hawk911

The local PCA is kicking off their season with a Councours event today at one of the Porsche dealerships. I've never been to one, and I'm taking the car; I'm not entering the car though- still too many little things to deal with. I hope to get some nice pictures; and hopefully can post some either tonight or tomorrow.

Wahoooo

Smokin

Have fun! Maybe you can pick up a tip or two.... Hey... See if the logos in the center caps line up with the valve stems will ya?!

And bring your sunglasses!

hawk911

Well- lots of nice cars, and I ended up getting talked into timekeeping; well, all they did was ask and I gladly obliged. I did get a few ideas while there- mostly on interior cosmetics. there was a REALLY nice '93 964 Coupe that the owner had since new. He had a custom pipe- no cat, nothing. He did have a "fuel bitch?" that got rid of the gas so he could still pass emmision tests. He had a really nice finish on the paint, and very clean interior. He didn't win his class, or best in show- not sure how that happened.

There was a pretty good mix of old and new, a few bathtubs, a few boxters, a few 964's, a few SCs and Carreras and a few 993s to round out the group. Of course I'm partial to the 964s that represented, but what do I know. Oh yeah- there was even a slant that entered.

I'm prepping the pictures as we speak, and should have links later one. I may just post the link to the album, as there may be too many to throw links to. I will post the 964 Coupe that I really liked.

bhensarl

Sounds good either way, I'd love to see those pics.
Brian

Richard Curtis

what sorts of things do you need to do for a concours? I assume clean the car, wax, etc., use a brush on the air vents, clean the motor, etc., etc. Anything special or sneaky that judges look for?

hawk911

Richard- I'm not sure, as I didn't enter my car. What I did pick up on was the exterior. The judges I kept time for looked at ext/int. They looked at paint condition, swirl marks, stone chips, dents, dings, etc. Watch for road spray if you drive the car to the event.

Here's the link to the album- saves me the time of attaching all those links.

Milwaukee Concours Photos

Marc Shaw

Hawk - the link you posted needs a password.

Marc

hawk911

Password P-car.

Had to add that so the album is public read-only.

Smokin

Hawk... GREAT pictures! You sure have a beauty of a car. You're right in there with the best of them in all the photos!

I saw (what I presume are) your xrays from the accident. WOW! I'm surprised you didn't end up with a Porsche GT! OUCH! I feel for you man!

Richard... Here's the straight dope from PCA on Concours judging.... It's... uh.. a long article... But interesting...

A Concours d’ Elegance is an event during which owners of restored and highly

maintained cars compete to determine which entry is the cleanest. So, let’s see...

it all began back when.



Concours d’ Elegance is said to have begun in the late 1800s as an event for the

social elite. Actually, back then, the car and the entire family were judged.

Competition in the Rolls-Royce category in England became so stringent that

beautiful models were hired to wear specially designed dresses that matched the

interiors of the cars. In addition, some competitors set up picnic tables nearby

with linens and accessories made to complement the color of the cars. Eventually,

the purpose of these events became blurred, with the cars being overshadowed.

Today, Concours d’ Elegance events are held all over the world. In the United

States, the interest and participation in these events has increased over the past

several years. And as a result, detailing shops and car care product manufacturers

generally have experienced great growth.



There are essentially two types of concours competitions. The first and most

involved is the "full" concours. In these events, everything (and I do mean everything!)

on the car is judged: body, paint, underbody, engine compartment, interior,

and luggage compartment. Parts and crevices in your car that you may never

have taken notice of before will be judged. Obviously, this category involves the

very, very serious concours enthusiast; because who else would actually attempt to

disassemble their Porsche, clean everything very thoroughly and then reassemble

it? Yes, most of these people actually do this. A new car, right off the showroom

floor, would have a tough time winning the show. Most experienced concours

judges will tell you that a new car never driven may, on average, score half the

points of a concours winner! In this type of competition, the entrants trailer their

prized possessions to the site, unload them to be judged, and then load them back

up to go home.



