rodders

I have had my 964 from new bought in oct 1989 - 155K miles.
At 120K miles I ran the 2nd main bearing - despite running on Mobil 1 and maintaining as per book - the same main dealer from new.
New engine.
5 years later - Jan 2005 - I collapsed through combination of a flu bug/sever dehydration - stopped the cat but did not turn off engine before fainting and muscle spasming the engine into oblivion !!!
The new engine was on 47K running on semi synthetic, and was perfect - or so I thought !
The required top end rebuild involved an inspection of the bottom end.
Severe wear to the 2nd main bearing !!
Same wear on both engines, one on synthetic the other on semi synthetic
Diagnosis is stuck oil squirter, allowing low oil pressure - seems specific to 964
In my 16 years with the 964 and 15 years with earlier 911's this is the most serious weakness mechanical weakness i have come across
Any on else with any input

Timmer

just read your post and though ' that sounds dead like that write up in 911 & porsche world...'

I guess with a sign in of rodders you must be the same fella - how did the car enjoy it's cake?

Im currently running an '89 C4 with 102k miles and still running strong - had the top end done at RSR about two years ago and no grief -

there do seem to be an alarming number of failures lately - Raymond/Pesty/GrahamL/Greg_L spring to mind - Hopefully John B will not be added to the 'list of pain'

Atgani

I'm genuinely of the opinion these engines do not need fully or even semi synthetic oils. when all is said and done they are an "old" design of engine with larger than "normal" tolerances due to being air cooled.
On the two occasions my 964 RSs were filled with synthetic oil they smoked badly. After draining the oil out (as soon as the mistake had been realised) and subsequently being filled with a good quality oil (Valvoline) they ceased smoking within 5-10 miles and went on to perform without any problems.

rodders

hi Timmer - one and the same TBK 373 !!
The cake is still in the box - too nice to eat although my kids keep picking at it.
Maybe I should put it on ebay
I tending to agree with Atgani but my first and major failure was running on fully synthetic the second, self induced, was on semi synthetic - on the second occasion there had been no symptoms
I understand that if an engine uses synthetic from new it should be OK - but if its introduced later in the engines life problems my start.
I am tempted to go back - I am sure Russell Lewis would agree
he identified the squirter problem but not the cause - which is worrying
For some reason the squirter sticks open with the resulting wear.
I was hoping for 250k from my first engine !!

McJohn

After reading the 911 World piece I immedaietely checked my hot idle oil pressure, and was very re-assured to see that it was a healthy 1.7 bar or so.

Can I assume that these squirters are all but impossible to get at, short of a major engine strip down? If theye were accessible, it would seem good preventative maintenance to consider replacing them.

McJohn

Johnny G Pipe

Stop it, all of you!

This sounds horrid, especially the muscle spasming the engine to death part! Did your leg just extend and rev the engine until it grenaded? Jeez.

Anyway, we can't assume that this is a design flaw or inherent weakness, from one single case!
So, stop it.

Big ends go on old cars from time to time. Old cars like ours that are treated to Spa and the Nurburgring, or 'very sporting driving' on a day to day basis aren't immune to mechanical failure, but this particular marque seems to manage it more than others..

MarkD

I agree Johnny.. stop scaring me!

I would have thought the rev limiter might save it... must have been hanging at the limiter a long time?

I suspect if this were a wide spread issue it would have come up about a decade ago? Perhaps the well informed "insider" Adrian has something to add.

Interesting stuff though...

rodders

sorry to scare you folks but it does seem to be an issue that is more common with the 964 engine than any other - my concern is that i found it on two engines - the first occasion was catastrophic the second - on a different engine - was through my fainting, having taken the car out of gear but engine running ( car stationary ) - I rammed my leg on the throttle and broke 3 rockers and bent various valves - while the engine was stripped we found the wear to the 2nd main bearing.
neither engine had been subjected to any track work of any kind - hard road but nothing untoward.
I am looking for other peoples experience and advice
- and maybe staying with traditional oil is one answer - maybe 6 month oil changes if the car is run in town
Certainly it should be standard practice to replace the squirters on any strip down
The car has been maintained like a jewel over the 16 years and the engine issue was very embarrassing for my main dealer
I think it is an issue for Porsche - we need some advice my info is from Russell Lewis - Porsche Club GB 911 Tech advisor
I know i have done a reasonable mileage but there must be someone out there who has similar experience and who has analyzed the problem?????
I love the car but when I hear people say they have driven 65000 miles and its been perfect - so it should be for ----- sake - its a porsche and it should do 200K with no problem
I have driven in the region of 300K in 911's so I am very committed - this problem is the first that I do not seem to be able to bottom out -
Help !!

rodders

PS I also have a '74 Sporto rotated daily with the 964 so i am pretty conversant with silly problems !

DaveK

It is a fact that we have variations in idle oil pressure though and I wonder if this is the cause. I know the article in 911 / P World said low idle oil pressure would result if the squirters were stuck open.

warmfuzzies

Having not read the article, what was defined as low oil pressure?

Mine goes down to about 1.2Bar at idle on the hottest days when the engine is at 9oclock....


kevin

DaveK

From memory, the article said normal was something like 1.8-2.5 and that if the squirters were stuck open, you'd see about 1-1.2. However - that's at normal temp, which I would say is not 9 o'clock. Normal temp is more like 7.30 - 8 o'clock.

cockyapple

Does anyone actually have a reading of 1.8-2.5bar at 7.30 - 8 o'clock..........mine certainly is not......1.2 to 1.5bar at 8 o'clock is more like it


steve

DaveK

I may have quoted high - certainly lots of people have above 1.5. Mine has always been more like 1.2, and I wonder if this is the reason why.

jimq

1.2-1.5 hot on mine