Gary R.

A buddy of mine is looking for a 964 and has found a few but it seems that some have had most the "964 gotchas" fixed but not all. The three main things I know about are:

Head leaks (90 and 91 cars only?) - Originally had no head gasket, not Porshes best idea. Also seem to have problems with cylinder-crankcase seal. About a $5K fix from what I read. I'm just not sure that, if the car has 70-80K on it and it isn't leaking (and has never been worked on) is it something to worry about?

Dual-Mass flywheel - Hang-grenades rubber into the clutch mechanism. Also has a bolt on ring gear (great thinking!). This was normally replaced using a LUK with welded on gear.

Distributor problem - Supposedly not vented well causing drive belt to crap out. Not a biggie, would be GLAD to put new belt in.

If you know of a nice car please let me know. He is looking in the $25K and under range... and is tired of black, but could be swayed.

Thanks

Marc Shaw

Even if they have not all been fixed, as long as he knows about them, he can use the fact he faces a repair bill to correct them to bargain down the price. Just because these issues have not been fixed does not mean that they can't be fixed.

Marc

Gary R.

Thanks Marc, I certainly understand that but when the owner insists there is no problem because the heads don't leak (yet) or the flywheel doesn't clunk (yet) its another story.. I would tend to agree about the heads but I just would like to hear from people that have been there...

Kahdmus

Hi Gary, the point marc is making is that you should never buy without a thorough PPI. next point is that once the PPI is done dont necassarily pass on a car because it has some issues. Use the PPI to discount the purchase price and take care of the problems in this manner. If the seller wont budge, then walk away. These ARE 15 year old cars after all! :-)

Cheers,

Gary R.

A PPI is mandatory, that is understood. The point I was making is that if the owner believes there IS no problem then he won't budge $$$, and its understandable. My biggest concern is IF a non-leaking head on an untouched 1990 or 1991 90K mile 964 is something worth worrying about enough to be a deal killer on a nice car. Seems to me if it was going to leak it would have by now, and a top end rebuild is going to be due aroud 150K + or so anyway and it (head gasket conversion) can be done then...

So, is ANYONE running a 90 or 91 with high miles without top end work being done (without issues)?

Hope that clarrfies my thoughts some..

DarrylH

Was a thread a while ago about high mile cars, can't seem to find it just now. But yeah, I've got almost 130k miles on a 90 C2, no engine work as yet, drips a spot of oil a week or so, and not from the heads, according to my mechanic. Original clutch replaced last summer at about 125k. A well cared for high miler can be a good buy. An abused or neglected car, regardless of distance travelled, can be trouble. But I wouldn't shun the early models just because they're early. It's just another factor in the decision, and obviously, YMMV. Best of luck.

Marc Shaw

You mean: https://rennlist.com/forums/964-forum/185278-who-has-the-most-miles-on-their-original-964-motor.html



I have a 1991 C4 with 57k miles. Clutch replaced and DMF changed to LUK at about 45k miles (by PO). Has 2-3 oil drips/day, I think from oil return lines, not from head - top-end rebuild never done. Put the dual dist. vent kit in myself in and took about 45 minutes.

PPI is the way to go, no question. If issues are identified and the seller won't negotiate, then walk away.

Marc

msrc2

I have a 1991 C2 5 speed for sale...39,xxx original miles. I'm the second owner. This car has just been serviced, and I had a PPI done for my own information. It's a real strong runner, and in X-cellent condition. Let me know if you'd like some further info.

Gary R.

Hunter, please PM me with details, asking price, etc.. That is a beautiful example of a 964!

msrc2

If anyone is interested in my 1991 964, please e-mail me at:: msrc2@bellsouth.net

Johnny G Pipe

[QUOTE=Gary R.]
So, is ANYONE running a 90 or 91 with high miles without top end work being done (without issues)?[QUOTE]


Lots of people as you can tell! - myself included.
('90 MY, '89 registered, 101k miles, original flywheel, no engine work, 1 or two drips occasionally - runs well, stock power on the dynamometer)

Forums blow these problems out of proportion - after surfing this board for 4 years, it seems to me that for 964's to have the horrendous leaks that require re-builds is perhaps in reality about as common as RMS problems on the watercooled cars?

The dist. belt is simply a preventative maintenance issue.

Love the 997!

McJohn

Let me add to what Johnny G Pipe just said (albeit with my fingers crossed)

I have just bought a 1990 Carrera 2, having broken all the rules by buying it without a PPI, and with almost no history. My gut reaction told me it was good car, so I went with that. Now begins the task of discovering exactly what I have bought.

It has done 97k miles, and almost certainly the engine has never been opened, hence it is original flywheel, and untouched heads. Like Johnnys, there is a very small drip of oil visible at two of the six head areas, but my specialist who checked it over for me assures me it is nothing to worry about. After all, it has managed nearly 100k miles without it being an issue. The flywheel works perfectly too. He also removed the distributor, checked the belt thoroughly, and pronounced it in perfect condition, and it had certainly never been changed.

The front calipers were partly seized, but were easliy fixed, and a set of pads and two new front disks have transformed the braking, as you might expect. A cursory glance suggests the suspension settings are way out, so I'm going back next week for a full alignment set up. I hope that cures the decidedly twitchy handling and stability, as the car has been lowered at some point, but perhaps without due attention to geometry.

I appreciate that something unforseen might go wrong tomorrow, but that's a risk you take with any car, PPI or no PPI. Always remember that bad news travels faster on forums than good news ever does, and as a result I feel that the deadly sins of the early 964's have been perhaps over magnified.

Do NOT of course buy a car that you have suspicions about, but on the other hand, don't get too paranoid either. (fingers still firmly crossed of course!)

John H

Gary R.

Sage advice guys. I think that, as in all situations, a "little" knowledge can be a dangerous thing. Leffingwell's and Zimmermann's books on used Porsches are GREAT for pointing out faults (and strengths) of all the different Porsches but in doing so they lay the grounds for great trepidation when looking at a used car. Usually, and in my buddy's case, the $20+ K outlay is a pretty heavy hit and the fear of an engine top end blowing ($7K) or a flywheel ($3K) is daunting. The "logic" is if a car has 50, 60, 120K miles on it and is all original it will be fine but the "BOOKS" don't say that. They just say to be sure that the problem areas have been addressed. I've heard from enough here to be totally confident in a properly performed PPI, the records and the obvious condition of the car and that's what i'm going to go by, not by the "what if" scenarios. This was just reinforced by a P-Car wrench that I greatly respect. His advice was that if the work was done, great... if not and all is well don't worry about it.. sounds good to me!

Schuey

this one is CHEAP and a 1993

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...544703407&rd=1

best of luck...no affiliation...

Kevin

aeronautica86

thats not a 993...and for a car with 113K miles and auto tranny I think the price is about in line maybe a tad high...