H&Rs that were on the front, the car feels like there's weight in the trunk. it handles good during normal semi aggressive driving. i haven't pushed it real hard yet.
BTW I have the H&R rates at 190 to 255 front. since i could really feel the difference, I can tell for sure they (the H&Rs) were greater than 200lb/in
Last edited by dougn; 01-16-2007 at 12:29 AM.
#25
Hi Brian, I have a 1990 c2 and ordered h&r sport springs from pelican parts.
I also dropped the engine for a clutch replacement and to fix some oil leaks.
I live in Doylestown and are welkom to stop by for advice, Paul
I also dropped the engine for a clutch replacement and to fix some oil leaks.
I live in Doylestown and are welkom to stop by for advice, Paul
#26
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by dougn
then i thought the front end was still too stiff compared to the rear so i intalled some 200lb/in 2.5 inch diameter springs from hypercoil. this required some custom parts and some mods to some existing perches.
Darrell
#27
Burning Brakes
i kept meaning to take pics but i didn't. it goes like this:
you have to make a perch for the top. it's conical with a 45 degree angle. i have the sketch. i'll scan it and load it tomorrow. this is the hardest part
the springs are 10 inch, 2.5 inch I.D. 200 lb
you need the helper springs also. they just take up slack when the suspension is unloaded
you also need the spring separator thing....i forget what they call it
you have to do some lathe work on the separator and the lower perch
if you want to do this we can talk on the phone ...
you have to make a perch for the top. it's conical with a 45 degree angle. i have the sketch. i'll scan it and load it tomorrow. this is the hardest part
the springs are 10 inch, 2.5 inch I.D. 200 lb
you need the helper springs also. they just take up slack when the suspension is unloaded
you also need the spring separator thing....i forget what they call it
you have to do some lathe work on the separator and the lower perch
if you want to do this we can talk on the phone ...