RS/RSR short throw shifter in C4
02-25-2003, 04:54 PM
#1
Instructor
Thread Starter
RS/RSR short throw shifter in C4
I recently bought a "RSR" short throw shifter for my 1991 C4. Advertised to fit 89-94 C2/C4 I figured it would be an easy upgrade. The guy I bought it from said it would be a two hour installation.
Any insight is appreciated.
Today I lifted the vehicle and removed the tunnel cover fully prepared to complete the job. What I found was a different assembly than what the installation instructions showed and what I saw on PET. The front guide rod in pet is mounted on a bracket that you modify to retain the new rod. On the C4 the rod is attached to the drive shaft tube and it cannot be modified to fit the new part. The shifter is mounted to a retaining bracket on the C2 on my C4 the bracket also supports the drive shaft. The instructions have you relocating the bracket by rotating it 180 degrees. I don't see how that is possible. So, I need to hear from someone else who can state that it doesn't work or tell me what I'm missing.
I've read the previous threads and tried the links provided by Bill Gregory, but don't see any shifter install info there?
Thanks,
Bill
Any insight is appreciated.
Today I lifted the vehicle and removed the tunnel cover fully prepared to complete the job. What I found was a different assembly than what the installation instructions showed and what I saw on PET. The front guide rod in pet is mounted on a bracket that you modify to retain the new rod. On the C4 the rod is attached to the drive shaft tube and it cannot be modified to fit the new part. The shifter is mounted to a retaining bracket on the C2 on my C4 the bracket also supports the drive shaft. The instructions have you relocating the bracket by rotating it 180 degrees. I don't see how that is possible. So, I need to hear from someone else who can state that it doesn't work or tell me what I'm missing.
I've read the previous threads and tried the links provided by Bill Gregory, but don't see any shifter install info there?
Thanks,
Bill
02-25-2003, 10:15 PM
#2
Technical Specialist
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva"><strong>I've read the previous threads and tried the links provided by Bill Gregory, but don't see any shifter install info there?
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Check the Schatz Motorsports site <a href="http://www.schatzmotorsport.com/Merchant2/index.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=78650&Product_Code=150SKX&Category_Code= 354" target="_blank">here</a>, and page down to the footnote about C4 installation.
Wasn't clear if you found the text and pics were missing, so here's the original article and pics:
Installation of Carrera RS shift lever
I wanted to install a shorter shift, so I started by surveying the marketplace. Porsche, RUF, Weltmeister/Performance Products, FVD, and Cargraphics all have 964 short shift kits, with prices ranging from $75 to over $520! All include the shift lever and fork, and some also include a guide tube. I opted for the least cost option, the Porsche solution from the 964 Carrera RS. The two parts needed are the shift lever (964.424.015.08) and fork (964.424.017.01). I also replaced the 4 plastic sleeves (999.924.002.40) that the fork swivels on, although the existing sleeves probably could have been reused. List on the parts is $98, however, I purchased them from Reeves Porsche in Tampa for $75. When I ordered them, I figured the RS parts would have to come from Germany, however, all parts were stocked in the US. There is also a Carrera RS shift **** and skirt (964.424.075.03 color 1AJ), however, it only comes in black, and my stock shift **** skirt had enough material that it works with the increased shift lever height.
I don’t know if the Porsche RS short shift lever will work on C4’s. FVD’s website suggests the C4 installation is the same as the 90-91 C2.
The RS shifter's lever travel is 10mm shorter than the stock shifter (52mm vs 62mm), a 16% improvement. On 92-94 C2's, the shift **** is moved to the left 10mm and is 28mm higher than the stock 964 shifter, making it easier to get to from the steering wheel. 90-91 C2's would have the shift **** at the same height, as they don't have the adjustable guide tubes that were introduced in 1992. 90-91 C2’s will, however, get the benefit of the shorter shift lever travel.
Pictured below are the stock shift lever and fork on the left, and the RS shift lever and fork on the right. You can see where the 28mm additional height comes from, as well as that the fulcrum point is different on the RS parts.
<img src="http://members.rennlist.com/sansho/DSC00710a.JPG" alt=" - " />
This should probably be about a 2-3 hour project. However, I took longer, as I was poking around here and there. Also found a pan at the front (which has to be removed) had flaking paint and was rusting, so I prepared and painted it with POR-15. The process to swap the shifter and fork is pretty straightforward, if you have a 92-94 C2. If you have a 90-91 C2, it's a little bit more involved (see either Mike Schatz's web site at <a href="http://www.schatzmotorsport.com" target="_blank">www.schatzmotorsport.com</a> or FVD at <a href="http://www.fvd-usa.com" target="_blank">www.fvd-usa.com</a> or <a href="http://www.fvd.de" target="_blank">www.fvd.de</a> for directions).
