KY-91C2

Hello all:

In the month that I have owned my 91 C2, the Master Warning Light (the ! light) has never come on. My understanding is that this is suppossed to come on, along with a buzzer prior to starting the car. Also, my seat belt light never goes out. Is this indicative of some major problem? Any ideas on what I should check?

Thanks

Ron
91 C2 Cabriolet
85.5 944 NA

Jay H

Ron:

Congradulations on your 964 purchase.

Yes, the "!" light should come on when you start your car. If everything is functioning properly, the Central Warning Light will extinguish on it's own after a few seconds. If a malfunction occurs, the central warning light (!) and corresponding warning lamp will come on simultaneously.

It's been stated that malfunctioning clock circuitry can cause both the airbag and seatbelts light to come on and stay on. Hopefully others can help with more info on just the seatbelt light staying on.

Good Luck,
Jay
90 964

horst

Could be that the ! bulb is burned out. The seat belt light should have kept the ! on all the time. Check the ! bulb, and find out why the seat belt light won't go off.

KY-91C2

Thanks for the help!

I'll let you know what I find. But, now a stupid question, as I have yet to order my manuals. How does one change the Warning (!) light? If there was a thread on this earlier, let me know and I'll look there.

Ron
91 C2 Cabrio

horst

I think you just pull the instrument out, on the back the bulb is just inserted with a half twist.. BTW, you man need to turn the instrument180 degrees after it is loose, so it clears the steering colum.

Adrian

Dear Ron,
The Master Warn will come on at start for all models. Just apply the hand brake this will also bring on the Master Warn. If this does not work check the bulb. However be aware that some owners have disconnected the circuit in the past. Including removing the Gong Relay.
The seat belt warn light on my C4 does not activate the warn light because it is wired up separately. I have not checked later models. The seat belt warn light is often associated with the Airbag warn light. I would certainly be checking this circuit if the problem is not solved by replacing the bulb.
Does your warning horn work. This can be hard to check because not all warnings activate the warn horn. Handbrake for instance does not. Well not on my C4 anyway. I make these suggestions simply because I have yet to hear about a genuine bulb failure of the master warn light. The ones I have helped investigate have all been POs covering up faults,
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4

PS: There are significant differences between versions of the 964. The option and version status of your 964 needs to be established and the correct wiring diagrams used. Also need to know when exactly your C2 was built. In this case, 1991 model is not quite specific enough.

KY-91C2

Well, the master warn never comes on, and I do not get any "gong" either. the other individual warning lights seem to work, as the parking brake light lights when the brake is on, and the washer fluid light was on for awhile. I'll have to look and see if the airbag comes on when i start the car.

Is the VIN enough to determine details about what the car should be doing on start up, or should I get the info off of the model/options sticker in the trunk? Are these some details that you could help me with, Adrian?

I do plan on pulling the bulb later this week to see is that is the problem, but with the gong not gonging, I am suspecting a possible cover up by a PO.

Ron
91 C2 Cabrio

DaveK

Hi,
The gong is not supposed to sound when you switch the ignition on - only when you have a fault that the system considers serious enough to sound the gong. So when you switch the ignition on, you should see all of the warning lights on including the "!" light. But the gong is not tested at this stage, so you can only test it by forcing a "serious" fault.

Dave
90 C4

KY-91C2

Dave:

Thanks for the clarification. I'll be removing the bulb later this week, and see what I find. i was getting a bit concerned, since I didn't hear the gong. needless to say that I am glad I haven't been hearing it now!

Ron
91 C2 Cabrio

KY-91C2

Thanks for all of the help so far.

Well, I pulled the gages, and it was much easier than I had expected. I found that a plastic putty knife, carefully used, along with pulling with my second hand made the removal fairly easy.

Well, the master warning bulb had been removed. I have to check on the other bulbs (maybe they have been removed too), but I figured I'd just buy some bulbs, and finish troubleshooting all of them then.

Now, I have seen two bulbs, a 1.5 watt and a 0.9 watt. Am I correct is assuming that the 0.9 watt is for the status lights, and the 1.5 watt bulbs are for lighting the gages at night? I also assume that the master warning bulb should be 0.9 watt. If I am mistaken, please let me know.

I will be interested to see if the airbag bulb has been removed, too.

Ron
91 C2 Cabrio

Adrian

Dear Dave,
There is a Gong and there is a Warning Alarm. The gong is set up for various models to "ping" when certain functions or actions occur such as opening the door, leaving the lights on. It is also used to activate the Warn Alarm for functions which are not fed through the central informer, such as airbag failures.
The Master Alarm Warn horn will activate when certain warns "only" are activated. This can vary due to alarm type installed, national requirements etc. Part number of the central informer will help a little bit.
You are correct when you say the Gong will not "normally" come on when you turn on the ignition.
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4

PS: The gong and the warn horn in reality are the same horn but activation is electronically controlled and the output sound is different.

Adrian

Dear Ron,
If the Master Warn Light is removed and you are getting the Warn Horn I bet that you will find the airbag warn light has been removed from the clock as well. This would be the third or fourth time I have seen this.
You should pull the clock but ensure you have a dealer nearby who has a Bosch Hammer because you will need to reset the Airbag system.
The other light I have seen removed is the ABS warn light,
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4

PS: This Master Warn light has been removed by the PO to cover up a fault in the 964 which he or she did not want to or could not fix.

DaveK

Hi Adrian,
Thanks for the clarification - I assumed that the gong was the warning alarm. Part of my confusion comes from the fact that I don't seem to have a gong - if I open the doors with the lights on, no gong. I've had the warning alarm go off when the ABS / traction lights stayed on once but never had a gong. I've also heard people mention that after switching the ignition off, some circuits remain active until the doors open / close so that you can still close the windows etc. Mine doesn't allow this either.

Dave
90 C4

Adrian

Dear Dave,
You are not alone. My C4 is also not wired for the gong to work. The story about systems remaining wired until the doors ar eopened is not accurate. The only circuit in which door position has any role is purely the power windows. With the door open they are not supposed to work. This is purely a relay function getting an earth from the door switch. Personally I prefer the windows to work all the time. If your windows still roll down with the door open, this means either the earth is missing to the power window regulator or the regulator has failed in this function. As I said for me I do not care,
Ciao,
Adrian
911C4

KY-91C2

Adrian:

I never get a gong or ping. And, sure enough, the airbag light is missing, as well as the rear spoiler light, and the convertable top indicator light.

I'm going to see if the local auto parts store carries the bulbs, then replace them and see what happens.

After I replace the bulbs, and if any stay on, then I would need to see a local shop that has the "Hammer", correct? I am assuming that I can still drive the car, just with those "faulty" systems not active, and the fault warning lights illuminated.

And then once the lights are reset, I'll know if I need to troubleshoot any of the systems, correct?

Also, are all of the fault indicator lights 0.9 watt (blue back)?

Thanks,

Ron
91 C2 Cabrio