The other type of competition is the "topside only" or "street" concours. This

is the type we usually hold in Allegheny Region. In this event, you are essentially

seeing judging based on what one would see if they were just viewing your car;

specifically, the exterior, interior, and luggage compartment. Some events may

include the engine compartment in that list. Essentially, everything except for the

underbody may be judged. People who enter this type of concours are those who

generally drive their vehicles on a regular basis. Consequently, there is also a real

challenge in this kind of competition to see how well you can maintain a car that

you do drive. For example, how clean and well-maintained is your 1987 911 with

75,000 miles on it? It is really something to see a car like this that looks as though

it is still brand new.



And as far as judging is concerned, each car is placed in a class according to

model and/or year. Each car is then evaluated by a team of judges, each concentrating

on one area of the car, using a point system. For example, wheels and tires

may have a maximum of 5 points. The points are then totaled in each class and

the car with the highest number of points in that class wins.



Many people may look at those who participate in Concours d’ Elegance events

as being "fanatical, perfectionistic, cleaning nuts." I know that I get some strange

looks from my neighbors when they see me working on my car a couple of weeks

prior to an event. They probably say to themselves, "Geez, she really ought to get

a life!", or, "Why is she still working on that car at 3 am?", or "No, it really can’t

be that she is scrubbing inside her engine compartment with a toothbrush, could

it?" Yes, others may find some concours participants strange, but it is a great and

enjoyable hobby and passion for many. It’s such a great feeling to finish your car

and just stand back and admire the sheer beauty of your automobile.



For all of you who are new to this type of event, do not be intimidated. I have

either spoken to or heard of those who don’t feel they can enter concours events

because their car is not "perfect" enough to be judged. Right now, let’s put that

misconception to rest. My philosophy for my region involves topside-only concours.

Indeed, there is a challenge in having a car that is both driven and shown

successfully. Everyone can participate. These events will be low-key and fun. I

believe that no one ever loses in a concours, because just prepping your Porsche

for a show will get it cleaner than it may have ever been and even bring to your

attention potential problems that otherwise may not have been uncovered.



Concours events first and foremost, are a lot of fun. So, detail your car and

enter a topside-only concours scheduled in your region this year. These are not just

competitions—they provide you with beautiful examples of our marque to enjoy.

hawk911

Rick- the xrays are in fact before and after pictures of the pelvic trauma from my crash. 12 weeks non-weight bearing and 2 surgeries later, here we are. Lots of medical bills to offset that GT3 you mentioned, along with a good lawyer leaves me in my beauty of a 964. Thanks again for the compliments; I love the car.

Richard Curtis

Rick: thanks for the write-up. I think I'll stick to spectating.

Jay H

I was the one who roped Hawk into keeping time for one of our sets of judges. Hawk gladly helped out and he's got a very nice car. Thanks again Hawk!

Here in Milwaukee, we use 5 classes to separate cars. From bottom to top:

Class E - Exterior Only
Class D - Exterior and Interior
Class C - Exterior, Interior, Trunk
Class B - Exterior, Interior, Trunk and Engine compartment
Class A - Full car including undercarriage.

Most beginners start with class E. We just do a visual inspection. Things the judges look for are wax residue, any sort of road dirt, large non touched up stone chips, untreated vinyl trim, etc. We don't deduct points for stone chips (the more the better - just means you drive the car), normal wear and tear or non-originality. What ever mods you have is just fine. Win class E and you move up to D. Win Class D and move up to C. Or, you can start where you want if you're confident. You also gets points for higher mileage and an older car. Have an old car with high miles? That all works in your favor.

It's a fun event (I judged Class A cars) and I think Hawk could do quite well in class E or D next year with just a bit of elbow grease. Most people drive their cars, but still do quite well at concours. Once you get the car prepped to where you want it, all you have to do is maintenance, which doesn't take that long. We even had an entrant with a 928 that did quite well in his class and he raced the car two days prior to our concours event. So, a driven car can be competitive in concours with our rules.

Smokin's article is really on the money. Anyone can do a top-side or street Concours event and be quite good at it. We had quite a few first time people do very well on their first attempt at concours. I think they surprised themselves on how easy it can be if you have the patience to clean.

Jay
90 964

Jay H

The Porsche crest on the center cap should have the tip of the crest facing the lug with the wheel lock on it, which then should line up with the valve stem. Of course, we all know you install the wheel lock on the stud with the red paint on it...



Jay
90 964