Here's the basic procedure -
First, most of the work is done from under the car. It starts, however, in the interior, where you remove the shift ****. In order to remove it, there are about a dozen screws that need to be removed. Start at the back by the cassette holders, and then pull out the cassette holders, revealing 4 more screws. Then moving towards the front, there's a small screw under the hand brake lever. Pull the plastic piece under the lever out, and there are another 4 screws. Now at the front, pull out the two panels, revealing two more screws. At this point, you should be able to remove the console, revealing the underside of the shift ****. You'll see a 3-4" rubber sleeve extending from the **** down the shift lever. Work it up until it comes off, and with it the ****/skirt/console. Set it all aside. You're now done in the cabin, however, you may be tempted, as I was, to remove the rubber bellows to see what's below. I'll save you the trouble....
<img src="http://members.rennlist.com/sansho/DSC00708a.JPG" alt=" - " />
You see the aluminum guide piece, the tube it slides on, and the shift lever. Despite the picture, if you do pull the bellows out, note you'll need to use some sort of sealant when you put it back, to keep grime out of the shift mechanism. I used rubber weather seal cement.
From underneath, it's pretty straight forward. After removing the metal tunnel cover, unhook and turn the rubber cover to the side, and separate the guide tube from shifter. Then remove the rubber cover from the guide tube (note: I'd leave it on the gear shift rod that disappears into the transmission). Disassemble the gear shift rod from the fork. Remove the 4 bolts in the aluminum guide piece, and the shift lever assembly will drop down. Replace the stock parts with the RS parts. Use a light coat of lithium grease under the plastic sleeves. Before putting it back, look on both ends of the metal tube, and you'll see a yellowish rubber gasket holding each end (92-94 models). You'll need to turn both 180 degrees to move the tube up higher, which keeps everything aligned. Just about done. Put the bottom of your 964 back together. Now back into the cabin. Put the shift **** rubber sleeve on the shift lever and work it down until the shift **** is on solidly. Note it won't go down as far as the stock shift lever, due to the additional height of the RS shift lever. Put the console back together, and you're done!
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Check the Schatz Motorsports site <a href="http://www.schatzmotorsport.com/Merchant2/index.mv?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=78650&Product_Code=150SKX&Category_Code= 354" target="_blank">here</a>, and page down to the footnote about C4 installation.
Wasn't clear if you found the text and pics were missing, so here's the original article and pics:
Installation of Carrera RS shift lever
I wanted to install a shorter shift, so I started by surveying the marketplace. Porsche, RUF, Weltmeister/Performance Products, FVD, and Cargraphics all have 964 short shift kits, with prices ranging from $75 to over $520! All include the shift lever and fork, and some also include a guide tube. I opted for the least cost option, the Porsche solution from the 964 Carrera RS. The two parts needed are the shift lever (964.424.015.08) and fork (964.424.017.01). I also replaced the 4 plastic sleeves (999.924.002.40) that the fork swivels on, although the existing sleeves probably could have been reused. List on the parts is $98, however, I purchased them from Reeves Porsche in Tampa for $75. When I ordered them, I figured the RS parts would have to come from Germany, however, all parts were stocked in the US. There is also a Carrera RS shift **** and skirt (964.424.075.03 color 1AJ), however, it only comes in black, and my stock shift **** skirt had enough material that it works with the increased shift lever height.
I don’t know if the Porsche RS short shift lever will work on C4’s. FVD’s website suggests the C4 installation is the same as the 90-91 C2.
The RS shifter's lever travel is 10mm shorter than the stock shifter (52mm vs 62mm), a 16% improvement. On 92-94 C2's, the shift **** is moved to the left 10mm and is 28mm higher than the stock 964 shifter, making it easier to get to from the steering wheel. 90-91 C2's would have the shift **** at the same height, as they don't have the adjustable guide tubes that were introduced in 1992. 90-91 C2’s will, however, get the benefit of the shorter shift lever travel.
Pictured below are the stock shift lever and fork on the left, and the RS shift lever and fork on the right. You can see where the 28mm additional height comes from, as well as that the fulcrum point is different on the RS parts.
<img src="http://members.rennlist.com/sansho/DSC00710a.JPG" alt=" - " />
This should probably be about a 2-3 hour project. However, I took longer, as I was poking around here and there. Also found a pan at the front (which has to be removed) had flaking paint and was rusting, so I prepared and painted it with POR-15. The process to swap the shifter and fork is pretty straightforward, if you have a 92-94 C2. If you have a 90-91 C2, it's a little bit more involved (see either Mike Schatz's web site at <a href="http://www.schatzmotorsport.com" target="_blank">www.schatzmotorsport.com</a> or FVD at <a href="http://www.fvd-usa.com" target="_blank">www.fvd-usa.com</a> or <a href="http://www.fvd.de" target="_blank">www.fvd.de</a> for directions).
Here's the basic procedure -
First, most of the work is done from under the car. It starts, however, in the interior, where you remove the shift ****. In order to remove it, there are about a dozen screws that need to be removed. Start at the back by the cassette holders, and then pull out the cassette holders, revealing 4 more screws. Then moving towards the front, there's a small screw under the hand brake lever. Pull the plastic piece under the lever out, and there are another 4 screws. Now at the front, pull out the two panels, revealing two more screws. At this point, you should be able to remove the console, revealing the underside of the shift ****. You'll see a 3-4" rubber sleeve extending from the **** down the shift lever. Work it up until it comes off, and with it the ****/skirt/console. Set it all aside. You're now done in the cabin, however, you may be tempted, as I was, to remove the rubber bellows to see what's below. I'll save you the trouble....
<img src="http://members.rennlist.com/sansho/DSC00708a.JPG" alt=" - " />
You see the aluminum guide piece, the tube it slides on, and the shift lever. Despite the picture, if you do pull the bellows out, note you'll need to use some sort of sealant when you put it back, to keep grime out of the shift mechanism. I used rubber weather seal cement.
From underneath, it's pretty straight forward. After removing the metal tunnel cover, unhook and turn the rubber cover to the side, and separate the guide tube from shifter. Then remove the rubber cover from the guide tube (note: I'd leave it on the gear shift rod that disappears into the transmission). Disassemble the gear shift rod from the fork. Remove the 4 bolts in the aluminum guide piece, and the shift lever assembly will drop down. Replace the stock parts with the RS parts. Use a light coat of lithium grease under the plastic sleeves. Before putting it back, look on both ends of the metal tube, and you'll see a yellowish rubber gasket holding each end (92-94 models). You'll need to turn both 180 degrees to move the tube up higher, which keeps everything aligned. Just about done. Put the bottom of your 964 back together. Now back into the cabin. Put the shift **** rubber sleeve on the shift lever and work it down until the shift **** is on solidly. Note it won't go down as far as the stock shift lever, due to the additional height of the RS shift lever. Put the console back together, and you're done!
02-26-2003, 12:17 AM
#3
Instructor
Thread Starter
Thanks Bill,
The pictures appeared this time and after noticing the asterisk on the liked web site I can see that the C4 installation does not raise the lever in the passenger compartment like on the C2, it instead sticks out the bottom where you have to modify the pan for clearance. Very helpful! Thank you!
When you refer to removing the four screws in the guide is that necessary for the shifter to slide out because of limited clearance? I can't see where the part is attached to the shifter.
Assuming that "guide tube" refers to the third optional part of the kit.
Second question is: Did you notice how the bracket that supports the "guide tube" is mounted on a C2? The third part "guide tube" of my system is supposed to be mounted to a bracket toward the front of the car. On the C4 they mount the "guide tube" to the drive shaft tube. I don't know what the advantage of the third part "guide tube" is, but might be able to install it by ordering the bracket from the dealer and installing it on the car. I just need to see where it goes and how it attaches.
If anyone has a picture of their shifter front "guide tube" and how it attaches to the vehicle it will really help me out. I'm assuming the additional part has some additional value.
My system is a ProTechnik and the rods are bolted to the shafts unlike
The pictures appeared this time and after noticing the asterisk on the liked web site I can see that the C4 installation does not raise the lever in the passenger compartment like on the C2, it instead sticks out the bottom where you have to modify the pan for clearance. Very helpful! Thank you!
When you refer to removing the four screws in the guide is that necessary for the shifter to slide out because of limited clearance? I can't see where the part is attached to the shifter.
Assuming that "guide tube" refers to the third optional part of the kit.
Second question is: Did you notice how the bracket that supports the "guide tube" is mounted on a C2? The third part "guide tube" of my system is supposed to be mounted to a bracket toward the front of the car. On the C4 they mount the "guide tube" to the drive shaft tube. I don't know what the advantage of the third part "guide tube" is, but might be able to install it by ordering the bracket from the dealer and installing it on the car. I just need to see where it goes and how it attaches.
If anyone has a picture of their shifter front "guide tube" and how it attaches to the vehicle it will really help me out. I'm assuming the additional part has some additional value.
My system is a ProTechnik and the rods are bolted to the shafts unlike
02-26-2003, 08:45 AM
#4
Technical Specialist
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Rennlist
Lifetime Member
Bill,
The guide tube I referred to is the pipe the shift mechanism slides on. On the C2, the forward pointing guide rod looks as it's shown in PET. I didn't swap out, or do anything to, the forward pointing guiding rod (although I may replace the shift rod that goes back to the transmission with the 993RS version). I only used those parts that Porsche identified as being specific to the 964 RS.
The guide tube I referred to is the pipe the shift mechanism slides on. On the C2, the forward pointing guide rod looks as it's shown in PET. I didn't swap out, or do anything to, the forward pointing guiding rod (although I may replace the shift rod that goes back to the transmission with the 993RS version). I only used those parts that Porsche identified as being specific to the 964 RS.
